Bier Meister Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Wasnt griese pretty good in denver. Why did Shanny want him gone. I cant recall. i didn't think he was as bad as many local fans here. +---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | Passing | Rushing | +----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD | +----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | 1998 den | 1 | 1 3 33.3 2 0.7 0 1 | 4 -4 0 | | 1999 den | 14 | 261 452 57.7 3032 6.7 14 14 | 46 138 2 | | 2000 den | 10 | 216 336 64.3 2688 8.0 19 4 | 29 102 1 | | 2001 den | 15 | 275 451 61.0 2827 6.3 23 19 | 50 173 1 | | 2002 den | 13 | 291 436 66.7 3214 7.4 15 15 | 37 107 1 | | 2003 mia | 5 | 74 130 56.9 813 6.3 5 6 | 5 15 0 | | 2004 tam | 11 | 233 336 69.3 2632 7.8 20 12 | 30 17 0 | | 2005 tam | 6 | 112 174 64.4 1136 6.5 7 7 | 13 12 0 | | 2006 chi | 4 | 7 8 87.5 45 5.6 0 0 | 6 -5 0 | +----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ | TOTAL | 79 | 1470 2326 63.2 16389 7.0 103 78 | 220 555 5 | +----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+ Seasons among the league's top 10 Passing TDs: 2001-8 Adjusted yards per pass: 2000-3, 2004-10 Brian Griese is not in the all-time top 50 in any major category. Postseason data None available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Wasnt griese pretty good in denver. Why did Shanny want him gone. I cant recall. Griese wasn't Elway. Actually, there were a few reasons for Griese & Shanahan not being a good match. Griese wasn't a team leader - never was, likely never will be, and Shanahan wanted that from his QBs. Also, in case no one has noticed, Shanahan isn't exactly great on developing rookie QBs. Check out his draft record and how many QBs he drafted have stuck with the team and started games for him - yep, Griese is it. Griese had a few faults of his own - the public relations disasters of his off-field drinking escapades and his standoffishness to the press, and he made a few boneheaded plays on the field didn't help. I think the main reason was that Griese just wasn't a good fit in the Shanahan offense. Shanahan likes to try to stretch the field with his passing game and take a few risks - especially after getting a turnover, and Griese excels at a shorter/high percentage offense - which makes him a good fit for a team like TB or CHI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pseudolefty Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Cutler looked and played like a rookie playing his first NFL game last night. His 2 INTs were directly responsible for 10 Seattle points. However, he did show some skills and a strong arm. Looks like he has a fairly quick release too. He'll only get better with more experience. Doubt he'll get there this year, but after a full training camp and preseason as the #1 guy next year, he could be pretty formidable. The experience he gains now will really help him out in the off season and point out things he needs to improve on. Phillip Rivers has said that the 1 game he played last year when Brees got hurt against the Broncos really helped him alot in getting prepared for this year. Even though he didn't tear it up then, he got a feel for the speed of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 griese f'n sucks. i mean, start with the tangible stuff....he's average there. weak arm, but accurate. very little mobility, but pretty good reading defenses. so he's an average QB on paper, but what separates him (negatively) are the intangibles. he sucked balls in the 4th quarter. he sucked balls in big games that the team needed to win. he'd follow up a bad game with a worse game. i'll take plummer over griese every day of the week. plummer (before this season, at least) showed a great deal of resilience and mental toughness. he at least had the intenstinal fortitude to play QB in the NFL, even if his rag-arm and 10-cent head make him equal to or maybe even less than griese on paper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 griese f'n sucks. i mean, start with the tangible stuff....he's average there. weak arm, but accurate. very little mobility, but pretty good reading defenses. so he's an average QB on paper, but what separates him (negatively) are the intangibles. he sucked balls in the 4th quarter. he sucked balls in big games that the team needed to win. he'd follow up a bad game with a worse game. i'll take plummer over griese every day of the week. plummer (before this season, at least) showed a great deal of resilience and mental toughness. he at least had the intenstinal fortitude to play QB in the NFL, even if his rag-arm and 10-cent head make him equal to or maybe even less than griese on paper. i would also take plummer over greise, but he wasn't terrible...... not everyone can be elway in the 4th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Plummer also had double the attempts to Kordell. They are undeniably similar in comp %, TD/INT, and yards per attempt. At least Kordell ran twice as many yards with twice as many TDs. I know you've got something to prove in this thread that Plummer wasn't a bad QB and that Cutler is... but you're wrong. You can't prove it with numbers, and you can't prove it with logic. Plummer is a f*$kup at QB. He's not smart, he's not a leader, and he's not accurate unless he's on the run, which is easy to defend... as any team that beats Atlanta can tell you. Plummer is not the quarterback of the Denver Broncos, and that is an improvement. Point 1..double the attempts would of course come along with the other stats..that goes pretty much without saying. it just goes along with my original point...so not sure how that matters to your point though Point 2 .. I have nothing to prove in this thread, I just like to talk football..and to show you how far off you are my arguementative friend...I think Cutler is the best QB drafted last year..thought it then..and I think it now..I just don't think he is as ready as Plummer yet to take control of this team..nothing more..nothing less. but if a arguementative man wanted to debate with LOGIC..he would say how can someone say after a guy has played 1 game that he is better than the other guy with numbers or LOGIC? Point 3.. You consider Plummer a F-UP ..I consider him a decent QB who was good enough to keep a NFL starting job for 10 years..and who knows if he resurfaces again next year. Point 4..You are right..Plummer is not the QB of the Broncos..since Cutler has lost his only start I wonder how you can prove it is better for the team right now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Griese excels at a shorter/high percentage offense - which makes him a good fit for a team like TB or CHI. This is EXACTLY what the Bears need now, and Lovie still wants to stick with freaking Rex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 i would also take plummer over greise, but he wasn't terrible...... not everyone can be elway in the 4th. Cutler is more like Elway in the first 3 quarters, huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 i would also take plummer over greise, but he wasn't terrible...... not everyone can be elway in the 4th. