Fatman Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 The link to Linehan is disturbing but consider this: 3) Every succesful QB is linked to stud receivers (Palmer to Johnson, Manning to Harrison & Wayne, etc.) Two words for you: Drew Brees - There is always an exception like Brady, but Brees was throwing to Antonio Gates! Nuff said [/b] Not enough said...Hasselbeck, Green and Favre (other than Javon Walker for a year) have hardly had what you'd call a stud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FishFreak Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 Right. Chambers and Booker and Brown are better than Moss, Cris Carter and Robert Smith. Uh, I was thinking more recent...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crispy Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 It sounds to me like you are a blind homer just looking for any way to justify your optimistic outlook for Miami. That's fine as a fan in the NFL, but it doesn't work out too well as an owner in Fantasy Football. You need to be a lot more objective than that. DING! DING! DING! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Sure I'm a biased Miami fan but you guys are missing a very big point. Culpepper can be had late in most drafts and right now he's usually anywhere from the 7-10th QB taken off the board. That is a potentially great value pick that won't kill your team in a year when the QB position is deep as hell. If he stinks like last year or re-injures his knee you can always find a quality QB back-up. He's well worth taking the risk on. Maybe as a backup, but there's no way in hell that I'd draft him as a starter. As was mentioned earlier, he absolutely sucked without Moss and Linehan. I mean, he made Brad Johnson look like Tom Brady. And a QB whose success has been so heavily-dependent upon scrambling is going to take a huge hit in productivity being less than a year removed from tearing the trifecta of knee ligaments. I'll tell you what, if Daunte is still available in the 10th round of my draft on Sunday, I'll gladly pick him up as my backup. That's about where he should go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Jesus Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 (edited) Daunte Culpepper vs Dolphin QB's since 2000 Completion % CPepp = 64.4 Dolphins QB's = 56.4 Passing YPG CPepp = 252.00 Dolphin QB's = 197.6 TD-INT CPepp = 135-86 Dolphin QB's = 111-112 Passer Rating CPepp = 91.5 Dolphin QB's = 72.8 CPepp has the highest career comp. pct. in NFL History. (minimum 2500 att.) A HUGH upgrade for the Dolphins AND he has a very good supporting cast. Did he ever have anyone as good as Ronnie Brown to hand the ball off to in Minnesota? Did he ever have a TE as good as McMichael in Minnesota? Edited August 9, 2006 by Fantasy Jesus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Def. Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 (edited) Right. Chambers and Booker and Brown are better than Moss, Cris Carter and Robert Smith. Not to add fuel to the fire...but Carter and Smith were gone in 04' when he posted his best stats. Randy Moss wasn't even the leading receiver on that team that year. I still think Culpepper will be average at best though. Edited August 9, 2006 by Def. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 (edited) Sure I'm a biased Miami fan but you guys are missing a very big point. Culpepper can be had late in most drafts and right now he's usually anywhere from the 7-10th QB taken off the board. That is a potentially great value pick that won't kill your team in a year when the QB position is deep as hell. If he stinks like last year or re-injures his knee you can always find a quality QB back-up. He's well worth taking the risk on. You are cracking me up this morning. There is absolutely NO WAY anybody should draft Culpepper to be their starting QB, period. There are way too many negatives and unknowns surrounding his NFL career right now. Personally I'm not really that interested in taking a flyer on him as a backup to my starting QB but can certainly understand those that might choose to do that. I will wager you right now that Culpepper will not finish in the top 10 of QBs this year meaning he will NOT be a "great value pick" in the middle rounds. And I don't know what league YOU play in ... but "you can always find a quality QB back-up" if he gets hurt doesn't apply to ANY of the leagues I am in. So if you are willing to bet let's bet next year's membership fees: Culpepper finishes in the top 10 of QBs using fairly standard performance scoring from THIS LEAUGE I pay your 2007 Huddle membership fee. If he finishes out of the top 10 you may my membership fee. No injury clause. Edited August 9, 2006 by Grits and