Jump to content
[[Template core/front/custom/_customHeader is throwing an error. This theme may be out of date. Run the support tool in the AdminCP to restore the default theme.]]

Brady vs Montana


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 72
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Lets just say I wouldnt put brady ahead of even Aikman yet, let alone Montana. Brady had one of the better defenses in the league in 2 of those 3 Sb wins, something Montana never had, thus Brady didnt have to do nearly as much as Montana. Id put that Boys team against any of the pats, and Brady would be 0-3 in Sbs if that was the case.

Parity, with solid D play, probably the worst division in football over the past 6 yr, and Brady has also had home field throughout most of those playoff games. Brady is good, but he is no Montana. And his next Sb, will be his most deserving, as like BB said, that window is closing and that D aint as good as it used to be. Brady's next Sb will be one he has to win, like Montana did all 4. Also, Keep in mind if it wasnt for the BS tuck rule, Brady wouldnt have even won the first one.

 

 

 

When the ravens, with no offense, The Steelers with terrible Qb play, can win a SB in this era. Its just a bad era for football. The Pats are a nice team, and are racking up wins in this decade, but do they really stack up well with any of the great Dynasty teams of all time. I think not.

 

 

 

for starters, brady having a great defense (and, in your and many other peoples' views, that's why he has two of three rings) pales in comparison to what aikman had to play with all those years, as exemplified by your very own words above. if you're going to hold brady's "team assets" against him then you sure as hell have to hold aikman's considerably more valuable ones against HIM. can't have it both ways, sarge.

 

 

my take on brady:

very talented qb. early in his career he played very efficient football, but was carried by pretty good running games and very opportunistic defense and special teams. the d was pretty awesome- they kept scores low and had a decent amount of tds (or very good filed position). that d/st really game the offense a lot of opportunities to points on the board. tom was doing fine, but the successes were team successes imo.... over time i thin brady is developing into the qb many of you pats fans thought he was after that 1st sb win. he is now much more able to put a team on his shoulders (something i don't think he could have done with success the 1st 3 years).... so i agree that the next one he gets (if they can get there) will have more to with him and the qb position than the previous ones.

 

 

montana= best ever...... some of you forget that he won 2 before he had rice. he did have good defenses, but not the type that often scored. much more was placed on his shoulders earlier in his career.. the pass was used to set up the run (or often as the run).

 

montana > young..... i watched both of them. young inherrited a very talented team with all of the pieces in place (players and system). would have loved to see joe at the helm vs those dallas 90's teams. i remember an older, beat up montana going to KC and helping them get to an AFC championship... there he had an older (but effective) marcus allen and great d..... but level of wr was average at best.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I disagree Sarge, I think the Cowboys had it much easier. It was definitely the "haves" and the "have nots." Most of their team was assembled pre-salary cap and pre-free agency. Back in 1993, you could almost guarantee who the playoff teams and SB champs would be at the beginning of the year. Now, many SB teams didn't even make the playoffs the year before.

 

 

 

Yes by raping the Vikings in the Walker trade. 6 draft picks and 8 players?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wouldnt you have to keep winning Sbs for the Dynasty to continue, and few if anyone see another Lombardi trophy heading to NE anytime sooon. Billicheck is the benefit of parcells players, two of the best coordinators in the last 15 yrs, Romeo and Charlie. Isnt it ironic that they havent, won a road playoff game, nor played in a AFC title game, or even Sb since those two have left. And Bill is no Jimmy Johnson, Bill Walsh, Vince Lombardi, Tom Landy or Chuck Knoll, and probably is more on par with Bill Cowher, than any of the great coaches of all time.

 

Here we go again with the Parcell's talk, and the Weis and Romeo talk. Two years ago, you said it was all because of Romeo and Weis, and Belichick wouldn't win anything without them.

Let's see, Belichick is 22-10 and 2-1 in the playoffs without them, so you need to dig deeper and say "a road playoff game, or an AFC title game". "Or even a SB since those two have left", like that's an easy thing to do.

Parcell's record over that same period is 18-14 and 0-1 in the playoffs, so I'd say he's managing OK without them.

Keep kissing Parcells arse, but keep this in mind....

With Bill Belichick as either the Def Coordinator or Assist Head Coach/Def Coord (1985-90, 1996-99) for Parcells, Parcells' record is 105-54, and 10-4 in the playoffs (2 Superbowl wins).

Without Bill Belichick in those roles, Parcells is 67-76-1, and 1-4 in the playoffs.

Edited by charty
Link to comment
Share on other sites

NE's window is closing? NO WAY!

 

NE is in great shape with the salary cap. They have (2) #1 picks next year. They have the best coach to ever coach in the NFL and the best QB in the league. This windows has been opened since 2001 and I don't see if closing any time soon.

 

The dynasty continues...

 

:D Unrealistic Homer!!!

No body can take you serious with a post this bias.

