Tega Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I didn't see the play that some of you talked about - LJ getting a major facemask (and the officials not catching it). When there is a major dirty hit, the NFL can fine a player after reviewing film. Can they do that for a major facemask? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunther Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 The officials didn't catch it? I thought I saw on GameCenter when that happened there was a 15-yard face mask penalty (ended up being half the distance to the goal). Maybe my memory isn't up to snuff... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big John Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 If the NFL office considers there was intent to injure, they can levy a fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunther Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Figured I'd go take a look at the Gamebook: 1-10-KC 13 (2:31) 11-D.Huard pass short left to 27-L.Johnson to ARZ 9 for 78 yards (21-A.Rolle). KC-27-L.Johnson was injured during the play. P17 PENALTY on ARZ-21-A.Rolle, Face Mask (15 Yards), 5 yards, enforced at ARZ 9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 If the NFL office considers there was intent to injure, they can levy a fine. Exactly correct. As they have plenty of times in the past. KC will most likely send film for the NFL to review as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Dick Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) There was a flag, but no intent to injure IMO. It looked like Rolle was just looking to grab anything to try and stop LJ from getting to the endzone. Rolle came from a LONG way to stop the play, and in a close game every play matters. Not a dirty play, just unfortunate the way it unfolded. They should fine Sammie Parker for blocking like a puss. Otherwise Rolle never even gets to LJ. Edited October 9, 2006 by Chief Dick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samurai30 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 at least LJ is allright....herm edwards in his press conf said he'll be fine.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 There was a flag, but no intent to injure IMO. It looked like Rolle was just looking to grab anything to try and stop LJ from getting to the endzone. Rolle came from a LONG way to stop the play, and in a close game every play matters. Not a dirty play, just unfortunate the way it unfolded. They should fine Sammie Parker for blocking like a puss. Otherwise Rolle never even gets to LJ. Rolle also was reaching around Parker and FLYLING. He was pretty much mid air when he grabbed the facemask and he was real distraught after the play. I doubt there will be any fine, but it certainly looked bad enough. He whole read was almost 180 degrees around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tega Posted October 9, 2006 Author Share Posted October 9, 2006 I thought a previous post stated that the refs didn't catch the facemask. I'm glad there was a penalty called and I'm glad that LJ is OK. Thanks for the responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABearWithFurniture Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 There was a flag, but no intent to injure IMO. It looked like Rolle was just looking to grab anything to try and stop LJ from getting to the endzone. Rolle came from a LONG way to stop the play, and in a close game every play matters. Not a dirty play, just unfortunate the way it unfolded. They should fine Sammie Parker for blocking like a puss. Otherwise Rolle never even gets to LJ. Exactly...+1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turf Smurf Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 There was a flag, but no intent to injure IMO. It looked like Rolle was just looking to grab anything to try and stop LJ from getting to the endzone. Rolle came from a LONG way to stop the play, and in a close game every play matters. Not a dirty play, just unfortunate the way it unfolded. They should fine Sammie Parker for blocking like a puss. Otherwise Rolle never even gets to LJ. Agreed. Chief Dick and that word (agreed) don't often collide in the same sentence. Rolle was just trying to stop the score. It didn't look like there was any intent or malice for that matter. But, I'm sure the normal mal-contents will appear and claim that LJ's cleats were stuck in the sod! Sorry, memory cuts both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) Not a dirty play, just unfortunate the way it unfolded. They should fine Sammie Parker for blocking like a puss. Otherwise Rolle never even gets to LJ. Not a dirty play? The penalty was egregious & Rolle intentionally wrecklessly endangered LJ by that play. He knew exactly what he was doing by pulling down Johnson by the facemask. Not only was it as dirty as play gets, but it warrants a suspension. Just because a guy's facemask is the only way available to stop him from scoring a TD doesn't make it okay to tackle the guy by it, twisting himly completely around against his path of momentum. That thinking amazes me - any play is okay, as long as it is on the field of play & stops a TD from