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Cutler is more like Elway in the first 3 quarters, huh? he...and den fans, wish it so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 (edited) Point 4..You are right..Plummer is not the QB of the Broncos..since Cutler has lost his only start I wonder how you can prove it is better for the team right now? I think DEN would have won last night if Plummer would have started - SEAwas looking for any excuse to roll over & die & DEN kept them in the game all night with turnovers. That said, I also think starting Cutler was better for the team than continuing with Plummer. I do believe that every player & coach on the team knew exactly how bad Plummer was this year - how could pro athletes not know? - and that DEN was still going to be in a dogfight for a wildcard spot in the playoffs, which meant a road game even if they made the playoffs. Check out DEN's record under Shanahan on the road in the playoffs if he doesn't have Elway, TD, Sharpe, Zimmerman, et al on his offense. This season was over - whether it means going 9-7 and missing the playoffs or going 11-5 & getting their heads handed to them in another town in round 1. The team was fading badly in the past month after a good start despite Plummer playing so poorly. Edited December 4, 2006 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 he...and den fans, wish it so. Why did Elway have so many 4th quarter comebacks? A. Because he sucked the first 3 quarters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Why did Elway have so many 4th quarter comebacks? A. Because he sucked the first 3 quarters. eeeehhhhh! wrong answer. running game and defense..... oh wait you forgot the significance of that when praising your aikman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Why did Elway have so many 4th quarter comebacks? A. Because he sucked the first 3 quarters. I hope you're fishing. You can't possibly be ignoring Dan "play not to lose" Reeves keeping the games ultra-conservative for 3 quarters and then turning Elway loose in the 4th quarter to save his rearend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 I think DEN would have won last night if Plummer would have started - SEAwas looking for any excuse to roll over & die & DEN kept them in the game all night with turnovers. That said, I also think starting Cutler was better for the team than continuing with Plummer. I do believe that every player & coach on the team knew exactly how bad Plummer was this year - how could pro athletes not know? - and that DEN was still going to be in a dogfight for a wildcard spot in the playoffs, which meant a road game even if they made the playoffs. Check out DEN's record under Shanahan on the road in the playoffs if he doesn't have Elway, TD, Sharpe, Zimmerman, et al on his offense. This season was over - whether it means going 9-7 and missing the playoffs or going 11-5 & getting their heads handed to them in another town in round 1. The team was fading badly in the past month after a good start despite Plummer playing so poorly. I understand this line of thinking totally..myself I would rather be in the playoffs...but I do understand your thought process. You never know..Cutler could pull it together and help lead the team to the playoffs..if that happens Cutler's progress will be sped up and you guys could really reap the benefits next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Why did Elway have so many 4th quarter comebacks? well, he had a lot of kick-yer-ass-start-to-finish wins as well. he's the all-time winningest QB in league history after all, he has tons of wins of every variety Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 I hope you're fishing. You can't possibly be ignoring Dan "play not to lose" Reeves keeping the games ultra-conservative for 3 quarters and then turning Elway loose in the 4th quarter to save his rearend. Sure, blame the coach. Not to mention Elway was one of the most famous spoiled children in the history of the league. Remember he was drafted by Baltimore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Elway got alot of criticism early in his career he did not deserve and luckily for him he got some late career SB rings so the hard headed fans could even appreciate him. Early in his career he played from behind alot and with a 0-line that gave him no time..much like Brett Favre he threw some INT's trying to force the action because he realized it was the teams only chance and would get criticized for it just like Favre has alot of his career. in reality they were as good in those seasons as they were in their SB years they were just forced to do things they would not have to do if they were playing with a better team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 well, he had a lot of kick-yer-ass-start-to-finish wins as well. he's the all-time winningest QB in league history after all, he has tons of wins of every variety Yeah I hated Elway for this very reason..but he was a great 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Sure, blame the coach. Not to mention Elway was one of the most famous spoiled children in the history of the league. Remember he was drafted by Baltimore. Wow, there's a compelling argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Sure, blame the coach. Well, let's see. Reeves - 10 years with Elway at QB: 98-60-1 regular season 7-6 in the playoffs 0 SB wins 3 SB losses Reeves - 13 years without Elway: 92-105-1 regular season 2-1 in the playoffs 0 SB wins 1 SB loss Elway - 6 years without Reeves: 63-33 in the regular season 7-1 in the playoffs 2 SB wins 0 SB losses Yeah, I think I'll let that speak for itself.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 The thread title is "Cutler is a lock to be the next Elway!" So Cutler hangs around 14 years before finally winning a Super Bowl with his stud running back? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 The thread title is "Cutler is a lock to be the next Elway!" So Cutler hangs around 14 years before finally winning a Super Bowl with his stud running back? In today's NFL, I'd take 5 SB appearances in 16 years, with 2 of them being Ws. Maybe you've set your sights a wee bit high???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 In today's NFL, I'd take 5 SB appearances in 16 years, with 2 of them being Ws. Maybe you've set your sights a wee bit high???? Well, I am a Cowboys fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 I was disappointed in Cutler's performace. Yes, he's a rookie. Yes, he looked like a rookie. I was hoping for more. Seattle's D was ripe for the plucking and Denver repeatedly turned the ball over instead. I guess if we're kissing the season goodbye, let's get the kid some starts and let him figure out how the big boys play. Oh yeah, and to you Elway bashers, Kiss it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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