SLAYER Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Are you seriously trying to say Jake is a better QB than Brees? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Because this is a fantasy forum, I think many folks get caught up in stats in trying to decide who are the better QBs. While Brees plays in a pass-happy offense, I think he gets a lot of credit he doesn't necessarily deserve (similar to Romo) as being a top-QB. I am just continuing to point out that a lot goes into making a QB "good" than stats...presense on the field, decision making, leadership qualities. I'm not sure Brees surpasses Delhomme in any of these areas. In the preseason, we debated over past performance in these areas, and how his poor play cost the Saints early in 2007. Thru 15 weeks of 2008, Brees' lacking in these areas has cost his team dearly in more than a few games this year I don't know if Brees is better than Delhomme...but I think its much much closer than most "stats-oriented" discussions would lead you to beleive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 (edited) interesting bump. Brees's INTs have hurt his team, but has put up stellar stats....while Delhomme, while stuggling at times, has definitely been the better leader and taken his team to within a win of hte #1 seed in the NFC. You mean like going 7 for 27, 72 yds and 4 picks vs Oak.and kind of struggling? Jake has a monster running game and a D that is capable of keeping his team in games. To credit him for "taking his team with in a win of the #1 seed" is perhaps giving him a bit more credit than he deserves. That performance I mentioned above. That was a win. Though I'm pretty sure he'd be the first one to admit that he didn't "lead his team" to that victory. There have also been plenty of games where they won, if not despite him like the Oakland game, but at least without needing him. Now, I'm not going to fault him for that. I'm sure he made enough plays to keep drives alive. However, when your D is playing great and you've got two backs getting 100 yds and a few TDs, it's a pretty easy position to play. Is it not? Brees has not only had to contend with a D that can't stop anyone but also with an injury riddled offense and WRs who can't catch. Sure, Brees has a few more picks, and maybe those picks have been more costly. However, part of that has to due with the fact that he's forced to pass more (200 more attempts) as well as the fact that his D can't bail him out as well when he does turn it over. I'll also say this. I live in NC so watch a bunch of Panthers football. Jake is gutty as hell and was obviously sorely missed last year. However, I've seen no shortage of times when things were going bad, that he fell right in line and added to the problems. When his team picks him up often enough and doesn't ask to be put on his back, you can count on him to step up from time to time to take his turn at winning the game. However, when guys around him aren't pulling their weight, he's not the kind that will bail them out time and again. That's not a knock on Jake. Rather, something that I see Brees is no more guilty of than him. You ask a QB to chuck it all over the yard and brush off dropped pass after dropped pass, to watch the other team drive right down the field and answer ever scoring drive? He's going to "cost you some games". Edited December 13, 2008 by detlef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myhousekey Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 (edited) Delhomme didn't do himself any favors last night as far as this thread goes. Edited January 11, 2009 by myhousekey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig devilz Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 man, i felt bad for Jake last night. what the hell happened? he's a much better QB than that..... and on his B-day none the less! the Cardinal D stepped up, but they're not the Ravens for Christ sake..... it'l be interesting to read/hear his comments about his performance, i'm sure he'll take all the blame. all i could think after an INT (and it kept building after each one) was he won't be back next year. what a shame to put up such a crap performance after such a good year and getting to the Div Chmpshp.....glad i'm not a Panthers fan this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 Going into this season I thought it was closer than most. After this season, and watching that disaster I will say it's not even close. I'm not so sure Jake starts next season... That was horrid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 I wonder if he'd like his old job back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfish247 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 man, i felt bad for Jake last night. what the hell happened?he's a much better QB than that..... and on his B-day none the less! Jake Delhomme just isn't better than that. That was vintage Delhomme. Aside from 2 seasons (2004 & 2005) Delhomme has been a pretty average to crappy NFL QB. Most of it is Jake's limitations. He's just not that good. He gets lucky on a lot throws... i.e. he's a gunslinger. Yeah, he played QB in the Super Bowl. So what. Without that 'Super Bowl QB' tag, with Delhomme's stats, he's just another guy. Brees has had 5 consecutive Pro Bowl worthy seasons. 4 of those were 500+ attempts. Delhomme has exactly one season with 500+ attempts and 1, maybe 2, Pro Bowl worthy seasons. Swap CAR and NO Ds and this wouldn't even be up for discussion because Brees would be the 'QB that made it to but lost a Super Bowl' AND with better stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 The Panthers need to draft a QB who isn't a bust. Maybe they can blow the next season and draft Tebow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I've never seen a QB look that defeated in the middle of a game. there was no way he was going to turn that sinking ship around, he was just completely on tilt before the third quarter even started. I think it should be more commonplace in the NFL to pull a QB who is playing horribly and put in his sub. it doesn't mean you lost your job, or that the team hates you and wan'ts you gone (mcnabb). you're still the starting QB, you were just having a really bad game and it wasn't turning around. that's it. obviously it's apples and oranges, but an ace pitcher gets pulled if he's getting shelled in the second inning. a more apt analogy might be NHL goaltenders, they get pulled all the time. it's too bad NFL coaches don't typically have that tool at their disposal without creating all kinds of lame drama. 