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Smaller leagues


MustOfBeenDrunk
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I'm reading more and more post that bring up 8 or10 team leagues.

I don't want to start any crap by calling then no better than free leagues

No matter how much the buy in but instead am looking for some feed back.

In general would you think that the smaller the league the less skill needed to win ?

Would you think that someone who never played before would have a better chance

of drafting a competitive team in a 10 team league than he would drafting a 14 or 16 ?

The way I see it , one mistake in a 14 or 16 team league with a 20 man roster you better know

how to work a trade or work the waver wire. If you blow it in a 8 or 10 team league there has

to be plenty of talent still laying there on the waver to fix your team.

Never playing in a league that small I may be off base but sitting on the outside looking in

It sure looks that way.

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Because for many people, sometimes playing in a ten player league may be the only option available and that's far better than no league at all.

 

My ten team league does a butt-load more trades and transactions than my twelve team league. Regardless of league size, everyone involved shares the same advantages and disadvantages. It's an even playing field no matter what. You still need to be savvy and proactive. Sure you can have more starting RB's on your roster than a twelve or fourteen team league but so does everybody else. You still have to rise above the rest by getting the cream of the crop players on your roster and know how to play the match-ups.

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MBD -

 

Here are my thoughts on it.

 

Given the same lineup requirements and roster sizes, yes, less skill involved in smaller leagues. In smaller leagues, there is going to be very good talent available in the waiver pool, so a bad draft, poor bye week planning, etc. is much more easily remedied. In larger leagues, the talent pool is more depleted, so the importance of roster management, be it taking deeper looks at waiver talent, examining more trade possibilities, etc. increases. However, the impact of injury is greater, as that is harder to recover from generally, though I still chalk it up to a skill to properly manage a roster to account for that possibility.

 

Now, if roster sizes and lineup requirements change, than a smaller league can be every bit as much about skill as a larger league. An 8 team league with a 30-man roster and a requirement to start 2 QBs, 3 RBs, 4 WR, 2 TEs, 2 flex, 2 Ks and 2Ds is using up just as much talent as a 12-team, 20 man roster league but requiring more starting spots.

 

So, the blanket statement that smaller leagues are less skillful is a fallacy, but, if you were to say all things being equal, then I would tend to agree with it.

 

 

ETA: As Crispy alludes to, the owners involved also plays a large role.

Edited by Big Country
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Yeah, the only difference I see is that in 12 team leagues, the bad teams are TERRIBLE and the good teams are GREAT. In 10 teamers, seems like there is more of a shot that the bad teams can beat the good teams any given week so it is rarely based on that 1 team that drafted say Ray Rice in the 6th round which in 12 team leagues makes more of a difference IMO

 

It still takes skill in 10 teamers. You are still playing against 9 other guys that are all going after the same guys your are. I will agree that it is easier to overcome a major injury in 10 then in 12 but I don't think you can talk down on them...that sounds like a ghey as Shake the Gilligan hand thing to do

Edited by LayLow
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I know they must be popular because I'm always seeing players on the free agency forecast that would never be available in larger leagues.

I have to laugh at these when some writer suggest this late in the season to grab off the waiver wire.

 

Ricky Williams

Beenie Wells

Avery

Eli Manning

Knowshon Moreno

Roy Williams

Terrell Owens

 

Everyone of these players are on suggested waiver wire adds for this week

Not one of then are now or have been on the waiver at any time this year in any of my leagues.

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I know they must be popular because I'm always seeing players on the free agency forecast that would never be available in larger leagues.

I have to laugh at these when some writer suggest this late in the season to grab off the waiver wire.

 

Ricky Williams

Beenie Wells

Avery

Eli Manning

Knowshon Moreno

Roy Williams

Terrell Owens

 

Everyone of these players are on suggested waiver wire adds for this week

Not one of then are now or have been on the waiver at any time this year in any of my leagues.

None of these guys are available in my 10 man league. TO was on the wire for 1 week then was picked up

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I know they must be popular because I'm always seeing players on the free agency forecast that would never be available in larger leagues.

I have to laugh at these when some writer suggest this late in the season to grab off the waiver wire.

 

Ricky Williams

Beenie Wells

Avery

Eli Manning

Knowshon Moreno

Roy Williams

Terrell Owens

 

Everyone of these players are on suggested waiver wire adds for this week

Not one of then are now or have been on the waiver at any time this year in any of my leagues.