Being in "great shape" with the salary cap doesn't say much these days in terms of potential. You have to be in the same position as the 49ers (a good 40 million under) for people to stop and say "Yea, they can shell out some money this offseason"

Tom Brady is a great QB, however I don't think you can hand him "best QB in the league," thats a close race between Manning (Who doesn't have the rings, but can out throw, think, and play Brady most any day) Brady doesn't need stud recievers to play well, however there is no WR talent in NE right now and that is when Tom won the big games; when there was big talent.

 

Tom Brady has a long career left if he wants to come close to Brett Favre. Sorry. Favre has played his way into an exclusive club not many QBs will ever come close to.

 

And finally... I don't really know how you can say that Belichick is the "best coach to ever coach in the NFL" I mean he's pretty good but... best ever is quite a long shot.

 

 

 

I'm quite a homer myself, and will be loyal to my Raiders forever; however I know the difference between reality and the perfectly run/played franchise from a game of Madden. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brady had one of the better defenses in the league in 2 of those 3 Sb wins, something Montana never had...

 

 

Incorrect.

 

Montana Superbowls:

1981 - SF Defense ranked #2 in the league

1984 - SF Defense ranked #9 in the league

1988 - SF Defense ranked #3 in the league

1989 - SF Defense ranked #4 in the league

 

Brady Superbowls:

2001 - NE Defense ranked #24 in the league

2003 - NE Defense ranked #7 in the league

2004 - NE Defense ranked #9 in the league

 

So, in reality, Montana had better defenses than Brady.

 

 

I love it when idiots like "Sgt. Ryan" come here and spout off like they know what they're talking about. Bunch o' morans.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brady doesn't need stud recievers to play well, however there is no WR talent in NE right now and that is when Tom won the big games; when there was big talent.

 

 

 

Big talent? Who? David Givens? David Patten? The overrated Deion Branch?

 

When has there been big talent at WR in NE?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Big talent? Who? David Givens? David Patten? The overrated Deion Branch?

 

When has there been big talent at WR in NE?

 

 

 

I have tried to make this point. People refuse to listen.

 

JJ Stokes. Donald Hayes. Andre Davis. Others that have accompanied the Pats to a SB.

 

I think a case could be made for Caldwell and Gaffney being as talented as Givens and Branch. Time will certainly tell. Branch hasn't done very much in SEA, though, and Givens...well, he got his 24 million.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Big talent? Who? David Givens? David Patten? The overrated Deion Branch?

 

When has there been big talent at WR in NE?

 

 

Deion Branch is a very solid WR. Givens is a decent possession WR. Troy Brown was pretty good in his prime. Agreed that Patten was nothing special, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Deion Branch is a very solid WR. Givens is a decent possession WR. Troy Brown was pretty good in his prime. Agreed that Patten was nothing special, though.

 

 

 

Solid + decent + pretty good in his prime ≠ big talent.

 

This year, Branch was outperformed by D.J. Hackett (and, of course, Darrell Jackson). Givens didn't do much, even when he was on the field. And Troy Brown pretty much dropped off the face of the earth in 2003, after which NE won two Superbowls.

 

Now Brady has Reche Caldwell and Jabar F'n Gaffney, and he makes them look good. Not bad for a safe, conservative, rest on your defense type-of-guy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Solid + decent + pretty good in his prime ≠ big talent.

 

This year, Branch was outperformed by D.J. Hackett (and, of course, Darrell Jackson). Givens didn't do much, even when he was on the field. And Troy Brown pretty much dropped off the face of the earth in 2003, after which NE won two Superbowls.

 

Keep in mind that Branch was traded mid-season, is still learning the offense, and was catching passes from Seneca Wallace for a few weeks. Branch is the real deal.

 

Troy Brown was a huge part of NE winning SB 36. He was good in the Bledsoe years as well.

 

Now Brady has Reche Caldwell and Jabar F'n Gaffney, and he makes them look good.

 

Caldwell tore his ACL two years ago in SD and was doing pretty well up to that point. And I wouldn't say that he's making either of them look like anything special right now.

 

Not bad for a safe, conservative, rest on your defense type-of-guy.

 

Yep, he's pretty good until he gets into shootouts. His no TDs/four picks game at home against a bad Colts defense earlier this year isn't helping your argument.

Edited by Bill Swerski
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brady is a much better quarterback than Favre.

 

Best QBs I've seen in the past 30 years:

 

1. (tie) Brady, Montana

 

2. Marino

3. Elway

4. Favre

5. Manning

 

 

 

 

Good list.

 

 

I would go..

 

1.Marino

 

2.Montana

 

3.Elway

 

4.Favre

 

5.P.Manning

 

6.Brady

 

Manning and Brady have nowhere to go but up though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What argument? That he's never had big talent at WR?

 

 

No, this argument...

 

Not bad for a safe, conservative, rest on your defense type-of-guy.

 

 

Deion Branch may not be T.O. or Marvin Harrison, but he's definitely in the tier below. The only knock on him is that he's had difficulty staying healthy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Deion Branch may not be T.O. or Marvin Harrison, but he's definitely in the tier below. The only knock on him is that he's had difficulty staying healthy.

 

 

 

Branch has had one good season in 5 years, and he still didn't top 1,000 yards (something that 19 guys did this year.)