'cause john fox desperately needed to go to the bullpen at halftime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I've never seen a QB look that defeated in the middle of a game. there was no way he was going to turn that sinking ship around, he was just completely on tilt before the third quarter even started. I think it should be more commonplace in the NFL to pull a QB who is playing horribly and put in his sub. it doesn't mean you lost your job, or that the team hates you and wan'ts you gone (mcnabb). you're still the starting QB, you were just having a really bad game and it wasn't turning around. that's it. obviously it's apples and oranges, but an ace pitcher gets pulled if he's getting shelled in the second inning. a more apt analogy might be NHL goaltenders, they get pulled all the time. it's too bad NFL coaches don't typically have that tool at their disposal without creating all kinds of lame drama. 'cause john fox desperately needed to go to the bullpen at halftime. Well said +1 however, no one I listen to on the radio gives Reid ANY credit for McNabb's current success from benching him. I continue to hear radio people say that you just don't do that. That's what the so-called experts say. And I'm amazed by this as well. Hmm, McNabb was playing like crap, he benched him, then lo and behold, they go on a tear. Imagine that. The amazing thing is that talking heads will admit that it worked and still say it's just something you can't do. How is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentastic Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I've never seen a QB look that defeated in the middle of a game. there was no way he was going to turn that sinking ship around, he was just completely on tilt before the third quarter even started. I think it should be more commonplace in the NFL to pull a QB who is playing horribly and put in his sub. it doesn't mean you lost your job, or that the team hates you and wan'ts you gone (mcnabb). you're still the starting QB, you were just having a really bad game and it wasn't turning around. that's it. obviously it's apples and oranges, but an ace pitcher gets pulled if he's getting shelled in the second inning. a more apt analogy might be NHL goaltenders, they get pulled all the time. it's too bad NFL coaches don't typically have that tool at their disposal without creating all kinds of lame drama. 'cause john fox desperately needed to go to the bullpen at halftime. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbimm Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I've never seen a QB look that defeated in the middle of a game. there was no way he was going to turn that sinking ship around, he was just completely on tilt before the third quarter even started. I think it should be more commonplace in the NFL to pull a QB who is playing horribly and put in his sub. it doesn't mean you lost your job, or that the team hates you and wan'ts you gone (mcnabb). you're still the starting QB, you were just having a really bad game and it wasn't turning around. that's it. obviously it's apples and oranges, but an ace pitcher gets pulled if he's getting shelled in the second inning. a more apt analogy might be NHL goaltenders, they get pulled all the time. it's too bad NFL coaches don't typically have that tool at their disposal without creating all kinds of lame drama. 'cause john fox desperately needed to go to the bullpen at halftime. The reason Delhomme has been so successful is that they work there offense around his strengths and avoid trying to do what he is not as good at. When they got down big and had to abandon the run he was forced into a game plan he is uncomfortable with hence his poor play throughout the 2nd half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Rookie Me........ Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Not really going to read 4 pages here, but i am amazed there is even a discussion! I mean really come on people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 The reason Delhomme has been so successful is that they work there offense around his strengths and avoid trying to do what he is not as good at. When they got down big and had to abandon the run he was forced into a game plan he is uncomfortable with hence his poor play throughout the 2nd half. +1 I'm not going to defend his play on Saturday....it was about as abysmal a performance as I can remember, and ranks with some of the more-visible poor performances of all-time. He did nothing to help his team win, and he wasn't helped one iota by the play-calling...to give up on the running game mid-way thru the 2nd quarter when they were only down by 14 with 40 minutes remaining was absurd. Not many QBs can have success throwing into 6-7 guys in coverage. With this performance fresh on everyone's mind, this debate can cool. But how easily everyone likely forgets Brees's 1 TD/9 INT/0-4 start last year that cost his team a shot at the postseason. But Brees will always put up superior stats (except 2004), due to the nature of the Saints offense and that of the Panthers. Brees is without question the better fantasy QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) Not really going to read 4 pages here, but i am amazed there is even a discussion! I mean really come on people. Welcome to the Huddle! Edited January 13, 2009 by WaterMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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