darin3 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Since hooknladder got the last thread locked, gotta start another, since this is an extremely hot topic presently. Talked with Big Country about it last night, and we agreed that he may be moving TOO far up in some leagues' drafts. So, some questions on the topic: -- Is it a situation you now simply avoid? Don't want to take Williams too high (pun intended) and then have him fizzle. -- Is Brown now the "value"? With Williams rising, maybe you can get Brown later now. Seems like a decent play. -- The big thing for me is that Williams was thinking his relationship with Parcells would be on the tenuous side. But apparently it's been just the opposite. We know how Parcells loves his "vets". Is this a big factor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin3 Posted August 21, 2008 Author Share Posted August 21, 2008 And, to boot: Ronnie Brown (thumb) has still not practiced this week and is expected to miss the Dolphins' third preseason game. Ricky Williams could play over a half and tighten his hold on the starting job versus a weak Chiefs front seven Saturday night. Brown promises to be "fine when the regular season rolls around," but appears set to open as a backup. Source: Associated Press Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 If Brown slides to the 3rd he is a no brainer. He was a top 3 back before his injury in lots of leagues. Ricky is being taken way before I would take a 30 something backup RB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Until Brown starts falling outside the top 40-50 in mocks that I've been doing, he's nowhere near a value pick. Further, I was able to tab Ricky at around pick 70 as recently as this morning on one of them and at around 90 the other day. I'll take that all day long. In short, unless Brown starts falling much, much, much farther than he has been, I am not buying at all. As for Ricky, I really can't see why he shouldn't be taken at least as high as I've been seeing him go. I'll get off the bus when he starts going inside the top 50. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 If Brown slides to the 3rd he is a no brainer. He was a top 3 back before his injury in lots of leagues. Ricky is being taken way before I would take a 30 something backup RB. How many mediocre RB options do you have as "no-brainers" in the 3rd round? You've got J Jones who can't seem to separate himself from M Morris and now you're betting on Brown being perhaps the first guy in history to get back from major knee blowout inside of a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfish247 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 ...-- Is it a situation you now simply avoid? Don't want to take Williams too high (pun intended) and then have him fizzle. ... I avoided this one. It seems destined to be, at best, a true RBBC. At worst, Brown and Williams take turns on the injury report all year and it becomes a crapshoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin3 Posted August 21, 2008 Author Share Posted August 21, 2008 I avoided this one. It seems destined to be, at best, a true RBBC. At worst, Brown and Williams take turns on the injury report all year and it becomes a crapshoot. I'm starting to get this feeling, too. I did land Williams late in the SOFA IDP draft. He'll be nothing more than a bye-week fill-in RB2... but who knows, if he somehow holds the "starting" spot and remains healthy, he's an incredible value for where I landed him. In fact, it was funny to see the Brown owner approach me to either trade me Brown or take Williams from me. I declined, based on the fact that Williams could in fact be a huge value and I didn't see him giving me enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 How many mediocre RB options do you have as "no-brainers" in the 3rd round? You've got J Jones who can't seem to separate himself from M Morris and now you're betting on Brown being perhaps the first guy in history to get back from major knee blowout inside of a year. What, it will be six weeks short of a full year? I wish I could think of more examples, but Deuce will be returning within a year, Carson returned within a year, I'm sure there are more. I'm just not that afraid of knee injuries anymore, maybe since so many guys have been successful afterwards (Edge, Lewis, Gore, McGahee). More than anything, I'm not afraid of the impact of Ricky Williams. He is over 30, hasn't done anything of note in how many years now, isn't exactly reliable, and is a backup. Why the heck would you take a pick inside the top 10 rounds on a guy like that, unless you still drive an El Camino with Bon Jovi cranked up? Ronnie Brown, when not hampered by injury, is a stud, period. Even while recovering, he has as much upside as any RB you can get outside of the first two rounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unusualsuspects Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Since hooknladder got the last thread locked, gotta start another, since this is an extremely hot topic presently. Talked with Big Country about it last night, and we agreed that he may be moving TOO far up in some leagues' drafts. So, some questions on the topic: -- Is it a situation you now simply avoid? Don't want to take Williams too high (pun intended) and then have him fizzle. -- Is Brown now the "value"? With Williams rising, maybe you can get Brown later now. Seems like a decent play. -- The big thing for me is that Williams was thinking his relationship with Parcells would be on the tenuous side. But apparently it's been just the opposite. We know how Parcells loves his "vets". Is this a big factor? personally, i have been trying to work out a trade with the brown owner in my league, thinking sell him while he's "high" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 What, it will be six weeks short of a full year? I wish I could think of more examples, but Deuce will be returning within a year, Carson returned within a year, I'm sure there are more. I'm just not that afraid of knee injuries anymore, maybe since so many guys have been successful afterwards (Edge, Lewis, Gore, McGahee). More than anything, I'm not afraid of the impact of Ricky Williams. He is over 30, hasn't done anything of note in how many years now, isn't exactly reliable, and is a backup. Why the heck would you take a pick inside the top 10 rounds on a guy like that, unless you still drive an El Camino with Bon Jovi cranked up? Ronnie Brown, when not hampered by injury, is a stud, period. Even while recovering, he has as much upside as any RB you can get outside of the first two rounds. This may be the first time I've seen a RB coming back from ACL surgery get labeled with "upside". Good luck with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 (edited) What, it will be six weeks short of a full year? I wish I could think of more examples, but Deuce will be returning within a year, Carson returned within a year, I'm sure there are more. Tell you what, let's go ahead and put Deuce in the success column as soon as he is actually a success, not a guy who's merely in camp. Palmer? Dude's