being scored? The ends justify any means? That's bulloh poopy. Edited October 9, 2006 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I don't know what play you all watched, but Rolle grabbed whatever he could get. I thought it was a very dirty play and I think he should be fined, there was no excuse for that. So you're saying if a RB breaks free a guy chases him down and grabs on from behind, reaches around and grabs the facemassk, twists his head back to drive him to the ground.......is not a dirty play? I don't know what you all are talking about Rolle had no business grabbing up there, PERIOD! That said, LJ could have avoided the whole thing by cutting back to the inside and dashing toward the middle of the field or he could have kept on sprinting down the line and not waited for the blocker and he most likely would have scored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) Well, I base my judgment regarding league precedence regarding two plays by DBs previously. The first is a hit by DEN S John Lynch on IND TE Dallas Clark, where Clark was either in the process of securing a thrown ball or had secured a thrown ball and had turned to run with it - it took numerous slo-mo replay (4 1/2 minutes worth) review by refs to determine whether Clark caught the ball and therefore was a runner when the contact occured, and therefore whether the hit by Lynch (which it shall be noted occurred in a fraction of a second on the field) was legal or illegal, and therefore whether a ) Clark had fumbled the ball or whether it was on incomplete pass, and b ) whether Lynch's hit was a penalty for a hit against a defenseless reciever or whether it was legal contact with a ball carrier running with the football. The initial call on the field was no penalty. The NFL, after numerous reviews during the following week, decided that the play was dirty and fined Lynch $75,000, which Lynch lost an appeal to. The second is the string of horse collars tackles by DAL S Roy Williams. The horse collar tackle was previously considered a legal tackle until Williams used the momentum gained by the horse collar to swing his legs into the reciever's legs, which caused injury on more than one occassion. The league looked at the dangerous play and has now outlawed it and fines DBs who use this method to tackle because of its inherent danger to players. That the league fines (and has threatened to suspend) players engaged in the previous 2 contacts described above because of the nature of the play being so dangerous, it is only in line that the league fine and/or suspend in a similar manner any player who engages in an egregrious face masking penalty such as the one performed by Rolle on Johnson in that it was intentional - Rolle obviously knew that he was grabbing & tackling Johnson by the face mask - and that it was so dangerous in the situation in which the dirty play was applied. By your assertion that I am nuts, you also condone the horse collar tackle performed by Roy Williams okay since it results in a potential TD saving tackle, and you also should allow the Lynch hit with no fine (or penalty) since the play happened so quickly from the touching of the ball by Clark to the hit by Lynch that Lynch couldn't have possibly known - hell, even the refs didn't know - that he was engaing it what was later determined to be a dirty hit and subsequently fined. The NFL says otherwise in both those cases, and it ought to do the same on this play to Rolle. Anyone who has ever played football knows damn well that was Rolle did was foul, dangerous, & reprehensible. If you are a football player on the field, you know very well what injury you can inflict on a player by tackling him by the face mask in the manner that Rolle did to Johnson. It's one thing to get tangled up in a face mask while tackling from behind or having a hand slip off the pads or jersey and onto the face mask, but it's an entirely different transgression to intentionally grab the face mask and pull a player down simply because that was the only thing available to grab the player by - which Rolle clearly knowingly did. I'm surprised Rolle wasn't thrown out of the game. While football is natually a violent game, there is no place for the kind of reckless mayhem that Rolle performed, no matter whether he was trying to stop a TD from being scored or not. The NFL has a history of legislating against that kind of play. Edited October 9, 2006 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Anyone who has ever played football knows damn well that was Rolle did was foul, dangerous, & reprehensible. If you are a football player on the field, you know very well what injury you can inflict on a player by tackling him by the face mask in the manner that Rolle did to Johnson. It's one thing to get tangled up in a face mask while tackling from behind or having a hand slip off the pads or jersey and onto the face mask, but it's an entirely different transgression to intentionally grab the face mask and pull a player down simply because that was the only thing available to grab the player by - which Rolle clearly knowingly did. I'm surprised Rolle wasn't thrown out of the game. While football is