Farve more than just unhappy

[sunysteelfly76]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6805790

[broncosn05]

Why the hell would they tell Fox Sports? Definetely a lie.

[Chavez]

3rd rounder from the Pats?

[sunysteelfly76]

 

Maybe Brady could get Favre his second ring.

[Chavez]

 

Maybe Brady could get Favre his second ring.

 

Favre (and everyone outside of the Northeast) is apparently in a snit because he didn't get to play with Moss. Sending him to the Pats solves that particular problem.

[Randall]

 

Maybe Brady could get Favre his second ring.

 

 

 

Can't say that about the Vikings.

[wildcat2334]

just saw the interview Favre needs to shut his hole, he is becommin Curt Shilling-esque and annoying. I am ready for him to finish up in GB, set his records, and call it a career.

 

JC followed it up stating it was highly unlikely Moss was GB-bound.

[Chavez]

 

JC followed it up stating it was highly unlikely Moss was GB-bound.

 

 

It was apparently likely until NE outbid GB

 

"We could have gotten him for less money than New England did. He wanted to play in Green Bay for the amount of money we could have paid him. It (was) well worth the risk."

 

Moss, who was once represented by Favre's agent, James "Bus" Cook, and still has ties to him, was on the trading block before the NFL draft. The Packers and Patriots were the two teams seeking a deal with the Oakland Raiders for Moss' services.

 

On the night before the draft, the Packers thought they had a deal with the Raiders for a fifth-round pick, but New England stepped in and began making a strong pitch for Moss. Quarterback Tom Brady reportedly spent hours on the phone recruiting Moss, who eventually agreed to a one-year contract with the Patriots.

 

New England topped Green Bay's offer with a fourth-round pick. The Packers, sources said, weren't given the chance to increase their offer to the Raiders or Moss, although it's questionable whether general manager Ted Thompson would have done either. They were also offering a two-year contract, which wasn't ideal to Moss. Still, Favre thinks the Packers could have gotten Moss.

Sounds like Moss-to-GB had a VERY good chance of happening, if not for the Pats upping the ante. Kinda low-rent to not allow your initial trading partner a chance to outbid the second offer, but maybe that's the way things work in the NFL.

"The last thing I want to do is start anything," Favre said Saturday.

 

Sure you don't; after all, the best way to not start something is to openly criticize your GM/organization.

[Chavez]

There is no way Brett wants to leave. He is using the only leverage he can. But if the Packers are going to be in permanent rebuild mode, then he deserves to be traded if he wants. Or better, they should just spend a little money so that he can go out in style. He deserves that and more. There will be plenty of time to rebuild when number 4 retires.

 

Again, TT has been quoted on this - people asked if he was building to win another Super Bowl with Brett Favre, he said he was building to win one WITHOUT him.

 

Why would mortgage a team's LONG-TERM future to complement a once-great, now-average-to-very-good player who will be gone after '08? Everyone should be able to understand Favre's frustration - he knows the clock has nearly struck midnight on him and want a last shot, but Thompson (and McCarthy) are more interested in a timeline that does not end in two seasons.

[Chavez]

Teams can rebuild in a span of two or three years. When Favre retires and we are forced to use Aaron Rogers or Ingle Martin, we'll suck for those 2 or 3 years anyhow, so why not rebuild with the new quarterback?

Green Bay was a 10-6 playoff team in '04, so they are WELL within the window you demand. Considering how talent-poor the team was behind the first string, I'd say that the roster has been rebuilt FAR more quickly than anyone could have hoped. And in case you managed to completely miss the point above, Thompson is attempting to build so that Green Bay DOES NOT suck after Favre retires. And he has built promising young lines on both sides of the ball, which is key.

 

 

Favre is still an elite quarterback, however, he has been surrounded by mediocre talent the last few years. He has made that mediocre look better than they are. I can only think of a few quarterbacks who are more capable of winning in the present than Favre.

That's more an indictment of QB play in the NFL than a ringing endorsement of Favre.