a QB and not exactly one known for his feet. Yep, Edge was just flat out money coming off his knee. 2002 IND 14 277 989 yds 3.6 20 2 TD 56 2 1 I'm not saying Brown is done, but history is simply not kind to guys the year after a blown knee and the fact that all I hear is how good Williams looks makes Brown just a tad less than a 3rd round "no-brainer" Edited August 21, 2008 by detlef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 I only have one draft left after H8tank took him in the 4th in GvE. I got him in the 9th in most of those leagues. I read he'll play the entire first half this week. That shoud be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin3 Posted August 21, 2008 Author Share Posted August 21, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 What, it will be six weeks short of a full year? I wish I could think of more examples, but Deuce will be returning within a year, Carson returned within a year, I'm sure there are more. I'm just not that afraid of knee injuries anymore, maybe since so many guys have been successful afterwards (Edge, Lewis, Gore, McGahee). More than anything, I'm not afraid of the impact of Ricky Williams. He is over 30, hasn't done anything of note in how many years now, isn't exactly reliable, and is a backup. Why the heck would you take a pick inside the top 10 rounds on a guy like that, unless you still drive an El Camino with Bon Jovi cranked up? Ronnie Brown, when not hampered by injury, is a stud, period. Even while recovering, he has as much upside as any RB you can get outside of the first two rounds. It took Carson and Deuce some time to come back from the injury. Why would you pick a guy like that. Look up Ryan Grant and Selvin Young last year. Most of us play in highly competetive leagues and need any edge we can get to win. If we can get a top 10 back as a RB 3 or 4 it can leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfish247 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 I'm starting to get this feeling, too. I did land Williams late in the SOFA IDP draft. He'll be nothing more than a bye-week fill-in RB2... but who knows, if he somehow holds the "starting" spot and remains healthy, he's an incredible value for where I landed him. In fact, it was funny to see the Brown owner approach me to either trade me Brown or take Williams from me. I declined, based on the fact that Williams could in fact be a huge value and I didn't see him giving me enough. The Brown owner is probably looking to cut bait with his/her situation at this point. Odds are at some point the Williams owners will too. Although the Brown owner might become more desperate considering Brown went much higher than Ricky. Also, I don't think Ricky has reached his full value if the strategy is to sell high on him. I look at 2005 and see the opposite happening this year. That year Ricky didn't play in the first few games, Ronnie did. Ronnie got nicked up losing carries to Williams. Ronnie eventually gave way almost completely to Ricky. This year I can see the opposite happening... mostly Ricky at the start, Ricky getting nicked up, full blown RBBC, then one RB getting the lion's share either do to injury or poor performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 It took Carson and Deuce some time to come back from the injury. Why would you pick a guy like that. Look up Ryan Grant and Selvin Young last year. Most of us play in highly competetive leagues and need any edge we can get to win. If we can get a top 10 back as a RB 3 or 4 it can leagues. I don't remember anybody taking Ryan Grant in the top 70 last year. Hmmmmm. I don't mind taking Ricky Williams late, but the 70th pick is the 6th round most of the time, right? That is when I'm taking starters and guys that actually figure to have an impact on my team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Trick Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 All I know is I am drinking the RW kool-aid and hoping to trade him to some team that needs a starting RB, assuming of course Ricky plays well to start the season. As a #3 or #4 I think the risk is definitely worth the reward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameltosis Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 The fact that Ricky has had so much time off kind of makes his age moot. I'm not saying I would consider him in a keeper league as a long term solution but he has a few good years left if he can get himself together. That being said I took him in the 10th round on Monday as my RB4. I am ecstatic at this point. I just cant see Brown returning to form this year. If he does, I cant see it unitl late in the season. By then who knows what my roster will look like. All I can do at this point is set up my team as best I can for the start of the season. I think taking Williams as a RB3 or RB4 certainly does that. As for Brown, I dont think I would take him right now until I either see him take the field, or get him at a good value. At this point I would put that value at the 5th or 6th round. I highly doubt he will still be there that late so I find it hard to believe I will have him on my roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 It took Carson and Deuce some time to come back from the injury. Why would you pick a guy like that. Look up Ryan Grant and Selvin Young last year. Most of us play in highly competetive leagues and need any edge we can get to win. If we can get a top 10 back as a RB 3 or 4 it can leagues. lol at the thought of Ricky being a top 10 back. Come on now. I know I can get a bit crazy with some of my projections, but wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 I don't mind taking Ricky Williams late, but the 70th pick is the 6th round most of the time, right? That is when I'm taking starters and guys that actually figure to have an impact on my team. so you take starters in the 7th round, and you take back-ups coming off a blown ACL in the 3rd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 I don't remember anybody taking Ryan Grant in the top 70 last year. Hmmmmm. I don't mind taking Ricky Williams late, but the 70th pick is the 6th round most of the time, right? That is when I'm taking starters and guys that actually figure to have an impact on my team. I've never really had that situation where it is the 6th round still drafting "impact players." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Ernie McCracken Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Interesting comment's on Brown and video clip from Sparano on the Toker http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/footbal...0,2834452.story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 I've never really had that situation where it is the 6th round still drafting "impact players." SO you would rather take Ricky Williams than your starting TE, QB, or WR2?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 SO you would rather take Ricky Williams than your starting TE, QB, or WR2?? Let me guess, you wasted picks 1 and 2 on RBs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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