 

I play in a small league and Ricky would be the only favorable add in that one. Plus even if I did add him, he would probably never start on my team except maybe next week.

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There is probably no good reason for me to play in this league. I told them that I wasn't going to return this year. I later changed my mind. You can also screw up a team in a small league by drafting players that don't belong. That leaves others in the league with very strong teams. Although more often than not, those very strong teams can get beat in the playoffs anyway.

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Skill of the owners is way more important than size of league. Conceding the obvious point that less owners gives you a greater chance to win.

A 12 man league with 4 good owners and 8 guys that don't pay attention is easier to win then a 10 man with all owners playing

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If the roster requirements are the same between a 8-team league and a 12-team league, it would be far easier to field a team filled with studs. But all teams in the league have the same advantage so it's really not an advantage when compared to others in the league.

 

I think the times that it gets knocked is when someone comes here and starts talking smack or bragging that their team with Peyton Manning, Adrian Peterson, Chris Johnson, Fitzgerald, and Johnson is kicking ass. Or WDIS between Manning, Brees and Brady. Who cares. It's not a realistic scenario for more "competitive" leagues.

 

Small league play is like playing with yourself. When you are first starting out, it may be all that you have, and there isn't anything wrong with that. And at the end, you feel real good about how well you performed hopefully. Maybe eventually you start playing with yourself and a few friends in a small, private circle. And good for you. But most people find that once they start playing with each other in larger groups, it feels so much better to score a lot and beat everyone off the championship bracket in the end.

 

:wacko: Maybe that didn't come out quite right...but you still get the point.

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Yes, there's much more available talent on the waiver wire in smaller leagues, but the better owners still take advantage of that more than the bad teams. If you're not a good FF owner, meaning you don't read up on things and don't make the neccesary moves, that's not going to change too much based on league size. For me the main reason I prefer smaller leagues is because I like playing in 2 QB leagues. I think it really evens the balance of RB and QB value. I think leagues that only require 1 starting QB are much easier than those that require 2.

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Yes, there's much more available talent on the waiver wire in smaller leagues, but the better owners still take advantage of that more than the bad teams. If you're not a good FF owner, meaning you don't read up on things and don't make the neccesary moves, that's not going to change too much based on league size. For me the main reason I prefer smaller leagues is because I like playing in 2 QB leagues. I think it really evens the balance of RB and QB value. I think leagues that only require 1 starting QB are much easier than those that require 2.

 

I never thought about the 2QB part of the equation ,,, I was comparing 8 or 10 to 14 or 16 with the same roster size and starting line up requirements.

If it is the norm that in smaller leagues you start 2 QB's than I can see how that would make a big difference.

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I never thought about the 2QB part of the equation ,,, I was comparing 8 or 10 to 14 or 16 with the same roster size and starting line up requirements.

If it is the norm that in smaller leagues you start 2 QB's than I can see how that would make a big difference.

 

In my 10 team we start 1QB 2RB 2WR 1TE 1K 1DEF and 2 wild card positions. These can be any position just not the same (i.e. you can start 2QBs but not 3QBs)

 

I think it adds extra strategy to the lineup one year we had someone start 2 def (When the bears and the Ravens D were both scoring big points every week) because they were constantly scoring a good amount of points.

 

Also no players in the list above were available in my 10 team league waiver wire.

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in smaller leagues, getting a QB is usually not that important as you can still get a top 10 QB by waiting in the draft (as only 9 other teams need QB's). The team that has won the last 2 years has waited on QB. In a 12 man, i would think it may be more important to get a QB?

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In my 10 team we start 1QB 2RB 2WR 1TE 1K 1DEF and 2 wild card positions. These can be any position just not the same (i.e. you can start 2QBs but not 3QBs)

 

I think it adds extra strategy to the lineup one year we had someone start 2 def (When the bears and the Ravens D were both scoring big points every week) because they were constantly scoring a good amount of points.

 

Also no players in the list above were available in my 10 team league waiver wire.

 

 

ok, now you are the third person in smaller leagues that said none of those players are available and they sure in the hell aren't available in the larger leagues i play in.

So who are they aimed at ?

