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Ethics question


RickC
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In my 16 team yahoo league every year we have a couple of owners who sign up and either don't show up on draft day or dislike how their draft turned out and their team is then left to rot for the season. It can't be helped, we have at least one every year and they are not allowed back the next year. This year we have three that have abandoned their teams. It sux.

 

This week our commissioner took an inactive team and went to the waiver wire to fill in players for said team, which by a minor miracle beat a team in the comissioner's division. Four players were added from Free Agency just before kickoff today.

 

We are a 4 division league with only division winners making the playoffs. This loss by a division rival definately affected the dynamics of the division and helped the commissioner.

 

What is the policy for inactive managers for your leagues? How do you deal with them?

 

Was this move ethical? He was not managing the inactive team on a weekly basis, just this week. It has had roster holes every week since the byes started.

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Either have the commish set what he perceives is the best lineup with the players the dead team has. Or use a "league average" score to replace that team's lineup. The commish should not pick up players for that team though.

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I would say that you need to change it to a 12 yeam league. That should solve most problems, because you should have enough quality players to go around.

And yes, the commish should not have done that, although I assume he was just doing it to try and fix this situation.

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The commish should not pick up players for that team though.
But with bye weeks or injuries, it may be impossible to field a complete team. Taking the league average would work around it, but I'm not a fan of playing with just the average. If a preset criteria is made as to what players is going to be picked up, I don't see a problem with the commish picking players. For instance, if a WR is needed then the highest [season|weekly average|projected] player at that position that will play that week is picked up.

 

It was just by coincidence that the opposing team was in the commish's division. If it was in a different division, would it have been viewed in the same light. If you trust the commish to take over an inactive team and field a team on behalf of an owner that has abandoned his team, starting the best players that he see's fit, why don't you also trust the commish to pick up players as needed?

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I don't see how the Commish's actions are unethical. Someone has to take over an inactive/abandoned team and that would include waiver wire moves. I think if I had a schedule against top active teams and I'm fighting for a playoff spot against someone who gets to play a team where it's owner hasn't visited the site since the third week of the season, I'd be pissed off. To me it's like giving away wins and that's much worse then a commish taking over a forfeited team.

 

If it's a money league, then I've found a weekly high score prize to be a very good incentive for teams at the bottom of the barrel to keep feilding what they feel is the best lineup to get some of that money back.

 

If it's a free league, then learn to expect it as a part of playing for nothing.

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Is this a free league?

 

 

Not sure why you expect any different in free yahoo leagues.

 

 

If it's a free league, then learn to expect it as a part of playing for nothing.

 

yeah cause isn't that what grandma always says...you only have to be moral, ethical and courteous when there's money on the line. If there isn't money on it, FTW. Funny thing is this is usually the opposite and sadly I don't know why anyone should EXPECT bs just because its a free league. If someone needs money on the line just to get motivated and force themselves into following moral guidelines, they have bigger problems than Ray Rice being on a bye week and quite frankly I don't want anyone that pathetic and desperate in my league anyway.

Edited by Qball86
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yeah cause isn't that what grandma always says...you only have to be moral, ethical and courteous when there's money on the line. If there isn't money on it, FTW. Funny thing is this is usually the opposite and sadly I don't know why anyone should EXPECT bs just because its a free league. If someone needs money on the line just to get motivated and force themselves into following moral guidelines, they have bigger problems than Ray Rice being on a bye week and quite frankly I don't want anyone that pathetic and desperate in my league anyway.

 

Regardless of the way it should be ... the bottom line is if you join a free yahoo league there is a very real and high possibility that some of the owners will lose interest and quit. For you have to have any other expectation is foolish. I participate in several free leagues but they are BOTH leagues with owners I am relatively familiar with and participation is generally pretty good.

 

I have also found that owners will quit playing in money leagues as well ... when they have determined that their team sucks and they don't really have a chance of making the playoffs.

 

We all make judgements about how to spend our time. Even you would probably have to admit if you were 0-6 in one of your leagues that you would likely invest less time and effort in that league as the return on your time would be minimal.

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And yes, the commish should not have done that, although I assume he was just doing it to try and fix this situation.

 

 

But with bye weeks or injuries, it may be impossible to field a complete team. It was just by coincidence that the opposing team was in the commish's division. If it was in a different division, would it have been viewed in the same light. If you trust the commish to take over an inactive team and field a team on behalf of an owner that has abandoned his team, starting the best players that he see's fit, why don't you also trust the commish to pick up players as needed?

