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Batch 1-0, Roethlisberger 0-2


KevinL
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I didn't make one single argument regarding Ben. I dont think he's doing anything wrong. He's human. Go figure. He not destined to go 1300 wins and 5 losses by the end of his hall of fame career. What a shock.

Now he's being leaned on more due to the losses on the offensive side of the ball, and QB who is efficient, and has been trained ONLY in the way of being efficient, is going to have a hard time adjusting. No biggie.

 

I think those losses are very critical, and could be the difference between a great defense and a superbowl defense.

 

 

Sorry, the first paragraph was in response to you, the 2nd was in response to the entire thread.

 

I don't think anyone watches and analyses the Steelers more than I do, and I must say that the only losses they have missed slightly have been Randle-El and Bettis. Their defense has actually imporved with Ryan Clark & Brett Keisel over Kimo & Hope.

 

Their two losses can be summed up quite simply:

 

JAX - they lost because they couldn't move the ball on an absolutely phenomenal defense, and because

their QB played poorly.

 

CIN - they outgained and for the most part outplayed Cincy, but, they made a ton of crucial mistake, which

Cincy capitalized on, and their QB played poorly.

Edited by Menudo
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No offense, but, based on your points above, you really must not be watching the Steelers much.

 

First, losing Von Oelhoffen has not had any negative affect at all. Check the RB's numbers against the Steelers this year. Randle-El hasn't been replaced by a rookie. Cedric Wilson is our #2, and the rookie is currently our # 4 receiver.

 

If you really want to say that the defense and running game are a problem, then I suggest you somehow find a copy of the games, and re-watch them. Other than the running game struggling against JAX, the defense and running game have been terrific. Don't be fooled by the Bengals TD's, both in the 2nd half came after turnovers. Palmer only through for 193, and Rudi only ran for 40-something. They did very well considering the offense they were going up against.

 

whoa whoa whoa. I never said they would be playing from behind and i'm starting every offenive player that is going up against PIT from now on.

I made an obvservation about the loss of some of the players. And in previous threads, you made the same exact points. One you actually said something to affect of "Von Oelhoffen is a hugh loss" or something like that. BJ?

 

So don't take offense when I say such things. I was actually arguing FOR big Ben with my points.

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whoa whoa whoa. I never said they would be playing from behind and i'm starting every offenive player that is going up against PIT from now on.

I made an obvservation about the loss of some of the players. And in previous threads, you made the same exact points. One you actually said something to affect of "Von Oelhoffen is a hugh loss" or something like that. BJ?

 

So don't take offense when I say such things. I was actually arguing FOR big Ben with my points.

 

 

Don't take it personal man, I have no problem having a bit of a back-and-fourth with you. It is refreshing to have these conversations without someone calling me a bling homer, a momo, or the witty response of calling my favorite team the The only 6 time Super Bowl Winners and YOUR DADDY.

 

Prior to the season, my take on Kimo was that they might lose a bit in the run-stopping department, but, would gain a ton in the pass rushing department. So far, there has been no step down from Kimo to Keisel against the run, as the Steelers have been great, and Keisel, though he only has one sacks, has put tons more pressure on the QB than Kimo ever has. Keisel is athletic, where Kimo was big and stout. I think the defense is better this year than it was last year, but, they do need Polamalu to get to 100%, which should happen after the bye week. The offense on the other hand, simply isn't clicking in the passing game. The run game and pass protection have been good for the most part.

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Don't take it personal man, I have no problem having a bit of a back-and-fourth with you. It is refreshing to have these conversations without someone calling me a bling homer, a momo, or the witty response of calling my favorite team the The only 6 time Super Bowl Winners and YOUR DADDY.

 

Prior to the season, my take on Kimo was that they might lose a bit in the run-stopping department, but, would gain a ton in the pass rushing department. So far, there has been no step down from Kimo to Keisel against the run, as the Steelers have been great, and Keisel, though he only has one sacks, has put tons more pressure on the QB than Kimo ever has. Keisel is athletic, where Kimo was big and stout. I think the defense is better this year than it was last year, but, they do need Polamalu to get to 100%, which should happen after the bye week. The offense on the other hand, simply isn't clicking in the passing game. The run game and pass protection have been good for the most part.

 

 

Momo.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:D

Edited by Hugh 0ne
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To a certain degree I can see where not having Bettis has hurt the offense, but honestly I don't think it matters that much. With regard to Randel El, he was way over rated because of one gimmick play in an important game. I think that what they have coming up in the young guys more than makes up for his loss.

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To a certain degree I can see where not having Bettis has hurt the offense, but honestly I don't think it matters that much. With regard to Randel El, he was way over rated because of one gimmick play in an important game. I think that what they have coming up in the young guys more than makes up for his loss.

 

 

Yep. Randle-El is NOT a great reciever, but, he did bring a dimension with his running/throwing abilities. Bettis main thing was that he could grind out the clock, even when the other team knew it was coming, which will be missed.

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Don't take it personal man, I have no problem having a bit of a back-and-fourth with you. It is refreshing to have these conversations without someone calling me a bling homer, a momo, or the witty response of calling my favorite team the The only 6 time Super Bowl Winners and YOUR DADDY.