Shins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Jesus Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Culpepper finishes in the top 10 of QBs using fairly standard performance scoring from THIS LEAUGE I pay your 2007 Huddle membership fee. If he finishes out of the top 10 you may my membership fee. Sniffs bait and swims away but that sure is tempting. If Fishfreak declines the bet I might be interseted although my record here with Huddle bets might be the worst in the history of the Huddle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Los Gigantes Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 You are cracking me up this morning. There is absolutely NO WAY anybody should draft Culpepper to be their starting QB, period. There are way too many negatives and unknowns surrounding his NFL career right now. Personally I'm not really that interested in taking a flyer on him as a backup to my starting QB but can certainly understand those that might choose to do that. I will wager you right now that Culpepper will not finish in the top 10 of QBs this year meaning he will NOT be a "great value pick" in the middle rounds. And I don't know what league YOU play in ... but "you can always find a quality QB back-up" if he gets hurt doesn't apply to ANY of the leagues I am in. So if you are willing to bet let's bet next year's membership fees: Culpepper finishes in the top 10 of QBs using fairly standard performance scoring from THIS LEAUGE I pay your 2007 Huddle membership fee. If he finishes out of the top 10 you may my membership fee. I'll take that bet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msaint Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 These words shoud scare the hell out of Fins fans and anyone with a Fin on their fantasy team: OC Mike Mularkey He absolutely had no idea how to use his ONLY viable weapon last year, McGahee. No clue. Worries me re: Ronnie Brown. Hope Saban keeps Mularkey in a cage on gameday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Jesus Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I'll take that bet. And there it is. It's on like Donkey King. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Jesus Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 OC Mike Mularkey He absolutely had no idea how to use his ONLY viable weapon last year, McGahee. No clue. Worries me re: Ronnie Brown. Hope Saban keeps Mularkey in a cage on gameday. So the fact that the Bills had JP Losman as a QB and a terrible Oline doesn't factor into this? Mularkey seemd to run the ball just fine when he was the offensive coordinator with the Steelers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msaint Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 So the fact that the Bills had JP Losman as a QB and a terrible Oline doesn't factor into this? Mularkey seemd to run the ball just fine when he was the offensive coordinator with the Steelers. the sh*tty qb and line absolutely factored in...as did mularkey's idiotic penchant for calling three straight pass plays on 1st and goal from the three. brutal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spain Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I am concerned that Culpepper will be a bust primarily because there are so many navigateable waterways in south Florida... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonorator Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 culpepper is a very intriguing backup QB this season. i'd gladly take a chance on him as my #2. anything more is just not smart fantasy football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt770 Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Sure I'm a biased Miami fan but you guys are missing a very big point. Culpepper can be had late in most drafts and right now he's usually anywhere from the 7-10th QB taken off the board. That is a potentially great value pick that won't kill your team in a year when the QB position is deep as hell. If he stinks like last year or re-injures his knee you can always find a quality QB back-up. He's well worth taking the risk on. Considering the points raised earlier, if he's the 7th to 10th QB off the board, that makes him a fantasy starter for someone, and a risky one at that. I don't want to be that owner. I like him only as a backup to a top tier QB with a late bye. His upside will only be realized in the latter half of the season IMO. I see him struggling early because of the knee and the new surroundings and would not want to rely on him at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FishFreak Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 You are cracking me up this morning. There is absolutely NO WAY anybody should draft Culpepper to be their starting