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I play in a six man rotisserie style league

 

start 3 QBs, 4 RBs, 4 WRs, 1 TE, 1 D/ST, 1 K....Roto style...rosters are 4 QB, 6 RB, 6 WR, 2 TE, 2 D/ST, 2 K

 

It's far more competitive than most of my 12 and 16 team leagues mostly because all six owners are very dedicated, very active, and the Roto style scoring requires making moves that are sometimes counter to normal FF logic

 

The skill required to be successful in a league is very much an equation of skill and time dedication of the other owners, sophistication of rules/scoring (waiver wire, etc), and depth of talent locked into rosters (which is in itself an equation of the number of owners times the total roster size)

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ok, now you are the third person in smaller leagues that said none of those players are available and they sure in the hell aren't available in the larger leagues i play in.

So who are they aimed at ?

 

They always list the percentage of leagues that guy is available in, so it has to be that they are available in free leagues populated by noobs, half of which have ignored their team since week 6.

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Every year this comes up at least once. I've played in 12 team leagues, 10 team leagues, and my oldest league was always an 8 team league. The 8 team league had 8 teams for one very, very good reason. There were 8 of us who wanted to play. Even though, over the years, guys would come and go and there'd be someone else around to take the spot, it just always worked out that way. Just as importantly, however, there was no huge desire to expand because we were more interested in an entertaining diversion to our daily grind than in proving ourselves in some virtual bloodsport.

 

None the less, as someone who's played in both, I will say this, there's always way more parity in a smaller league because, as has been mentioned, there's more options to bail out a bad draft. Each and every draft I've done in a small league, I've left the draft coming nowhere near my list of late round fliers. As a result, I've always pushed to extend the rosters and/or starting line-ups. However, because I'm among the geeks, the others who are less into it always pushed back. None the less, it's tough to watch guys who you had a hunch would be good but couldn't make room for in the draft pan out in week 1 or 2 and get scooped up by a guy picking before you in waivers. Oh well, chalk it up to preserving the competitive balance and allowing the dude who's too busy dragging his kids to practice and such to keep up with scouting a fighting chance. I guess it's more important to me, in that case to dumb it down enough to keep a guy like that in the mix.

 

Make no mistake, however, regardless of the size of the league, the cream rises. Those of us in this league who put in the work are far more often in the play-offs than those who don't.

 

Oh, and those who make a big freaking deal every year about what a joke small leagues are (not including the OP, mind you) are basically abject losers.

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They always list the percentage of leagues that guy is available in, so it has to be that they are available in free leagues populated by noobs, half of which have ignored their team since week 6.

 

 

Never even thought of that one ,, makes sense ,, but why in the hell cater to that customer ?

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Never even thought of that one ,, makes sense ,, but why in the hell cater to that customer ?

 

'Cause Muto's gotta play somewhere.

 

OK, cheap shot, sorry.

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Many of those players would be available in my league. From that list, only Williams could crack the lineup of my team at least. But only next week if any week at all.

 

I would have to sit Rice to play Ricky and not sure if that would happen very often.

Edited by MikesVikes
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They always list the percentage of leagues that guy is available in, so it has to be that they are available in free leagues populated by noobs, half of which have ignored their team since week 6.

 

 

Never even thought of that one ,, makes sense ,, but why in the hell cater to that customer ?

 

 

One thing to remember is this, the majority of us that post regularly or semi-regularly on the board are the exception in that we are really dedicated to FF and our leagues. The vast majority of people that play FF are not this way, and are much more recreational. There is a hugh percentage of the Huddle paying customers that never come to the boards, and are a bit more casual than us fanatics who worry about the impact of Jay Cutler's hangnail on his numbers, and that very large contingent is who a lot of the articles cater to.

 

So, while the article may not neccessarily cater to the vocal minority here on the boards who do a lot of research and have either already acquired or know of those players, there is a very large base that does not do the same research or have the same base of knowledge.

 

Just food for thought.

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One thing to remember is this, the majority of us that post regularly or semi-regularly on the board are the exception in that we are really dedicated to FF and our leagues. The vast majority of people that play FF are not this way, and are much more recreational. There is a hugh percentage of the Huddle paying customers that never come to the boards, and are a bit more casual than us fanatics who worry about the impact of Jay Cutler's hangnail on his numbers, and that very large contingent is who a lot of the articles cater to.

 

So, while the article may not neccessarily cater to the vocal minority here on the boards who do a lot of research and have either already acquired or know of those players, there is a very large base that does not do the same research or have the same base of knowledge.

 

Just food for thought.

 

OMG! Jay Cutler has a hangnail?!?!? Why wasn't that on the daily update?

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