ESPN Just released

[cliaz]

NFL owners have opted out of the Labor contract - no contract as of 2011. No link yet.

 

 

 

EDIT - sorry - this should read that ESPN just released that I am a day late and a dollar short.

Edited May 20, 2008 by cliaz

[Bronco Billy]

No surprise here. And they are acting early to give plenty of time for negotiations.

 

The players got an incredibly generous percentage of gross revenues when the CBA was extended. That figured to be a really burr under the owners' collective saddle. The cap is shooting upward at a meteoric rate, and mediocre FAs are getting relatively luxurious salaries in FA because of the gap in where the cap was a couple of years ago and where it is now.

 

This is a good, common sense stance to nip this in the bud and create a bit more sane structure. There was potential for a hugh dust-up down the road if gross revenues dropped by any significant amount - or even if they plateaued.

[detlef]

As a fan, we are put into a very unenviable position. On one hand, we're basically paying for all of this. I mean, I'd be all about capping salaries if it meant that the NFL experience wouldn't continue to get more and more expensive to us. However, who amongst us is so naive as to think that would happen? Anyone who's got enough jack to own a franchise didn't get there by avoiding every chance they could to maximize profits.

 

So, if we're going to continue to get squeezed, I'd just as soon as more of the money go to the guy who's risking life long injuries rather than the owners.

 

It's too bad that we don't have a fan's union.

[Riffraff]

So, if we're going to continue to get squeezed, I'd just as soon as more of the money go to the guy who's risking life long injuries rather than the owners.

 

It's too bad that we don't have a fan's union.

I'm the opposite, I think you will always find football players that would play for $25,000 to $250,000 a year.

But it's hard to find people with $800mil laying around to buy a team and invest in pure entertainment.

 

The owners have a lot to lose financially, the players can just go get regular jobs with that (mostly free) education they get.

College football would still exist even if there wasn't a pro league.

 

Agreed about the fan union.

[Grits and Shins]

I'm the opposite, I think you will always find football players that would play for $25,000 to $250,000 a year.

But it's hard to find people with $800mil laying around to buy a team and invest in pure entertainment.

 

The owners have a lot to lose financially, the players can just go get regular jobs with that (mostly free) education they get.

College football would still exist even if there wasn't a pro league.

 

Agreed about the fan union.

 

I tend to agree.

 

Professional players are paid much too exorbitantly. These guys have basically gotten a free ride their whole life until finally some guy that has too much money rewards them with millions of dollars because of his ability to run fast, catch a ball, throw a ball or run with the ball. Too bad these guys can't get a dose of reality by actually having to get a real education, get a real job and actually work for a living.

[gsmayes]

blah, life isn't fair and your skill set only commands $50,000 while their's nets millions. they should get their fair share.

[Bronco Billy]

they should get their fair share.

 

Exactly. Which is why the owners want to go back to the table.

 

Well put.

[Randall]

They need to fix rookie salaries and help reitred players.

 

 

Especially the ones from the 60's that are getting $185 a month.

[Seahawks21]

I tend to agree.

 

Professional players are paid much too exorbitantly. These guys have basically gotten a free ride their whole life until finally some guy that has too much money rewards them with millions of dollars because of his ability to run fast, catch a ball, throw a ball or run with the ball. Too bad these guys can't get a dose of reality by actually having to get a real education, get a real job and actually work for a living.

Are you nuts!?!?!? Would you rather all of the money we pay go to some rich white guy who has never even been on a football field?? Why should he get all the money?? Not one person paid to see him. All these athletes are getting bent over and used by the middle man. All the guy does is sit there and collect money. That is it. Baseball players had it right almost 100 years ago when some broke apart and tried to form their own league. If they would have had more support, it would have worked, and professional sports as we know it would be changed dramatically. The players are the product. Not the owners. I don't know how the players haven't been smart enough yet to just cut the owners out of the loop. Hire people to do their books and schedule the stadiums, rather than being the help themselves. Start their own league. Fans would show up in bundles, just the same, to watch professional football, only there isn't some fat bald white guy sitting there with his hand open to take 80% off the top first. Put a commissioner on your payroll. Hire the coaches, get some people to run your league office, and walk away filthy rich. I'm not saying athletes aren't overpaid. All I'm saying is that with todays currency, say there is 700 million profit for a team, due to jersey sales and tickets and yada yada yada. If you lower the players salaries, all that means is more money for the owners, which doesn't seem fair to me. The players deserve the biggest piece of that pie, no matter how big the pie is. If the players are generating all that money, let them have it, don't say they are overpaid. The money is going to end up somewhere. They have done a lot more to earn that money than the owners have.

