i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 (edited) Alright boys...another free agency issue, this one with playoff implications...responses GREATLY appreciated! This particular league is in its 3rd year....all local guys, mostly all friends, family or acquaintances. In year's past, a rule (though not written in our bylaws) was in place that once any early game (I.e Thursday game) has been played, rosters are locked to free agency and trades for the rest of that week. It is an unwritten rule. However, because many of our owners play in different leagues, owners often forget rules from one league to another. In Week 1 this year, after the opening Thursday game, two teams made free agent pick-ups on the Friday. One of the teams actually wrote to the Commish to see if it was legal, and he was told it was (apparently, even the Commish forgot, so he allowed the moves). It was then determined that the moves were not legal after discussions between the Commish and another coach a few days later. However, the Commish did not reverse the moves, nor did he publicly alert the league as to what the official rule was...it was just "let go", giving everyone the impression that the moves were legal. Fast forward to Week 12. A team in dire need of a QB had McNabb on their roster, and was going to be forced into starting Kyle Boller. After learning on Friday that McNabb was definitely downgraded and likely out, he moved to pick up Feeley. The Commish reversed his move, saying it was illegal. The owner was upset, saying it had happened earlier in the year during Week 1 and the moves weren't reversed, and more importantly, there was nothing in the rules stating he couldn't make a move after a Thursday game had begun. The Commish replied that he did indeed alert the league that moves after Thursday games were illegal, via a post on the league message board last week. Sure enough, that language exists....however, it was at the bottom of a post about an entirely different topic that the owner didn't read. There was nothing in the rules that stated it was illegal, nor was there any mention earlier in the year that it was illegal, even after two teams had made moves like this during Week 1. The Commish's argument: he posted it in a post to everyone, and it is your job as an owner to read every word of every post from the Commish. The owner's argument: (1) moves were made during Week 1 that weren't reversed, so there is no way you can let those moves stand and not let others benefit from it later in the year, and (2) there is nothing written in the rules prohibiting it. So my question: should the move to pick up Feeley have been allowed? Edited November 26, 2007 by i_am_the_swammi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperCharger Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 No new rules in the middle of a season! If it was allowed week 1 it should be allowed week 17. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 The move should be allowed because he set a precedent allowing it week 1..Also if waivers close after thursdays games FCFS should not be allowed to go through the site..He should have physically shut down waivers to make it impossible to process..Thats after the fact though..Even if he wrote it in as a blurb I dont think he has the right to change it midstream afetr allowing it once before..He should have to ride it out that way and make it official next year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Country Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 I agree with the others. THe precedent was set thus making it rule that moves are allowed. Unless your commish has total authority to change rules midseason with no league vote, once he allowed the moves in week one to stand, he set the precedent that stands in place of any unwritten rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackass Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 The move should be allowed because he set a precedent allowing it week 1..Also if waivers close after thursdays games FCFS should not be allowed to go through the site..He should have physically shut down waivers to make it impossible to process..Thats after the fact though..Even if he wrote it in as a blurb I dont think he has the right to change it midstream afetr allowing it once before..He should have to ride it out that way and make it official next year Agree with this. If after week 1, he had come out and said something like "this is an exception since the rules weren't clear, but from here on out, no pickups after thursday's games", that would have clarified things. But otherwise, everyone would think that that was ok. And then to include the reminder at the end of some post - pretty weak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Beatings Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 No new rules in the middle of a season! If it was allowed week 1 it should be allowed week 17. I tend to agree with this. Its one thing if he would have reversed the Week 1 moves, but he didn't. You can't just "let it go" for one team (or a acouple of teams) but then not "let it go" for others. He has to be consistent which means the Week 12 moves should be allowed. He can then formally add this rule to your laws in the off-season. No more unwritten rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 (edited) No new rules in the middle of a season! If it was allowed week 1 it should be allowed week 17. Actually, its a rule (albeit unwritten) thats been in place for the last two years. The Commish forgot the rule himself, and thus it allowed two teams to make illegal moves. I think the issue at large is that he didn't reverse those moves, giving the impression that they were allowed. Edited November 26, 2007 by i_am_the_swammi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 The owner's argument: (1) moves were made during Week 1 that weren't reversed, so there is no way you can let those moves stand and not let others benefit from it later in the year, and (2) there is nothing written in the rules prohibiting it. no way you can let it go in week one and not let it go now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperCharger Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Actually, its a rule (albeit unwritten) thats been in place for the last two years. The Commish forgot to enforce it in Week 1, and thus it allwoed two teams to make illegal moves. I think the issue at large is that he didn't reverse those moves, giving everyone the impression that they were allowed. Unwritten rules aren't actually rules but a moral guideline. Rules are written AND enforced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyOne Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 The Feely pickup is legal and should be allowed to stand. Not only is there no written rule against it (so no rule against it), but the precedent was set when the Commish allowed it to happen earlier in the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Precedent had been set regarding roster moves after Week 1. Since there are no rules written in your by-laws expressly forbidding roster moves after a Thursday game, it cannot be changed mid stream anyway. That's two strikes against your commish. The poor boy should have been allowed to pick up Feeley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Pat!!! Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Unwritten rules aren't actually rules but a moral guideline. Rules are written AND enforced. Ding, ding, ding. If it's not written, it doesn't exist. No such thing as an unwritten rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 Agree with this. If after week 1, he had come out and said something like "this is an exception since the rules weren't clear, but from here on out, no pickups after thursday's games", that would have clarified things. But otherwise, everyone would think that that was ok. And then to include the reminder at the end of some post - pretty weak. This is the owner's biggest source of frustration at this point...why was it not made perfectly clear after Week 1? He states correctly that he could have picked Feeley up on Wednesday before the Thursday games, had he known Thursday was the deadline. But since he missed reading some arbitrary post about another topic (in which this rule was addressed), he missed reading a key piece of info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 Ding, ding, ding. If it's not written, it doesn't exist. No such thing as an unwritten rule. even if he mentioned the rule in a post last week? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 FYI...here is the post from 11/17 in which the rule was mentioned...it was a post about a trade that was granted, and who approved it: trade Posted to Everyone Nov 17, 02:35 pm ET Trade approved by Crusaders & Babblin Assasian. I will be posting the payouts on the board, might not get to it till tomorrow(sorry Dave, I know I suck) but it will be posted. Remember Trade deadline is Wednesday night @ 11:59. Free Agency is open through the season, but is not active after the first game of the week is played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Sounds like an attempt at a midseason rule change. Posting about it doesn't make it acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Precedence was set in week one when he allowed it. If its not a WRITTEN rule, then it doesn't exist. The commish has no legs to stand on, period. The McNabb owner got the shaft. And FWIW the unwritten rule is stupid too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 Sounds like an attempt at a midseason rule change. Posting about it doesn't make it acceptable. Nah, the Commish is a good guy, but new at the job. He says he didn't reverse the Week 1 moves because he realized his mistake after Week 1 was completed, and since one of the players acquired Friday was used on Sunday, he felt it would be too big an issue to try to reverse the moves. But again, the rule was in place (but not written) for the prior two years this league has been operating, and because of reminders in years past, this dilema was never an issue. The Commish just forgot the rule in Week 1 this year, and two illegal moves were processed. The question is: once the Commish reminded the league via a post on the message board that these moves are illegal, was this the right thing to do? The owner in question missed this post, and was just going off the precenddent set in Week 1, as well as the written rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 The question is: once the Commish reminded the league via a post on the message board that these moves are illegal, was this the right thing to do? The owner in question missed this post, and was just going off the precenddent set in Week 1, as well as the written rules. But not only is it a crazy week (holiday) but you even mention about these guys being in multiple leagues, whos to say he remembered this being a "unwritten" rule in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Nah, the Commish is a good guy, but new at the job. He says he didn't reverse the Week 1 moves because he realized his mistake after Week 1 was completed, and since one of the players acquired Friday was used on Sunday, he felt it would be too big an issue to try to reverse the moves. But again, the rule was in place (but not written) for the prior two years this league has been operating, and because of reminders in years past, this dilema was never an issue. The Commish just forgot the rule in Week 1 this year, and two illegal moves were processed. The question is: once the Commish reminded the league via a post on the message board that these moves are illegal, was this the right thing to do? The owner in question missed this post, and was just going off the precenddent set in Week 1, as well as the written rules. Good guy, bad guy, doesn't matter. In the absence of an unwritten rule, league owners only have precedent set by past actions to go on. Sending out a post, that may not even be read thoroughly by all, is no substitute for what is written in the rules and what the commish has done in the past given similar situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxfactor Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Sounds like an attempt at a midseason rule change. Posting about it doesn't make it acceptable. Agreed. Owner should be allowed to pick up Feely as well as others on Fridays for the rest of the season. The unwritten rule makes no sense to me anyway. Usually only one game played on Thursday. Why should someone not be allowed to make a FA pickup after that when the majority of the games are still on Sunday and the official injury report does not come out till Friday? Let the picks continue this season then vote on a rule next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Pat!!! Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 even if he mentioned the rule in a post last week? If it's been an unwritten rule for two seasons, someone should have written it down. Problem would have been solved. Again, mentioning something that is not clearly stated in the rules, is not a reminder of a rule, it's more like a gentleman's agreement. He doesn't have a leg to stand on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 26, 2007 Author Share Posted November 26, 2007 OK, so now that most of the responses are in, it appears unanimous that the Feeley move should have been allowed to stand. Now, what should be done about it? Here is dilema #2: suppose the Commish bends, and inserts Feeley in the Owner's line-up. The owner's opponent is going to have a bird. Further, other owner's may chime in and say "Hey, we wanted to make moves on Friday and Saturday, but we read the post, and knew we weren't allowed. We followed your instructions, and now we are penalized?" Should the commish, at this point, do something, or do nothing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackass Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 OK, so now that most of the responses are in, it appears unanimous that the Feeley move should have been allowed to stand. Now, what should be done about it? Here is dilema #2: suppose the Commish bends, and inserts Feeley in the Owner's line-up. The owner's opponent is going to have a bird. Further, other owner's may chime in and say "Hey, we wanted to make moves on Friday and Saturday, but we read the post, and knew we weren't allowed. We followed your instructions, and now we are penalized?" Should the commish, at this point, do something, or do nothing? You've got to be kidding. This needed to be resolved BEFORE the games were played. Since it wasn't, someone's going to be extremely pissed. Good luck working this one out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 OK, so now that most of the responses are in, it appears unanimous that the Feeley move should have been allowed to stand. Now, what should be done about it? Here is dilema #2: suppose the Commish bends, and inserts Feeley in the Owner's line-up. The owner's opponent is going to have a bird. Further, other owner's may chime in and say "Hey, we wanted to make moves on Friday and Saturday, but we read the post, and knew we weren't allowed. We followed your instructions, and now we are penalized?" Should the commish, at this point, do something, or do nothing? The commish should allow Feeley into the lineup and change the score. The other owners would just have to accept it and move on. They can say coulda woulda all they want, but this onwer DID try and was turned down. He went to do what he thought would help his team, especially after he knew it was allowed earlier. Also the two owners that it was allowed for should have had a leg to stand on if they wanted to make moves, cause they were allowed to do it before, you can't say well I'll allow it this time, but not next....it isn't fair. It's not in the rules plain and simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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