 

Lessee, QBs in the NFL - top tier are Brady and Manning; next bunch are Palmer, Roethlisberger, Brees, McNabb (just short of the top tier, IMO), and Hasselbeck.

 

Favre isn't in the first two levels any more - he's in the next bunch with Rivers, Delhomme, Romo, etc, all of whom may be preferable to him due to the fact that they have upside.

 

Randy Moss cost $3-5 million and a fourth-round pick. That is hardly mortgaging the future. For all Brett has done for Green Bay, he deserves to have a team built to win with him, not without him. If not, then why not trade him? TT and McCarthy can build for the future, but if the Packers don't win in the present, I doubt they'll be a part of that future.

 

A team that is built to win without Favre will be MORE than capable of winning with him is part of the gameplan.

[piratesownninjas]

If this was true, I would be absolutley shocked. Favre has said many times that he is a packer for life. Favre will never wear another jersey for another team.

I am however growing tired of him calling out the organization for not landing Moss. They were outbid, and Moss wouldnt restructure his deal unless it was in New England. Moss used Favre like a bitch, telling him he wanted to be in Green Bay, then says he's only going to restructure his deal in New England... I dont know why he isnt talking about Moss.

[Outshined]

Packers put out a press release on Mothers Day in response...

 

http://www.packers.com/news/stories/2007/05/13/1/

[broncosn05]

Packers put out a press release on Mothers Day in response...

 

http://www.packers.com/news/stories/2007/05/13/1/

 

What's funnier is that there's two pictures of him in the banner.

[BeeR]

There is no way Brett wants to leave. He is using the only leverage he can.

Being an a-hole is his only leverage?

 

 

Favre is still an elite quarterback, however, he has been surrounded by mediocre talent the last few years. He has made that mediocre look better than they are.

Yeah, those WRs should be able to snatch that ball out of the opposing team's hands after Favre throws it there.

 

I don't know what's worse: Favre or his apologists.

 

I wish he would just shut up and retire. He is seriously tainting what was a great career. Maybe he needs to go back to hitting the bottle.

[Bronco Billy]

I think Favre is going to be pleasantly surprised with the 2007 version of the Packers.

 

Jackson fits into the offense nicely at starting RB, he's got enough strength & depth at WR to be able to throw capably, but where the team is really going to improve is on D - and that's going to get him to the playoffs one more time.

 

GB already has a very good LB corps - maybe one of the better crews in the league. Now with Harrell on the D-line they have someone who will take up 2 O-lieman on running plays & collapse the pocket from the inside on passing plays. Rouse is a big-time hitter & should displace Manuel almost immediately at SS. That's two quality additions right in the middle of the D & helps the LBs even more.

 

Adding Crosby as a K will make an impact also - as strange as that sounds. The kid has an absolute cannon for a leg and will make the field for scoring drives 10 yds shorter as well as helping the D with field position with touchbacks on KOs.

 

GB is going to blindside some people this year. On O they'll be more than adequate, but on D they're going to be vastly improved.

Edited May 14, 2007 by Bronco Billy

[The Wolf]

Favre statement...per KFFL...NOT looking ot be traded:

 

KFFL) Green Bay Packers QB Brett Favre released the following statement Monday, May 14, stating his desire to remain with the team. "I was frustrated a couple weeks back when Randy Moss was traded to New England. I never wanted to be traded and I don't want to be traded. I want to be in Green Bay. I want to finish my career as a Packer. Sometimes when I get frustrated I let my emotions get the better of me. As I said in February when I announced that I was coming back, I am excited about the young talent on our team and the improvements we're going to see from one year to the next. I really enjoy the young guys I'm playing with. I'm working hard down in Mississippi right now, rehabbing, and I plan to be in the best shape of my life. I look forward to playing with this team and seeing what we can do. I think we can be pretty good."

[Bill Swerski]

just saw the interview Favre needs to shut his hole, he is becommin Curt Shilling-esque and annoying.

 

+1

 

I've been in Brett's corner for a long time, but I'm really getting sick of his crap. While I can definitely see why he would be disappointed in them not trading for Moss, geez, he comes off as being DISSATISFIED with Driver and Jennings. I can name a number of teams who would love to have those two as their starting wideouts.