[godtomsatan]

Professional players are paid much too exorbitantly. These guys have basically gotten a free ride their whole life until finally some guy that has too much money rewards them with millions of dollars because of his ability to run fast, catch a ball, throw a ball or run with the ball. Too bad these guys can't get a dose of reality by actually having to get a real education, get a real job and actually work for a living.

 

They are paid what they are worth to the person paying them. Just like we all are.

[godtomsatan]

As a fan, we are put into a very unenviable position. On one hand, we're basically paying for all of this. I mean, I'd be all about capping salaries if it meant that the NFL experience wouldn't continue to get more and more expensive to us. However, who amongst us is so naive as to think that would happen? Anyone who's got enough jack to own a franchise didn't get there by avoiding every chance they could to maximize profits.

 

So, if we're going to continue to get squeezed, I'd just as soon as more of the money go to the guy who's risking life long injuries rather than the owners.

 

I'm not going to say ticket prices should be higher by any means, but have you looked at the ticket prices of an NBA, NHL, MLB, MLS, or NHL game of late? The NFL is a GREAT value IMO.

 

It's too bad that we don't have a fan's union.

 

I understand the sentiment, but the remote control and expenditure of disposable income elsewhere is about as organized as it gets.

[Seahawks21]

They are paid what they are worth to the person paying them. Just like we all are.

come on. comparing us to nfl players? do millions and millions of people watch us on tv? When was the last time somebody went out and paid $100 for a cheap copy of the shirt you wear to work everyday? I'm usually with ya, but that kind of comparison may look good in theory but in no way encompasses the reality of the situation. In most of our jobs, we sell or produce the product that our owner sells. In this case, the players themselves ARE the product. Somebody is essentially taking 80% off the top to be their business manager.

 

The players can play without the owners. The owners cannot exist without the players. I understand that this is how business goes, but it doesn't make it right. I just don't get how the players haven't figured out yet that they don't need to be owned.

 

I will put it this way. I painted houses during my college summers. If I own the van, the painting equipment and the knowledge, and all my owner has is the name of the business...which gets him 80% of the profit from all of the work that I do....why wouldn't I just start my own company so I can be the one making the 80%? The NFL players own their bodies, which are the van and painting equipment. They don't need the owners. All the owner does in this model is sit there with his hand open. It is only a matter of time before the players figure this out again.

Edited May 20, 2008 by Seahawks21

[godtomsatan]

come on. comparing us to nfl players? do millions and millions of people watch us on tv? When was the last time somebody went out and paid $100 for a cheap copy of the shirt you wear to work everyday? I'm usually with ya, but that kind of comparison may look good in theory but in no way encompasses the reality of the situation.

 

Sandra, chill. Don't argue with people agreeing with you.

[Big Score 1]

If memory serves me right, during the last round of CBA talks a matter came to the publics attention fairly late in the negotiations & proved to be fairly contentious amongst the owners.

 

That contentious matter was.....revenue sharing.

 

I know Jerry Jones & some of the other owners with wildly profitable clubs were very vocal about the smaller market & less aggressive clubs (Buffalo Bills were brought up as an example) getting a free ride on their coat tails, due to the current CBA profit sharing formula.

 

I'd hazard a fairly edumacted guess that this issue will be heavily debated (behind closed doors I'm sure) during the next round of CBA talks.

[Bronco Billy]

Are you nuts!?!?!? Would you rather all of the money we pay go to some rich white guy who has never even been on a football field?? Why should he get all the money?? Not one person paid to see him.

 

 

Pro athletes being "bent over". Now that's rich.