 

 

I don't see how the Commish's actions are unethical.

 

 

You all seem to be saying similar things, but the OP is very clear that there are multiple teams that have been abandoned and have been abandoned for some time now, and that the commish only just this week made moves for just one of the teams for his own personal benefit.

 

The precedent had been set that the teams were being left alone, so, with the given information, the only logical conclusion is that the commish was acting unethically, the moves should be reversed and the roster reset to how it was before the moves were made. If the team still would have won, so be it, but it should have to win based on the roster it had before, as had been the case in the weeks prior and with the other abandoned teams.

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Quote from Big Country

You all seem to be saying similar things, but the OP is very clear that there are multiple teams that have been abandoned and have been abandoned for some time now, and that the commish only just this week made moves for just one of the teams for his own personal benefit.

 

 

This is a really good point.

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yeah cause isn't that what grandma always says...you only have to be moral, ethical and courteous when there's money on the line. If there isn't money on it, FTW. Funny thing is this is usually the opposite and sadly I don't know why anyone should EXPECT bs just because its a free league. If someone needs money on the line just to get motivated and force themselves into following moral guidelines, they have bigger problems than Ray Rice being on a bye week and quite frankly I don't want anyone that pathetic and desperate in my league anyway.

:wacko:

 

Your concept of adult priorities is hilarious, not to mention morality. We're talking about a free fantasy football league. For the vast majority of the population with lives, even maintaining a great fantasy team with money on the line takes a back seat to numerous things. That's just something you're going to have to learn to accept. If you get cranky when someone chooses to address a higher priority in their life over a GAME then maybe you shouldn't play.

 

The real question is about the ethics of the commissioner. I think you do give an owner a chance to take back his/her team because life does happen and sometimes football will take a back seat from time to time. However, once the team is taken over it's forfeited and the owner can't reclaim the team for whatever reason. Then the question is how long should a commissioner wait to take over a team? A few weeks at least and it's only week 7. If he waits to take over the team only when it doesn't benefit him then it could possibly never happen in a case like this where he's taking over a few teams.

 

Bottom line is why even waste any amount energy worrying about a free league, because it's free. I'd worry about the plight of the AIDS in Africa or global warming before I'd have a single thought about a game that means nothing at the end of the day.

 

Sorry to preach, but the OP is either ten or the a total real life noob.

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:

Bottom line is why even waste any amount energy worrying about a free league, because it's free. I'd worry about the plight of the AIDS in Africa or global warming before I'd have a single thought about a game that means nothing at the end of the day.

 

Sorry to preach, but the OP is either ten or the a total real life noob.

 

Ok, drop the insults please.

I am the OP and I am neither of those things. We have a Yahoo Plus leage and we pay a small fee to join. I guess you still consider that free since there is no money to WIN, but nevermind.

 

We play for the fun of it, and if that is a foriegn concept to you then I won't attempt to explain it.

 

To the rest of you thanks for the comments. We will find a way to deal with the inactive rosters, but my question wasn't about how to avoid them, it was what policies do you have in place once you realize this or that team has been abandoned and they won't be back. Obviously this doesn't happen in money leagues.

 

........thanks again.

Edited by RickC
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At this point, the only fair thing to do for the current season is a roster freeze (and, IMO, a reversal of the moves that were made this past week for the team in question)

 

In future, you need to clearly define what constitutes an abandoned team. Is it lack of a lineup submission for X number of consecutive weeks or some other measure. Whatever it is, it needs to be clear and non-subjective.

 

Once that is defined, then you must decide the best course to rectify. I have seen leagues do any of the following:

1. Freeze roster and use league average for that team for remainder of season

2. Freeze roster and use last used lineup for the team

3. Freeze roster and have commish submit best lineup in his opinion from a week to week basis.

4. Same as 3, but instead of commish, entire league votes each week as to lineup to be used.

 

I am sure there are some leagues that would even allow the commish or the league to make roster moves for an abandoned team, but this just opens up an even bigger can of worms than even letting them make decisions on starting lineups.