 

Prior to the season, my take on Kimo was that they might lose a bit in the run-stopping department, but, would gain a ton in the pass rushing department. So far, there has been no step down from Kimo to Keisel against the run, as the Steelers have been great, and Keisel, though he only has one sacks, has put tons more pressure on the QB than Kimo ever has. Keisel is athletic, where Kimo was big and stout. I think the defense is better this year than it was last year, but, they do need Polamalu to get to 100%, which should happen after the bye week. The offense on the other hand, simply isn't clicking in the passing game. The run game and pass protection have been good for the most part.

 

 

i dont take anything personal. I've told you in the past how I feel about how people treat you on here. You never waiver, or let it get to you. I admire that.

 

I will withdraw my statement on the Defense, based on your assessment of the current def. You would know better than I, and while I never said they suck, and will be giving up TDs like crazy, I did say we are currently seeing the effects of losing those players, which according to you we're not. Perhaps, I should've speculated that it's possible we WILL see the effects. If nothing else, losing players hurts the locker room, but we're not in there, so we dont know how it's effecting the team. (should those be "affecting" and "affect"? i hope not.)

 

Unfortunately, that merely proves the above points that Roth is the weak link now. Take away the studs and dynamics of yester-year and lean on Big Ben, and it's not working out.

Of course Simms wouldn't be playing next week. Roth has been through alot already.

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Batch is not the answer that much is for sure. Ben needs to grow as a QB- guy was put in the PERFEK situation for his first 2 years, and he became completely overrated as a result. Now he has time and room to improve but for now.......

 

- He is an inaccurate, immobile QB that makes questionable decisions, throws and his arm strength is below average. Compare him to other QB's across the NFL and you won't like what you will find........

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i dont take anything personal. I've told you in the past how I feel about how people treat you on here. You never waiver, or let it get to you. I admire that.

 

I will withdraw my statement on the Defense, based on your assessment of the current def. You would know better than I, and while I never said they suck, and will be giving up TDs like crazy, I did say we are currently seeing the effects of losing those players, which according to you we're not. Perhaps, I should've speculated that it's possible we WILL see the effects. If nothing else, losing players hurts the locker room, but we're not in there, so we dont know how it's effecting the team. (should those be "affecting" and "affect"? i hope not.)

 

Unfortunately, that merely proves the above points that Roth is the weak link now. Take away the studs and dynamics of yester-year and lean on Big Ben, and it's not working out.

Of course Simms wouldn't be playing next week. Roth has been through alot already.

 

 

He has been the biggest weak link thus far. However, don't believe the hype, the Steelers have had to lean on Roethlisberger in past years, and he has come through several times, however, so far this year, he simply isn't getting anything done.

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Batch is not the answer that much is for sure. Ben needs to grow as a QB- guy was put in the PERFEK situation for his first 2 years, and he became completely overrated as a result. Now he has time and room to improve but for now.......

 

- He is an inaccurate, immobile QB that makes questionable decisions, throws and his arm strength is below average. Compare him to other QB's across the NFL and you won't like what you will find........

 

 

Calling Roethlisberger immobile just shows how little you have watched them play. Also, he completed a pass last year across his body 55 yards downfield in the Texans game, so arm strenght is not a problem. You have obviously only watched a few of his worst game, if this is your assessment.

 

I know you'll see this as an attack or me defending Ben, but, prior to this year, arm strenght and mobility have been his strengths.

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Calling Roethlisberger immobile just shows how little you have watched them play. Also, he completed a pass last year across his body 55 yards downfield in the Texans game, so arm strenght is not a problem. You have obviously only watched a few of his worst game, if this is your assessment.

 

I know you'll see this as an attack or me defending Ben, but, prior to this year, arm strenght and mobility have been his strengths.

 

 

 

I would agree with Menudo, he throws the ball well and on occasion his best when he is on the move and out of the pocket. Arm strength is not an issue I see.

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Calling Roethlisberger immobile just shows how little you have watched them play. Also, he completed a pass last year across his body 55 yards downfield in the Texans game, so arm strenght is not a problem. You have obviously only watched a few of his worst game, if this is your assessment.

 

I know you'll see this as an attack or me defending Ben, but, prior to this year, arm strenght and mobility have been his strengths.

 

 

 

Your delusional Menudo- get real for once. Just glancing at the stats- I counted 15 MINIMUM QB's I would take over Roth. If you think he has a strong arm you really don't know football- he throws ducks, his ball flutters. This is nothing personal at all-as I have told you I like alot of Pitt players.

 

Roth to me is one of the more overrated players in the NFL- period.

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Your delusional Menudo- get real for once. Just glancing at the stats- I counted 15 MINIMUM QB's I would take over Roth. If you think he has a strong arm you really don't know football- he throws ducks, his ball flutters. This is nothing personal at all-as I have told you I like alot of Pitt players.

 

Roth to me is one of the more overrated players in the NFL- period.

 

 

You're right, I don't know football.