 

You do understand the concept of capitalism, don't you?

[policyvote]

They need to fix rookie salaries and help reitred players.

 

 

Exactly. The goal of the incredible high school football player is no longer to play 15 years in the pros, win championshps and get rich off endorsements. It's to keep the hype machine going long enough to get drafted in the first round. Take a guy like Glenn Dorsey. He dominates high school, gets tagged as a five-star recruit, has his pick of big-time college programs, and all he has to do is use his god-given talent to look AMAZING against SEC offensive linemen . . . now he's set for life and he's never played a down in the NFL, nor had to face elite interior offensive linemen. He might continue to dominate, or he might be the next Ryan Sims. Who knows? Either way, from the day he signs his deal, he'll never have to put in another honest day's work in his life . . . so the likelyhood that he DOES bust out escalates dramatically.

 

Peace

policy

[Bronco Billy]

I will put it this way. I painted houses during my college summers. If I own the van, the painting equipment and the knowledge, and all my owner has is the name of the business...which gets him 80% of the profit from all of the work that I do....why wouldn't I just start my own company so I can be the one making the 80%? The NFL players own their bodies, which are the van and painting equipment. They don't need the owners. All the owner does in this model is sit there with his hand open. It is only a matter of time before the players figure this out again.

 

again.

 

What a crappy analogy. Do you really want the players running the league? Are you nuts?

 

The players are currently taking 60% of gross revenues. That's an outrageous amount for any company to pay one sector of its employees. Do you think that is the only operating expenses that NFL teams have - the players' salaries?

 

You are truly unbelievable, but your amazing naivete' is kind of cute.

Edited May 20, 2008 by Bronco Billy

[Seahawks21]

THis isn't about what I want. THe playes can cover operating costs just as easily as the owners can. Its not like there won't be investors lining up. I understand capitalism, took a course. Was it Al Spalding that wrote the book about this? I advise reading it sometime, I'll try to find a title after I get off work. Capitalism is a business model where there is a product you are selling, not people. Are you really implying that we should give the owners a bigger piece of this pie?? I tell you what, when I pay all that money to watch a game, I think the money deserves to go to the players, not some old fart that inherited his father's business. That guy is not getting his life shortened. That guy does not work countless hours doing miserable things to earn that money. Just because it is the way business is in this country, does not make it right. I can guarantee you we see some sort of proessional sports league in our lifetime that is created and owned by the players of that sport. Soon after, all major sports will be that way. There is just no reason that the rich white guy should be getting all the money from what these athletes are able to do. None. No reason at all.

[godtomsatan]

What a crappy analogy. Do you really want the players running the league? Are you nuts?

 

Considering the 30% turnover from year to year, I don't believe that it's even possible.

 

The players are currently taking 60% of gross revenues. That's an outrageous amount for any company to pay one sector of its employees. Do you think that is the only operating expenses that NFL teams have - the players' salaries?

 

Do you have figures BB? Because I can't imagine a franchise having operating expenses beyond players salaries exceeding even 20% of the salary cap.

[Grits and Shins]

Are you nuts!?!?!? Would you rather all of the money we pay go to some rich white guy who has never even been on a football field?? Why should he get all the money?? Not one person paid to see him. All these athletes are getting bent over and used by the middle man. All the guy does is sit there and collect money. That is it. Baseball players had it right almost 100 years ago when some broke apart and tried to form their own league. If they would have had more support, it would have worked, and professional sports as we know it would be changed dramatically. The players are the product. Not the owners. I don't know how the players haven't been smart enough yet to just cut the owners out of the loop. Hire people to do their books and schedule the stadiums, rather than being the help themselves. Start their own league. Fans would show up in bundles, just the same, to watch professional football, only there isn't some fat bald white guy sitting there with his hand open to take 80% off the top first. Put a commissioner on your payroll. Hire the coaches, get some people to run your league office, and walk away filthy rich. I'm not saying athletes aren't overpaid. All I'm saying is that with todays currency, say there is 700 million profit for a team, due to jersey sales and tickets and yada yada yada. If you lower the players salaries, all that means is more money for the owners, which doesn't seem fair to me. The players deserve the biggest piece of that pie, no matter how big the pie is. If the players are generating all that money, let them have it, don't say they are overpaid. The money is going to end up somewhere. They have done a lot more to earn that money than the owners have.

