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Colts fans!


CaptainHook
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You are on the TV show Who Wants to be a Millionaire?

 

You have just answered correctly the $500,000 question.

 

You have read the $1,000,000 question.

 

You do not know the answer, and you are out of lifelines.

 

Do you take the one in four shot at doing something spectacular, and GUESS? If you're wrong, you go back down to $32,000.

 

Or do you take the sure thing, the $500,000 and walk away?

 

 

 

I think that is the best way to describe the Colts situation. Do you go for something spectacular, and risk the health of a few core players? (The Colts are paper thin at quarterback, cornerback, safety, and linebacker.)

 

Or do you play it safe and take your very thin, but very talented team, into the play-offs, with a legitimate chance at a Super Bowl?

 

 

 

 

That's how I'm looking at it anyways. They better not lose that first game. . .

Edited by CaptainHook
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You are on the TV show Who Wants to be a Millionaire?

 

You have just answered correctly the $500,000 question.

 

You have read the $1,000,000 question.

 

You do not know the answer, and you are out of lifelines.

 

Do you take the one in four shot at doing something spectacular, and GUESS? If you're wrong, you go back down to $32,000.

 

Or do you take the sure thing, the $500,000 and walk away?

 

 

 

I think that is the best way to describe the Colts situation. Do you go for something spectacular, and risk the health of a few core players?

 

Or do you play it safe and take your very thin, but very talented team, into the play-offs, with a legitimate chance at a Super Bowl?

 

 

 

 

That's how I'm looking at it anyways. They better not lose that first game. . .

I think it's cool that you're remaing optimistic but don't agree with the analogy. The Colts did'nt win half a million; they have'nt won anything. Peyton RARELY gets hit and ( not to be rude) Wayne has a tendency to lay down before he gets hit hard. Play the damn games.

IMO the Colts decision to rest when they did was a kick in the balls to the Colts players and Colts fans. If Dallas was 14-0 ( fat chance) and did what Indy did I'd be absolutely PISSED beyond belief.

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I think it's cool that you're remaing optimistic but don't agree with the analogy. The Colts did'nt win half a million; they have'nt won anything. Peyton RARELY gets hit and ( not to be rude) Wayne has a tendency to lay down before he gets hit hard. Play the damn games.

IMO the Colts decision to rest when they did was a kick in the balls to the Colts players and Colts fans. If Dallas was 14-0 ( fat chance) and did what Indy did I'd be absolutely PISSED beyond belief.

Oh, I was pissed. I think the Colts blew it by not being up front with their fans about what was going to happen in this game. I think they blew a chance to do something truly memorable. (Although I'm not sure how the Colts would have handled the undefeated pressure through the playoffs.)

 

But I think the analogy is dead on. They took the safe route. The route that ensures a healthy team in the playoffs. A first round bye, home field advantage though-out the play-offs, and a healthy roster equates to the $500,000 in my mind. . .

Edited by CaptainHook
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Oh, I was pissed. I think the Colts blew it by not being up front with their fans about what was going to happen in this game.

 

But I think the analogy is dead on. They took the safe route. The route that ensures a healthy team in the play-offs. A first round bye, home field advantage though-out the play-offs, and a healthy roster equates to the $500,000 in my mind. . .

I heard Hoge on the radio this morning talking about Chuck Noll. Noll told him that the best team he ever had was ( I believe) 1976 but they did'nt win it that year. He said it was because they played safely trying not to get anyone hurt and that it was the biggest mistake of his career. FWIW.

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I don't know why I always think of poker analogies, but a better one would be to get a huge chip lead through the middle of a large poker tournament then sit there after you get the big chip lead folding all of your hands with the exception of pocket aces and maybe pocket kings so that you can be "in the money". Sure, you have chosen the safest path to making the final table of the tournament, but you've damaged your overall chances of winning the tournament by not staying aggressive. Same with the Colts... They've chosen the safest path to the final table, but they've hurt there overall position for actually winning it.

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You are on the TV show Who Wants to be a Millionaire?

 

You have just answered correctly the $500,000 question.

 

You have read the $1,000,000 question.

 

You do not know the answer, and you are out of lifelines.

 

Do you take the one in four shot at doing something spectacular, and GUESS? If you're wrong, you go back down to $32,000.

 

Or do you take the sure thing, the $500,000 and walk away?

 

 

 

I think that is the best way to describe the Colts situation. Do you go for something spectacular, and risk the health of a few core players? (The Colts are paper thin at quarterback, cornerback, safety, and linebacker.)