 

JC followed it up stating it was highly unlikely Moss was GB-bound.

 

JC reported that Moss wasn't interested in going to the Packers because their chances of winning a ring aren't that good. Can't say I blame him.

 

If this was true, I would be absolutley shocked. Favre has said many times that he is a packer for life. Favre will never wear another jersey for another team.

 

With the way that things have been between Favre and Ted Thompson over the past couple of years, he just may renege on that oath of loyalty.

[Cunning Runt]

There is no way Brett wants to leave. He is using the only leverage he can. But if the Packers are going to be in permanent rebuild mode, then he deserves to be traded if he wants. Or better, they should just spend a little money so that he can go out in style. He deserves that and more. There will be plenty of time to rebuild when number 4 retires.

 

 

 

I call BS on saying Favre or any player "deserves" anything other than paycheck that I'm guessing he gladly cashed. The Packers and football in general have made Favre wealthy beyond his wildest dreams. They owe him nothing more than whatever his contract calls for.

Edited May 14, 2007 by Cunning Runt

[piratesownninjas]

+1

 

I've been in Brett's corner for a long time, but I'm really getting sick of his crap. While I can definitely see why he would be disappointed in them not trading for Moss, geez, he comes off as being DISSATISFIED with Driver and Jennings. I can name a number of teams who would love to have those two as their starting wideouts.

JC reported that Moss wasn't interested in going to the Packers because their chances of winning a ring aren't that good. Can't say I blame him.

With the way that things have been between Favre and Ted Thompson over the past couple of years, he just may renege on that oath of loyalty.

 

I agree with what Bill is saying here...

I am shocked at his whole situation.

[The Wolf]

+1

 

I've been in Brett's corner for a long time, but I'm really getting sick of his crap. While I can definitely see why he would be disappointed in them not trading for Moss, geez, he comes off as being DISSATISFIED with Driver and Jennings. I can name a number of teams who would love to have those two as their starting wideouts.

JC reported that Moss wasn't interested in going to the Packers because their chances of winning a ring aren't that good. Can't say I blame him.

With the way that things have been between Favre and Ted Thompson over the past couple of years, he just may renege on that oath of loyalty.

 

 

Agree 100%...Driver and Jennings cannot be happy about that one. Think Brett just lost a little bit of respect in the huddle?

[kraftykraft]

Agree 100%...Driver and Jennings cannot be happy about that one. Think Brett just lost a little bit of respect in the huddle?

 

You will know that the danger point has been reached when John Madden's manlust for Brett falls to a mere mancrush.

 

Which brings up an interesting point. If Favre were to go to the Pats, as some people in this thread have joked about, what would be the results for games where Madden was commentating? I can see two possibilities--that Madden would ooze so many bodily fluids while holding forth on his Tom Brady/Brett Favre manlove that John would expire from dehydration sometime in the 3rd quarter, or the presence of Madden's two inamoratas on the same sideline would create a critical mass of perfection that would be incompatible with the reality of this imperfect universe and would therefore cancel out all existence.

[Vet]

Favre is fat and can't play anymore.

[PantherDave]

It would be a shame to go from being the conqering hero who brought the title back to title town to over-staying your welcome and go out as a selfish prick.

[BeeR]

It would be a shame to go from being the conqering hero who brought the title back to title town to over-staying your welcome and go out as a selfish prick.

? You act like that hasn't already happened. (Well OK he hasn't left yet....)

[Chavez]

 

Ted Thompson dismantled that team. We lost Mike Wahle, Mike Flanagan, Marco Rivera, Darren Sharper, Mike McKenzie, and Javon Walker. That's 6 Pro-Bowl caliber players that we had in 2003 and 2004 that we don't have now. How many Pro-Bowl caliber players has TT drafted? One: AJ Hawk (and I'm not even going to give him much credit on that pick since it was the 5th pick and the consensus picked Hawk). He has produced a bunch of players who are clearly capable of playing in the NFL, but I don't envision any of the others ever going to a Pro-Bowl (though it's obviously a bit premature to say definitavely). So if by being rebuilt and promising you mean average or mediocre, then yes, TT has rebuilt this team. He has yet to produce the sort of players that win Superbowls.