 

 

Now, as to additional suggestions for your particular league, any reason it is 16 teams? If you have this issue every single season, then perhaps lowering the number of teams to 12 or some other number would reduce the chance of having multiple deadbeat owners in the league. Seems like the current recruitment process to try and come up with 16 owners is failing your league, so to me that is a major thing to look at.

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To the rest of you thanks for the comments. We will find a way to deal with the inactive rosters, but my question wasn't about how to avoid them, it was what policies do you have in place once you realize this or that team has been abandoned and they won't be back. Obviously this doesn't happen in money leagues.

 

It happens in free leagues. It happens in money leagues. I'm in six different money leagues and in at least half of them, there is a team that is 1-6 and has pretty much given up. Two of the teams had players in their active roster that were on bye this week so I think that's a real good indicator. Also, these guys are usually very active and have been great opponents in years past. I think people just lose interest if they know they aren't going to make it, regardless of what is on the line (pride, money, etc...). This happens every year and I think it's ridiculous for people to say it doesn't happen in money leagues because it does. I've got one league that has been going for almost ten years and that is the only league where it doesn't happen but that's after ten years of weeding out bad players to get ones like we have.

 

I agree that rules need to be set and agreed upon by the league up front. Since that didn't happen, I think you definitely have to challenge this if this was the first time the commish did this. In no case do I support adding or dropping players from their roster. At most, I think the commish should set what he feels is the best lineup from the players roster and not add/drop anyone. It's one thing to change their rosters. It's another to take players from the waivers who could have been picked up by a team that does have an interest in winning.

 

In all of my leagues, if we find that a team is not actively managing their roster any longer, we lock their ability to add/drop/trade. Then the commish sets their lineup with the best available players. I am the commish in two leagues and I would normally put it out as a vote for what we should set their starting roster as so no one can say I was giving any team an advantage over another.

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@ Big Country

 

We are a league that started up about 7 years ago and we knew each other from a naval sim gaming site that we all frequent. In the past our policy was to set a roster at the beginning of the season for a no-show and then just let it ride. If the manager showed up later, fine, he could run his team. Deserted teams were left as is and not invited back.

 

Bottom line, old commissioner dropped out for personal reasons and someone new took up the league. In his defense, it is HIS league and he is new at this. He ballooned the league to 16 at the last minute to try to accommodate friends. It wasn't a good idea.

 

Thanks for that post and the suggestions.

Edited by RickC
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In my 16 team yahoo league every year we have a couple of owners who sign up and either don't show up on draft day or dislike how their draft turned out and their team is then left to rot for the season. It can't be helped, we have at least one every year and they are not allowed back the next year. This year we have three that have abandoned their teams. It sux.

 

Leave this league.

 

What is the policy for inactive managers for your leagues? How do you deal with them?

 

We do not have inactive managers, because we are very selective about allowing owners in and have controls in place. Our league started as a 10-team, expanded to 12 and is now capped at 14, the perfect size. We have replaced a couple of owners in the off-season, but we generally have 3-5 people who want in our league at all times. These people come to our drafts and assist and observe, often for years to keep their spot on the waiting list for an open team.

 

Our league has a controlled keeper aspect with rookie drafts, and there is a Loser Bowl penalty, which help keep people engaged even when they have a bad year. The worst 4 teams compete in a Loser Bowl bracket with the Loser having to pay a cash penalty (and technically having to wear a dress to the next year's draft).

 

Was this move ethical? He was not managing the inactive team on a weekly basis, just this week. It has had roster holes every week since the byes started.

 

Since this poopyty league has had this problem in the past, how was this handled then? If this commissioner takeover of the team's roster has no precedent, then it is unethical. If this is how it's been handled in previous weeks and years, people should calm down.

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Quote from Big Country

You all seem to be saying similar things, but the OP is very clear that there are multiple teams that have been abandoned and have been abandoned for some time now, and that the commish only just this week made moves for just one of the teams for his own personal benefit.

 

 

This is a really good point.

Pretty much the end-all, be-all point.

 

Oh, for the dude who got all bent out of shape because people were asking if it was a free league. Frankly, I wondered the same thing. Not as the basis for whether the commish should do the right thing but because it seems like every year dudes bail part way through. I mean, wouldn't you expect that to be the case? Some on-line league where you don't have anything at stake vs (I'm guessing here) a bunch of guys you either don't or barely know. Dude decides he's too busy, or his team sucks, or whatever, and he's gone.

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