 

I think the exorbitant ticket prices are outrageous as well, which is why I refuse to go to very many ball games.

 

Athletes getting "bent over" ... PUHLEASE. They are getting paid millions of dollars to run hard, throw the ball well, catch the ball, hit the ball, carry the ball ... and some of them are dumber than a rock. And some of them get paid millions of dollars without ever having to earn it ... they get paid based on percieved potential.

 

And by your analogy Bill Gates should not be a bizzionaire either because his employees to all the work.

Edited May 20, 2008 by Grits and Shins

[Seahawks21]

I think the exorbitant ticket prices are outrageous as well, which is why I refuse to go to very many ball games.

 

Athletes getting "bent over" ... PUHLEASE. They are getting paid millions of dollars to run hard, throw the ball well, catch the ball, hit the ball, carry the ball ... and some of them are dumber than a rock. And some of them get paid millions of dollars without ever having to earn it ... they get paid based on percieved potential.

 

And by your analogy Bill Gates should not be a bizzionaire either because his employees to all the work.

Athletes are getting bent over relative to what owners are pocketing, absolutely!!!

 

If one of Bill Gates' employees quits, he can very easily find a person to do the exact same thing. Go ahead and try to find yourself another LT in this whole wide world. Bill Gates makes products, these guys ARE the product. Huge difference. You can't train somebody to do what an athlete does. They are not replaceable, at least with the same quality. Take away the computer and see how Bill Gates does.

[Grits and Shins]

Athletes are getting bent over relative to what owners are pocketing, absolutely!!!

 

If one of Bill Gates' employees quits, he can very easily find a person to do the exact same thing. Go ahead and try to find yourself another LT in this whole wide world. Bill Gates makes products, these guys ARE the product. Huge difference. You can't train somebody to do what an athlete does. They are not replaceable, at least with the same quality. Take away the computer and see how Bill Gates does.

 

Here is a concept for you. The guy that takes the risk gets the reward. Owners risk millions of dollars that the athletes they hire will perform and when they do they reap the reward. Without the owners where do you think LT would be? He'd be turning hamburgers some where.

 

Nobody is irreplaceable. In every walk of life you have people who excel at what they do and can not be replaced by a person that does exactly the same thing at the same level.

 

The owners lay out the necessary money to field a team and many owners lay out all or a portion of the cost required to build a place to play the game. Without the financial backing of the owners there would not be an NFL. There are a great many players that would be in jail right now without the owners building an NFL for them to play in.

[piratesownninjas]

Professional players are paid much too exorbitantly. These guys have basically gotten a free ride their whole life until finally some guy that has too much money rewards them with millions of dollars because of his ability to run fast, catch a ball, throw a ball or run with the ball. Too bad these guys can't get a dose of reality by actually having to get a real education, get a real job and actually work for a living.

The players are paid there worth... If they were not worth it, they wouldn't have gotten the contract offers... Tomlinson and Manning put asses in seats, sell jersey's and the like. They make the league and teams ten fold the amount of dollars they have on their contract.

What's the difference between an athlete making a ton of money versus a CEO of a company? An athlete can run faster, jump higher, throw farther while a CEO uses his wits and smarts to run a company.

[piratesownninjas]

In every walk of life you have people who excel at what they do and can not be replaced by a person that does exactly the same thing at the same level.

This is where your argument fails... There are only a handful of people in the world on Tom Brady and Peyton Mannings level... Actually, there is only two people. Elite athletes cannot be replaced at any point. You have to wait... Sometimes a decade to find a player on the level at which they play.

[puzzle head]

Hi all

 

Any NFL game is expensive. I do not disagree with the money the player receive. Remember that they only play for around 10 years if they are lucky. So the high salaries they receive, to me, are justified.

 

My concern is how this will impact fantasy football. If the players strike, will I be drafting David Smith the starting running back for Tampa Bay in the 1sr round or Tony Jones?