 

Ted Thompson wants the Packers to be good after Favre retires. I don't doubt that. In fact, I think that has been his gameplan the entire time. TT's ego wants "his" team to succeed, not the team he inherited. If the Packer's win a Superbowl with Favre and players from previous regimes, then those players and regimes get the credit.

 

Point by point:

 

- Flanagan and Rivera were getting old, and it was time for them to go - Wahle certianly hurt, but let's remember the career paths of those 3 offensive linemen - Rivera showed up in '97 but didn't start making an impact until about '00; Wahle flopped at LT before becoming one of the best guards in the game (and he's the one who it really hurt to lose), and Flanagan sat on IR for 2 or so years because of a severely broken leg. You can't laud those guys and then rip Thompson's drafts - at this point, Moll, Colledge, and Spitz are FAR more accomplished than the 3 guys you bemoan losing were 2 or even 3 years into their careers. Now, will they be BETTER than them? That's a tall order. But use your head.

 

- McKenzie left on Mike Sherman's watch, Thompson had little to do with that

 

- Sharper and Walker you can maybe in varying degrees pin on Thompson. Sharper he low-balled, but I don't think there was much you could have done with Walker, aside from up his contract, and even that wouldn't have made him happy by the end of it.

 

As far as Thompson wanting "his" team to succeed - isn't he the guy who gave generous contracts/extension to Al Harris, Kampman, Driver, Franks, Barnett, Cullen Jenkins, Scott Wells, and an Ahman Green who was coming off what had in the past been a career ending injury? Isn't he the guy who keeps the overpaid KGB around? So far as I can recall, none of those players are "his" guys.

 

I'd agree that Brady and Manning are the class of NFL quarterbacks and that Favre might no longer be in that category (though he was in this class in 2003 and 2004, so it might have more to do with the supporting cast than anything else). But he is definately at least in the next category. Roethlisberger and Hasselbeck don't even compare to Favre (especially the 2006 versions since both regressed from 2005). Palmer might be better than Favre (though this also might have to do with the supporting cast). An argument could be made for Brees being better, but I'd rather have Favre's rocket arm against a good defense over Brees' finesse game (Brees is probably as or more effective against bad defenses). McNabb might be better when healthy, but I'd rather have Favre for the whole year than McNabb for only half a season.

 

A lot of those guys get an edge simply because they have upside; Favre is clearly on the way down. He's still capable, don't get me wrong, but not what he was.

 

The 2007 Packers look poised to win 7 to 10 games with Favre. Sans Favre, they would probably win 5 to 7 games. Aaron Rogers looks like he'll be nothing more than average. Ingle Martin might actually have a greater chance of being great. Either way, the Packers will struggle with either at quarterback. Neither a Rogers nor Martin led team is going to win a Superbowl in their first couple of years at the helm. So why not use that time to rebuild instead of when we have an aging franchise quarterback at the helm?

Why postpone what needs to be done? Why not develop young players now? Why run yourself up against the salcap in a last-gasp effort to get Favre a title?

 

Thompson may or may not be a good GM - but at least his approach isn't going to hamstring the team for the next guy (if the next guy is coming in soon) a la Mike Sherman.

Teams no longer build on a "5-year plan" as they did in the past. Teams can be turned around in a year or two. While I don't advocate Dan Snyder style spending, sacrificing a little bit of the future for Favre is the least the Packers can do. Favre gave us 15 straight good years. How easily people forget the 20-some bad years before Favre. I'd sell my soul for that man (i.e. sign Moss). Having a couple of bad years after Favre leaves wouldn't even faze me. It might even be fitting. Just as sending him off Elway-style would be fitting. The Packers owe him at least the oppurtunity to win another Superbowl.

I don't think that you can build a team in less than 3 or 4 years. At least not a team that will have sustainable success; maybe the Rams and NO managed to do so, but those are cases of absolute blind luck lightning strikes, to a large extent.