natually a violent game, there is no place for the kind of reckless mayhem that Rolle performed, no matter whether he was trying to stop a TD from being scored or not. The NFL has a history of legislating against that kind of play. This is all you need to read right here Excellent post BB All you other people need to wake up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecerwin Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Bronco Billy, you are 100% correct here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 My memory is a bit hazy, but I seem to remember several years back, Shannon Sharpe getting grabbed by the facemask on two or three consecutive plays. Maybe by a Chief? I've never seen anything like it since as the Defensive player came off the ball, grabbed his facemask and attempted to twist his head off his shoulders for the duration of the play. Happened several plays in a row. I believe the NFL fined for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) My memory is a bit hazy, but I seem to remember several years back, Shannon Sharpe getting grabbed by the facemask on two or three consecutive plays. Maybe by a Chief? I've never seen anything like it since as the Defensive player came off the ball, grabbed his facemask and attempted to twist his head off his shoulders for the duration of the play. Happened several plays in a row. I believe the NFL fined for that. Look no further than my Avitar for the culprit. Shannon Sharpe was/is a punk who was trash talking Thomas, the game was already decided and Sharpe was saying some things he obviously shouldn't have to Thomas, Thomas wasn't going to just let him get away with it....so for a series of plays (3 I think) Derrick lined up over him grabbed his face mask drug him to the ground with it and made him eat turf. He had to have someone help him remove the turf from his mask after every one of those plays Now I'm not going to sit here and say Thomas wasn't wrong, he was fined as he should have been, the team was basically banned from MNF, although the league never said that....but we had at least 2 MNF games every year up to that event and none for a while after the incident. Sharpe got what he asked for......a reaction out of Thomas....and Thomas gave him a piece Now if we could just get someone to do something similar on the set that would be nice. EDIT ** Thomas was not a dirty player and apologized to the team and Organization afterwards, he never did anything remotely close to this in his career. Edited October 9, 2006 by Hat Trick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Look no further than my Avitar for the culprit. Shannon Sharpe was/is a punk who was trash talking Thomas, the game was already decided and Sharpe was saying some things he obviously shouldn't have to Thomas, Thomas wasn't going to just let him get away with it....so for a series of plays (3 I think) Derrick lined up over him grabbed his face mask drug him to the ground with it and made him eat turf. He had to have someone help him remove the turf from his mask after every one of those plays Now I'm not going to sit here and say Thomas wasn't wrong, he was fined as he should have been, the team was basically banned from MNF, although the league never said that....but we had at least 2 MNF games every year up to that event and none for a while after the incident. Sharpe got what he asked for......a reaction out of Thomas....and Thomas gave him a piece Now if we could just get someone to do something similar on the set that would be nice. EDIT ** Thomas was not a dirty player and apologized to the team and Organization afterwards, he never did anything remotely close to this in his career. Nice selective memory. DEN beat KC 30-7 in the MNF game in which the penalties happened. Sharpe had been using Thomas all game long & let him know all about it, in typical Sharpe diarrhea-mouth diatribes, and Thomas just went completely ballistic. I distinctly remembering Peterson & Schottenheimer making profuse apologies to anyone & everyone who would listen because Thomas had gone so far off his rocker in that game. Sharpe got completely in Thomas' head & DEN crushed KC in KC that game. And mind you, Thomas was a supreme trash-talker also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexgaddis Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I don't know what play you all watched, but Rolle grabbed whatever he could get. I thought it was a very dirty play and I think he should be fined, there was no excuse for that. So you're saying if a RB breaks free a guy chases him down and grabs on from behind, reaches around and grabs the facemassk, twists his head back to drive him to the ground.......is not a dirty play? I don't know what you all are talking about Rolle had no business grabbing up there, PERIOD! That said, LJ could have avoided the whole thing by cutting back to the inside and dashing toward the middle of the field or he could have kept on sprinting down the line and not waited for the blocker and he most likely would have scored. yeah, it looked pretty bad to me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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