 

Or do you play it safe and take your very thin, but very talented team, into the play-offs, with a legitimate chance at a Super Bowl?

 

 

 

 

That's how I'm looking at it anyways. They better not lose that first game. . .

 

So cap'n hook thinks the Colts lose in the AFC championship game. Good to know. :D

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:wacko:

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I heard Hoge on the radio this morning talking about Chuck Noll. Noll told him that the best team he ever had was ( I believe) 1976 but they did'nt win it that year. He said it was because they played safely trying not to get anyone hurt and that it was the biggest mistake of his career. FWIW.

Dungy spoke about his time as a Steeler, when Pittsburgh did the same thing the Colts are doing. They rested players at the end of the season, and won the Super Bowl. So there's a conflict there.

 

Polian reminds us that in 1999, with the #2 seed and bye locked up, the Colts lost Cornelius Bennett (the heart and sould of a young Colt team) in a meaningless season ending game. They lost their first game to Tennessee.

 

Garcon hurt his hand against Jacksonville. If that had happened against NYJ or @BUF, Caldwell said Pierre likely would have been out for the Divisional round of the playoffs.

 

The Colts won the Super Bowl the year they played like CRAP in the final month. Momentum meant nothing that year.

 

I don't think many of you realize how thin the Colts are. They have two NFL caliber safeties on the roster. Bullitt and Bethea cannot get hurt. Brackett, Freeney, and Mathis cannot get hurt, or the defense loses a lot. They are already starting 2 rookie CB's in their nickel package.

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I heard Hoge on the radio this morning talking about Chuck Noll. Noll told him that the best team he ever had was ( I believe) 1976 but they did'nt win it that year. He said it was because they played safely trying not to get anyone hurt and that it was the biggest mistake of his career. FWIW.

Was 1976, then the RBs got decimated for a loss to the Raiders.

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Was 1976, then the RBs got decimated for a loss to the Raiders.

A Raider team that just happened to be pretty freaking awesome. Maybe that had something to do with the Steelers not winning it all as well. Mind you, I have a hard time thinking the Steelers laid back down the stretch or that 76 was the year Noll was talking about. After a 2-4 start, they won their last 8, the last two being shut-outs (mind you, one was vs Tampa) and then rolled Baltimore in the 1st round of the play-offs 40-14. Then they got beat by a Raiders team in the AFC Championship that lost only one game all year.

 

So much for that theory.

 

Back to the subject at hand though. My question is this. Did they rest any of their linemen? 'Cause if you're gonna rest those guys, you'd better freaking rest Payton. We notice that the big name guys get pulled and maybe they don't need the rest. But maybe the Tackles are nursing injuries and you'd like to get them some rest or keep them from aggravating something.

 

Maybe the backup QB sucks that bad. Maybe it was a back up QB playing behind a back up line against a good D on a team that needs to win out.

 

Regardless, the perfect season is overrated. If it was all that, then the 72 Dolphins would get more run when people bring up the all time great teams. But they rarely do. It's one of the great Steeler teams of the late 70s, one of the Packer teams of the late 60s, the Niners of the 80s, or one of the Cowboy teams from the early 90s. Maybe the 85 Bears. Rarely do the 72 Dolphins come up.

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Garcon hurt his hand against Jacksonville. If that had happened against NYJ or @BUF, Caldwell said Pierre likely would have been out for the Divisional round of the playoffs.

 

The Colts won the Super Bowl the year they played like CRAP in the final month. Momentum meant nothing that year.

So by this logic, they were completely wrong in playing Jacksonville for 4 quarters, New York for a little over 2, and whatever they play next week against Buffalo. They should allow the primary players to take the first snap to keep all those games started records going...but then bench them as soon as possible.

 

If momentum means nothing, then not playing shouldn't matter. But recent history of the Colts should also tell us that lack of momentum or continuous playing time doesn't bode well for extended runs to the Super Bowl.

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Last week you are talking about maybe 20 or so plays left that Manning could have played. Why would the final 20 plays be any more dangerous than the initial 30?

 

I'll give you an analogy. It's like you have a car that you want to drive in a couple of weeks so you park it and prevent any breakdowns. Only these are not machine parts, they are players and you maybe avoided potentially hurting a player in the final 20 plays of a game when there had already been 950+ plays in the season. You traded the potential of health in exchange for draining team morale because you do not trust them or want to listen to what they want. You just treated them like parts of a machine. Pretty motivating.