 

If that makes him a tier below Owens and Harrison, that's a pretty big tier.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Branch has had one good season in 5 years, and he still didn't top 1,000 yards (something that 19 guys did this year.)

 

If that makes him a tier below Owens and Harrison, that's a pretty big tier.

 

 

Branch has only played one 16-game season and spent the vast majority of his career on a team that featured the run and defense, so it's not really a surprise that he his regular-season stats aren't phenominal. Then again, you conveniently overlook Branch's four 100+ yd playoff games and his SB MVP. Neither Owens nor Harrison have accomplished either of those feats.

 

If you want to criticize Branch's health, that's fair. He certainly hasn't been reliable in that regard. But when he is healthy, I don't think there's any question that he's on the same level as guys like Wayne and D-Jax.

Edited by Bill Swerski
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brady had one of the better defenses in the league in 2 of those 3 Sb wins, something Montana never had, thus Brady didnt have to do nearly as much as Montana.

 

:D

 

1981 - defense 2nd in scoring, 2nd in yds allowed, DL Fred Dean and DBs Dwight Hicks and Ronnie Lott made the Pro Bowl

 

1984 - 1st in scoring w/ 227 pts, 9th in yds allowed, ENTIRE DEFENSIVE BACKFIELD made the Pro Bowl

 

1988 - 8th in scoring (294 pts), 3rd in yds, Charles Haley, Michael Carter, and Lott made the Pro Bowl

 

1989 - 3rd in scoring, 4th in yds; notable defensive players - Haley, Carter, Pierce Holt, Lott, Matt Millen, Bill Romanowski, Keena Turner, Eric Wright.

 

 

 

Yeah, Montana is lucky he won a GAME with those defenses. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Branch has only played one 16-game season and spent the vast majority of his career on a team that featured the run and defense, so it's not really a surprise that he his regular-season stats aren't phenominal. Then again, you conveniently overlook Branch's four 100+ yd playoff games and his SB MVP. Neither Owens nor Harrison have accomplished either of those feats.

 

If you want to criticize Branch's health, that's fair. He certainly hasn't been reliable in that regard. But when he is healthy, I don't think there's any question that he's on the same level as guys like Wayne and D-Jax.

 

 

 

Bill, you are really giving Branch too much credit. I think he's a decent WR, for sure, but that's about all. Reche has looked as good as Branch ever did this year. And Branch has been there since week 3. I can see how he might have started slow, but by now he should be in sync and know what he's doing.

 

JMO, but having seen every game in Branch's career up until this year, he is not a legit number 1 receiver. I doubt he will ever be able to carry that load.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Branch has only played one 16-game season and spent the vast majority of his career on a team that featured the run and defense, so it's not really a surprise that he his regular-season stats aren't phenominal. Then again, you conveniently overlook Branch's four 100+ yd playoff games and his SB MVP. Neither Owens nor Harrison have accomplished either of those feats.

 

If you want to criticize Branch's health, that's fair. He certainly hasn't been reliable in that regard. But when he is healthy, I don't think there's any question that he's on the same level as guys like Wayne and D-Jax.

 

 

I think that you're letting a few games skew you're thinking. Here are his career stats:

 

 

Year G GS Rec Yds Avg Lg TD 2002 13  7 43 489 11.4 49 2  2003 15 11 57 803 14.1 66 3  2004  9  9 35 454 13.0 26 4  2005 16 15 78 998 12.8 51 5  2006 14 13 53 725 13.7 38 4  

 

 

I think that it's only fair to take a player's penchant for injury into account. He's not worth much on the bench in street clothes.

 

You're the GM. Going into next year, which of these 21 guys would you take Branch over:

 

Chad Johnson

Marvin Harrison

Reggie Wayne

Roy Williams

Donald Driver

Lee Evans

Anquan Boldin

Torry Holt

Terrell Owens

Steve Smith

Andre Johnson

Laveranues Coles

Javon Walker

T.J. Houshmandzadeh

Marques Colston

Plaxico Burress

Hines Ward

Jerricho Cotchery

Darrell Jackson

Larry Fitzgerald

Randy Moss

 

Branch hasn't shown anything this year. He's dropping balls. He's barely the second best receiver on his team right now. If he's healthy and plays in every game next year, I'll bet that he won't finish in the top 15 among WRs in receptions or yards.

 

Given his history, and the way that he's performing right now, I think that it's a real stretch to compare him to guys like Reggie Wayne and Darrell Jackson.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You're the GM. Going into next year, which of these 21 guys would you take Branch over:

 

Chad Johnson

Marvin Harrison

Reggie Wayne

Roy Williams

Donald Driver

Lee Evans

Anquan Boldin

Torry Holt

Terrell Owens

Steve Smith

Andre Johnson

Laveranues Coles

Javon Walker

T.J. Houshmandzadeh

Marques Colston

Plaxico Burress

Hines Ward

Jerricho Cotchery

Darrell Jackson

Larry Fitzgerald

Randy Moss

 

Picked. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information