 

I played since I was 5. Lettered 4 years in college and was our defensive captain my Sr. year. Coached high school football for 3 years. I'm fanatical, and watch football on Fridays, Saturdays, and Sunday's every weekend of football season.

 

I have also seen every one of Ben's plays from scrimmage, both pre-season and post-season. There are things you can question, but, saying he has a weak arm and is immobile is just completely wrong. They are his two biggest strengths, as every announcer in football states in every one of the Steelers games.

 

His arm strength has definitely not looked as good this year, so we will see if the weight loss due to injuries is the reason why.

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Your delusional Menudo- get real for once. Just glancing at the stats- I counted 15 MINIMUM QB's I would take over Roth. If you think he has a strong arm you really don't know football- he throws ducks, his ball flutters. This is nothing personal at all-as I have told you I like alot of Pitt players.

 

Roth to me is one of the more overrated players in the NFL- period.

 

so would you rather have Eli than Big Ben?

 

:D

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:D:lol::lol:

 

 

Yes, avoid the comment with idiot laughter. People here might call me annoying, but, even my most adamant haters have admitted that I definitely know football. Perhaps you were laughing at yourself for calling Big Ben immobile ? :D

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You're right, I don't know football.

 

I played since I was 5. Lettered 4 years in college and was our defensive captain my Sr. year. Coached high school football for 3 years. I'm fanatical, and watch football on Fridays, Saturdays, and Sunday's every weekend of football season.

 

I have also seen every one of Ben's plays from scrimmage, both pre-season and post-season. There are things you can question, but, saying he has a weak arm and is immobile is just completely wrong. They are his two biggest strengths, as every announcer in football states in every one of the Steelers games.

 

His arm strength has definitely not looked as good this year, so we will see if the weight loss due to injuries is the reason why.

 

 

I have nothing to say about this thread and Ben but, I thought you had a life outside football and FF in particular. You've watched everyone of Ben's plays from scrimmage, watch football three days a week all season long. Where do you find time for a life after dedicating half the week to football. I know you've said you have a job. Do you sleep??? :D

 

Being serious, if you've been a student of football for the time you say you have then you know Ben is not a great QB. AS stated, he's a game manager and does have some sparks of being on his way to a good QB but, is not quite there. His success is the product of a great team and running game. He will turn out to be a good QB. Can't you be good with that? If he does turn out to be a great QB for Pitt. all the better but don't make him out to be more than what he is right now.

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You're right, I don't know football.

 

I played since I was 5. Lettered 4 years in college and was our defensive captain my Sr. year. Coached high school football for 3 years. I'm fanatical, and watch football on Fridays, Saturdays, and Sunday's every weekend of football season.

 

I have also seen every one of Ben's plays from scrimmage, both pre-season and post-season. There are things you can question, but, saying he has a weak arm and is immobile is just completely wrong. They are his two biggest strengths, as every announcer in football states in every one of the Steelers games.

 

His arm strength has definitely not looked as good this year, so we will see if the weight loss due to injuries is the reason why.

 

 

 

We all USED to play football.

 

And we all USED to be good.

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Batch is not the answer that much is for sure. Ben needs to grow as a QB- guy was put in the PERFEK situation for his first 2 years, and he became completely overrated as a result. Now he has time and room to improve but for now.......

 

- He is an inaccurate, immobile QB that makes questionable decisions, throws and his arm strength is below average. Compare him to other QB's across the NFL and you won't like what you will find........

 

 

After a quick serach on Google, I found the following. I'm sure I'll hear about how the media knows nothing, and they are wrong and you are right. Or maybe all of these writers are blind-ass homers. :D

 

Since you won't take it from me:

 

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nf...3-big-ben_x.htm

 

strong arm and mobility, especially at 6-5 and 241 pounds. One of his most-talked-about plays didn't even count.

 

Last week against Cincinnati, he was in the grasp of a Bengals tackler, almost fell, then broke away. Running to his left, Roethlisberger threw a 50-yard strike across his body to Plaxico Burress.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/ben_roethlisberger

 

Has an above-average, snappy release and excellent arm strength …

he does show good mobility to roll away from the rush and step up to avoid the sack

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/7782362

 

Roethlisberger is 6-foot-5 and 241 pounds and has a strong arm. Yet when you talk about his game, the element that jumps out at you first is his mobility.

 

http://www.nflfans.com/draft/2004/showplay...Roethlisberger*

 

Ben mixes a strong arm with good speed and great decision making. He is both a great pocket passer and an accurate scrambler. While he won't be confused with Michael Vick, Ben does have enough speed to take off and pick up the first down or roll out of the pocket and make a big play.

 

http://206.67.55.17/fbcollege2004.htm

 

Big and mobile with outstanding arm strength,

 

http://proxy.espn.go.com/nfl/draft06/colum...john&id=2411634

 

Though he's mobile and has a strong arm

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We all USED to play football.

 

And we all USED to be good.

 

 

Hey, I won't read off the resume, if my football knowledge isn't called into question. :D

 

Of course, I was a TE & ILB, now I would be a LT & NT :D

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