 

It's all playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

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Back to the subject at hand though. My question is this. Did they rest any of their linemen? 'Cause if you're gonna rest those guys, you'd better freaking rest Payton. We notice that the big name guys get pulled and maybe they don't need the rest. But maybe the Tackles are nursing injuries and you'd like to get them some rest or keep them from aggravating something.

Yes. Left tackle Charlie Johnson and right guard Kyle DeVan did not play at all in the game.

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Last week you are talking about maybe 20 or so plays left that Manning could have played. Why would the final 20 plays be any more dangerous than the initial 30?

 

I'll give you an analogy. It's like you have a car that you want to drive in a couple of weeks so you park it and prevent any breakdowns. Only these are not machine parts, they are players and you maybe avoided potentially hurting a player in the final 20 plays of a game when there had already been 950+ plays in the season. You traded the potential of health in exchange for draining team morale because you do not trust them or want to listen to what they want. You just treated them like parts of a machine. Pretty motivating.

 

It's all playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

C'mon DMD. Most NFL injuries are not due to repetitive use. They are due to a freak accident, one time occurrence. If a guy had a sore muscle, joint, etc. he was already being rested. They declared them OUT for the game.

 

They could not rest all starters. The constraints of a 53 man roster, and 45 man active roster for game days, don't allow it. And you cannot rest them for most of three straight games. They were treating the game vs. the Jets as the third preseason game. The game against Buffalo, I suspect will be like the fourth preseason game, with the starters leaving much sooner.

Edited by CaptainHook
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Regardless, the perfect season is overrated. If it was all that, then the 72 Dolphins would get more run when people bring up the all time great teams. But they rarely do. It's one of the great Steeler teams of the late 70s, one of the Packer teams of the late 60s, the Niners of the 80s, or one of the Cowboy teams from the early 90s. Maybe the 85 Bears. Rarely do the 72 Dolphins come up.

 

I think this statement is dead on. I was ticked beyond belief when the Colts layed down, upset that they would not even make a run at immortality. I think this helps me put a little perspective to it. Even if the Colts went undefeated, does anyone really think this team would be ranked up there with the greatest of all time. I don't think anyone really thinks that. They would have been a great team that achieved one of the greatest accomplishments of all time, but I don't think they would be considered as great as those teams you mentioned. I'm still mad about it, but I do think that puts a little perspective on it.

Edited by heydave76
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That's true. So there's just as much chance of getting hurt in the 1st or 2nd quarter as there is in the 3rd or 4th. Why not rest the whole game?

I think I've addressed that. They cannot sit for 3 games and a bye week and expect to have their timing ready for the first play-off game.

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C'mon DMD. Most NFL injuries are not due to repetitive use. They are due to a freak accident, one time occurrence. If a guy had a sore muscle, joint, etc. he was already being rested. They declared them OUT for the game.

 

They could not rest all starters. The constraints of a 53 man roster, and 45 man active roster for game days, don't allow it. And you cannot rest them for most of three straight games. They were treating the game vs. the Jets as the third preseason game. The game against Buffalo, I suspect will be like the fourth preseason game, with the starters leaving much sooner.

 

I realize that injuries are random events. And had there not been the specter of a perfect season, then no question what they did is understandable.

 

My point is that they ignored the players and treated them like machine parts. They sacrificed morale and marginalized what every player would want - to go undefeated and be in the record book. Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark already spoke out. If you watched Manning you know what he was thinking too. I contend you showed disregard for player wishes and demotivated them - how else would players view it? They already said as much.

 

Again - playing not to lose, not playing to win. And not honoring your own players. All so that nothing could happen to Manning in his final 20 plays that had not happened to him in 575 other plays this year or in the 111 games that he has started since week one as a rookie. Just seems like a lot to trade away for probably nothing in return.

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Players want to come back in after injuries too. Coaches are there to do what is best for the team.

 

Listen, there is a part of me that really wanted them to go for it. 19-0 would have been sweet. I even sent Irsay an email when I got home from the game Sunday night expressing my disappointment and anger. But my stake in the team is minor compared to the owner, GM, coaches, and players. If they chose the safe route, I can hardly blame them. I'm not a huge risk taker financially. I usually am on the safer side. It's hard to blame the leadership of a multi-million dollar franchise if they didn't want to take the risk either. Now we'll never know.

 

The only way I'll be really, really, really pissed, is if they flame out in the first game of the playoffs. Pissed enough to not re-new my season tickets? Quite possibly. But I'm reserving judment until this plays out.