QB, period. There are way too many negatives and unknowns surrounding his NFL career right now. Personally I'm not really that interested in taking a flyer on him as a backup to my starting QB but can certainly understand those that might choose to do that. I will wager you right now that Culpepper will not finish in the top 10 of QBs this year meaning he will NOT be a "great value pick" in the middle rounds. And I don't know what league YOU play in ... but "you can always find a quality QB back-up" if he gets hurt doesn't apply to ANY of the leagues I am in. So if you are willing to bet let's bet next year's membership fees: Culpepper finishes in the top 10 of QBs using fairly standard performance scoring from THIS LEAUGE I pay your 2007 Huddle membership fee. If he finishes out of the top 10 you may my membership fee. I can't possibly back down from that bet. You're on! The Fish will go as far as he takes us. Just to clarify my point of finding a quality back-up pretty easily assuming a 12 team league: The top 12 QB's (according to the huddle) are: Manning- Stud Brady- lost Givens and Branch is unhappy Palmer (Even more of a health risk than Culpepper) E. Manning- Has the weapons but stunk in the 2nd half last year Hasselback- solid performer Bledsoe- should be much better with TO Bulger- injury prone McNabb- No TO Brooks- Shaky Plummer- Shaky Green- Getting old Warner- Injury prone If Culpepper stumbles there are several back-up options that could easily out-perform the bottom half of the so-called "top 12": Vick Culpepper Delhomme Favre Leftwich McNair Roethilesberger Brees *Usually 1-2 QB's that come out of no where You don't need a stud QB to win championships especially if you can land a sleeper late. The QB position is deep with a lot of parity. Outside of Manning, QB2-20 aren't that far apart. And that makes drafting Culpepper a small risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I can't possibly back down from that bet. You're on! The Fish will go as far as he takes us. Just to clarify my point of finding a quality back-up pretty easily assuming a 12 team league: The top 12 QB's (according to the huddle) are: Manning- Stud Brady- lost Givens and Branch is unhappy Palmer (Even more of a health risk than Culpepper) E. Manning- Has the weapons but stunk in the 2nd half last year Hasselback- solid performer Bledsoe- should be much better with TO Bulger- injury prone McNabb- No TO Brooks- Shaky Plummer- Shaky Green- Getting old Warner- Injury prone If Culpepper stumbles there are several back-up options that could easily out-perform the bottom half of the so-called "top 12": Vick Culpepper Delhomme Favre Leftwich McNair Roethilesberger Brees *Usually 1-2 QB's that come out of no where You don't need a stud QB to win championships especially if you can land a sleeper late. The QB position is deep with a lot of parity. Outside of Manning, QB2-20 aren't that far apart. And that makes drafting Culpepper a small risk. You are on ... no injury clause. Part of the reason I believe DC won't be a top 10 QB is because of how soon he intends to return. And None of those QBs you have listed will be available in any of my leagues after the draft ... so again I don't know what league you are playing in where you expect all of them to be available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Did he ever have anyone as good as Ronnie Brown to hand the ball off to in Minnesota? Did he ever have a TE as good as McMichael in Minnesota? I would say that Robert Smith was as good of an option if not a better option than Brown. In 5 years that may change, but as of right now, I would say it holds water. And not to rain on your parade, but 600 yards and 3 or 4 TD's doesn't put McMichael in stud status. Wiggins, by no means a top TE, had 705 yards and 4 TD's in '04, so I guess I'd have to answer your question with a "yes". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FishFreak Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 You are on ... no injury clause. Part of the reason I believe DC won't be a top 10 QB is because of how soon he intends to return. And None of those QBs you have listed will be available in any of my leagues after the draft ... so again I don't know what league you are playing in where you expect all of them to be available. I didn't say anything about those QB's being available after the draft. I said back-ups. I'm assuming you do draft two QB's so many of those guys give or take will be available in later rounds. Like I said, Culpepper is a worthwhile risk if you get him late because you can still get a decent back-up with this years deep QB field. And please stop acting like you play in some super high powered league and I'm some clown in an abc league with no clue. I'm simply trying to make a point. You're more than welcome to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMD Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Daunte Culpepper vs Dolphin QB's since 2000 Completion % CPepp = 64.4 Dolphins QB's = 56.4 Mularkey QBs = 58% Passing YPG CPepp = 252.00 Dolphin QB's = 197.6 Mularkey QBs = 206.3 TD-INT CPepp = 135-86 Dolphin QB's = 111-112 Mularkey QBs = 100-84 Did he ever have anyone as good as Ronnie Brown to hand the ball off to in Minnesota? 2003 - Vikes ranked 4th in rush yards, 6th in YPC 2002 - Vikes ranked 1rst in rush yards, 1rst in YPC, 2nd in rush TD Michael bennett did run for 1300 yards before and Moe Williams had scored up to 11 TDs in a year MIN used RBBC, so individual runners were not huge. Not that I don't like Brown (I do) but he only had 907 yards last year and a 4.4 YPC. Not sure how Brown is a bigger boost to CPep than what his ground game gave him in MIN. Did he ever have a TE as good as McMichael in Minnesota? Mularkey QBs = 203 yards highest ever. He has never used them much. In PIT, TE's never had more than 2 TDs per season combined. Just not his style. Long as we are playing with numbers... Culpepper with OC Linehan and WR Randy Moss (Per GM Avg) 22 of 34 (65%) for 262 yards, 1.8 TD and 1 Int, 6 runs for 31 yards and 0.4 rush TD Culpepper without OC Linehan or WR Randy Moss (Per Gm Avg) 20 of 31 for 223 yards, 1 TD, 2 INT, 3 runs for 21 yards and 0 rushing TD Culpepper with OC Linehan and WR Randy Moss (Per Year Avg) 336 of 518 for 4018 yards, 27 TD and 15 Int, 89 runs for 406 yards and 5 rushing TDs Extrapolating 7 games into 16 338 of 525 for 3789 yards, 17 TD and 29 Int, 56 runs for 359 yards and 2 rushing TDs Of course Culpepper has a bum knee, is no lock to play week one and has a whole new team, scheme and set of receivers to consider this year, so it is not a 1:1 comparison with last year during his 7th season with the Vikings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzac Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Intriguing debate - I must say that Fishfreak has held his own on several points that I thought he'd get killed on. IMO (and in many others' as well, apparently), C-Pep's effectiveness relies almost entirely on his mobility. That said, I'd like to grab him as a POTENTIAL starter for my squad this year (I'm not huge on drafting QBs early, unless I can get one of the surefire studs - which don't seem to really exist this year). I'll grab C-Pep and one of the other lesser QBs with upside (e.g. Kitna, Leftwich, Warner, etc.) and bank on the fact that one of them will be a passable fantasy QB. I'd rather load up on stronger options at RB/WR than spend an early-midrounder on a shaky QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzac Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I didn't say anything about those QB's being available after the draft. I said back-ups. I'm assuming you do draft two QB's so many of those guys give or take will be available in later rounds. Like I said, Culpepper is a worthwhile risk if you get him late because you can still get a decent back-up with this years deep QB field. And please stop acting like you play in some super high powered league and I'm some clown in an abc league with no clue. I'm simply trying to make a point. You're more than welcome to disagree. word of advice - ignore all patronizing sarcasm directed at you from Grits (you'll save yourself some time if you do). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FishFreak Posted August 9, 2006 Author Share Posted August 9, 2006 Intriguing debate - I must say that Fishfreak has held his own on several points that I thought he'd get killed on. IMO (and in many others' as well, apparently), C-Pep's effectiveness relies almost entirely on his mobility. That said, I'd like to grab him as a POTENTIAL starter for my squad this year (I'm not huge on drafting QBs early, unless I can get one of the surefire studs - which don't seem to really exist this year). I'll grab C-Pep and one of the other lesser QBs with upside (e.g. Kitna, Leftwich, Warner, etc.) and bank on the fact that one of them will be a passable fantasy QB. I'd rather load up on stronger options at RB/WR than spend an early-midrounder on a shaky QB. You've summed up what I've been saying all along in one paragraph! Maybe now all these Culpepper haters will see the light AND the logical draft strategy I've been sharing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 word of advice - ignore all patronizing sarcasm directed at you from Grits (you'll save yourself some time if you do). For once, Balzac is wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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