Edited by CaptainHook
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The analogy suggests that there's a 75% chance of Peyton Manning sustain a significant injury.

No it doesn't. There are several key members the Colts cannot afford to lose if they want to make the Super Bowl.

 

The Colts need to refund all money to ticket holders.

 

I'm a season ticket holder. That's ridiculous. I love fans of other team's telling Colts fans how they "should feel".

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firstly, I'm not the one pissed, it's your co-fans who are and who are demanding a refund. I simply support their position. Secondly, whether it's Peyton or other key members, your analogy is still saying that there's a 75% chance that something significantly bad happens... that's a poor analogy.

I do believe there was a high probability that one of the Colts core players would get hurt at the end of the Jets game or this week in Buffalo. Have you seen the Colts injury reports this year? They've been 20+ players long all season . . . I don't think it's a poor analogy at all. Risk it all to win big, or play conservative and still have a chance to win the Super Bowl.

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I realize that injuries are random events. And had there not been the specter of a perfect season, then no question what they did is understandable.

 

My point is that they ignored the players and treated them like machine parts. They sacrificed morale and marginalized what every player would want - to go undefeated and be in the record book. Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark already spoke out. If you watched Manning you know what he was thinking too. I contend you showed disregard for player wishes and demotivated them - how else would players view it? They already said as much.

 

Again - playing not to lose, not playing to win. And not honoring your own players. All so that nothing could happen to Manning in his final 20 plays that had not happened to him in 575 other plays this year or in the 111 games that he has started since week one as a rookie. Just seems like a lot to trade away for probably nothing in return.

 

Well said.

:wacko:

 

"Playing not to lose, not playing to win." It's an analogy for fantasy football. You've got to take risks. Be smart, but don't play in fear, play with courage. If you always play it safe, you're probably most likely going to lose. Same analogy applies to life.

 

Bill Polian has been an excellent General Manager. He help build a Buffalo Bills team that went to four Super Bowls. Polian assembled a Panthers' team that went to the NFC Championship in its second year of existence. Polian's leadership as President and General Manager with the Colts has resulted in the most wins by a team in a decade. I can't think of anyone who knows how to setup the foundation and personnel to build a winner in the NFL more so than Polian. However, there's something curious about Polian's resume.

 

Polian has led one organization to one Super Bowl victory. All success is not necessarily measured just in terms of Super Bowls, but it's certainly one of the most important ones. It seems like there should be more Super Bowl victories. I think Polian's philosophy has a flaw. Once, he's ahead, he plays it safe. Polian has explained several times that the team has lost players in meaningless games, and he doesn't want to get burned again. It's a philosophy made out of fear. Telling a team that a game doesn't have meaning and to lie down is very dangerous. I think it sends the wrong message. It teaches the team that it's OK to quit. It makes the team content. A football team should never be content. They have to stay hungry and keep improving each and every game. This year's Colts is not the strongest team that Polian has had by any means. Now is not the time for the Colts to be resting on their laurels. Now is the time to stomp on the throats of their opponents.

 

Personally, I think it's too late for the Colts. Polian's organizational philosophy has demoralized the team. Polian has taken away their opportunity to be great for no good reason. There was just as much a chance that Manning, Wayne, Clark, etc. could be hurt in the first quarter as in the fourth quarter. Polian made Peyton Manning stand up in the press conference and answer questions about being yanked from a game. Manning never said he agreed with it, but he correctly attributed the decision as an organizational philosophy.

 

All Polilan has done is frustrate his players and many of his fan base. This week, many radio callers to his show pointed out his flawed logic. Finally, Polian ended the show 10 minutes early with no explanation. There was dead air until the radio station put some commercials and music on for filler. Polian just quit. (However, they are now denying that he quit, but they needed to get some more commercials in.) The Colts President was so frustrated that he quit. The Colts team had an opportunity to embrace the challenge to be great, but their leadership made them quit against the Jets. Again, allowing a team to quit is a dangerous precedence to set.

 

Polian is stubborn and is sticking with his philosophy. Good for him. If that's what he believes, I respect that. I just think he should review how many times his football organizations have reached their ultimate goal, and then strongly reconsider.

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Maybe they can just keep Manning in a rubber room for the next three weeks till there first playoff game.

 

Don't want him driving, could wreck

No showers, could slip

 

This was a terrible decision, and you could tell by Mannings' expressions on the sidelines, that he

was not in agreement.

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