Suture Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 (edited) While I think he did a good job coming back from that injury, I am surprised at the low vote count for Vince Young and Cedric Benson. And what is Favre even doing in the running for this? Source: http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/news/story?id=4800984 Edited January 6, 2010 by Suture Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loaf Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 Brady's waaayyy to easy of a choice there. What Cadillac's been through and back from is well above Brady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbforbes Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 While Cadillac Williams was named the runner up, I really think that his comeback was far more impressive than Brady's. Williams is a running back - the epitome of a position requiring great legs - yet he came back from a second catastrophic knee injury. Although on one of the worst teams with a rookie quarterback, he beat out free agent acquisition Derrick Ward and gained more than 1000 yards from scrimmage and 7 touchdowns! Brady's a pocket-passing quarterback not known for his running game who came back from one, albeit serious, knee injury. He did have a decent season though I chalk the award up to another Brady lovefest. As for Young, Benson and Favre, in my opinion they warrant, at most, honorable mentions. I think that Young's problem was a mental one for which another season of learning the system could do nothing but help. As for Benson, while he was at Chicago, off of the field he was getting into trouble. No reason to pat him on the back for not getting into trouble, which people are expected to do whether in the NFL or not. On the field Benson was simply on the wrong team. As for Favre, amazingly, the guy continues to play at a high level. Moving him to the Vikings' system, with which he is well familiar, helped out a lot. His award will be the Hall of Fame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 Brady won the award as soon as he stepped on the field this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 I wasn't aware that CPTY is the new way to spell a$$hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpholmes Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 Brady won the award as soon as he stepped on the field this year. +1 Wish the world would get off the New England jock. Cadillac Williams, Cedric Benson, Vince Young, hell even Ricky Williams hitting 1,000 after six years.... All of them better candidates imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loaf Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 I wouldn't add Benson as he started showing flashes last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 They would never give it to Ricky Williams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Stanky Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 I would add Chad Ocho Cinco to that short list as well. Actually, I guess it was really his rookie year, since he was still Chad Johnson last year. 2008 Stats: 53 for 540 and 4 TD's 2009 Stats: 72 for 1047 and 9 TD's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengal Mania Posted January 6, 2010 Share Posted January 6, 2010 Benson was out of football first half of last year, to almost ProBowl this year. Out do to injury is stupid, esp when guy in question was a ProBowler before injury. It's not that inspiring that he's back to form. How 'bout giving it to players who skip OTA's............after all, they were gone, but now they're back!......what a comeback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Pat!!! Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Where's the thread from earlier in the season about this? Big John? CPOTY being given to a guy returning from injury is not a new concept. In fact, the last 3 or 4 were all guys who returned from season ending injuries. Where was the bitching when it was won by Chad Pennington? TWICE? Or Drew Brees? or Steve Smith? All guys returning from injuries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Who is bitching? Just some guys throwing out some other candidates? I think Brady deserved it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbpfan1231 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Does the P stand for a tasty morsel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pope Flick Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) I think inured players should primarily be the only ones eligible. Otherwise it's the "You're Not Lame Anymore? Award." Or in Cedric Benson's case "You Finally Got Your Crap Together Award." I think not. And yes, I'm bitter. Edited January 7, 2010 by Pope Flick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mucca Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 I wouldn't add Benson as he started showing flashes last season. Agree, don't you have to come back from something. Benson never did anything to come back from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooty Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 anyone other than C. Williams is a joke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 anyone other than C. Williams is a joke +2 torn patelar tendons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig devilz Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 While Cadillac Williams was named the runner up, I really think that his comeback was far more impressive than Brady's. Williams is a running back - the epitome of a position requiring great legs - yet he came back from a second catastrophic knee injury. Although on one of the worst teams with a rookie quarterback, he beat out free agent acquisition Derrick Ward and gained more than 1000 yards from scrimmage and 7 touchdowns! Brady's a pocket-passing quarterback not known for his running game who came back from one, albeit serious, knee injury. He did have a decent season though I chalk the award up to another Brady lovefest. The hate, ignorance or pure stupidity continues....Hatriot Nation is still alive and well. It amazes me. I haven't seen anything like it, except in the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry. I recall, back around the beginning of the season, many people saying Brady would need 2 years to fully recover.... That still may be true, but before you dismiss Brady's year and deserving CPOTY award, consider this, In 2009, one year after having his MCL and ACL shredded, missing 99.9% of the 08' season, he comes back and puts up the second highest numbers of his Hall of Fame career. Second only to the record breaking stats he posted in 2007. Stats second only to the 2007 season: Completion % Attempts (3rd, 07' and 02' he had more) Completions (371, he had 373 in 02') Passing Yards Touchdowns ( 28, same as 02' and 04) Passing Yards per game QB Rating 16 Sacks, lowest of his career Yeah, I guess you could say he had a decent season This isn't just a comeback/attack to your post dforbes, it's more a general reply to the haters. If you're gunna rip the guy, at least do it with a little humor (read, hair, etc), that's funny. But the facts are the facts and the stats are the stats. IMO, he fully deserved the award. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) Comeback player of the year is a debate creator. I think Tom Brady winning it helps show it to be too much of a popularity contest among the rehabilitated. Sure, he deserves a lot of credit for his return. But too many voters just look for the biggest name coming back from a big injury and enter his name. The easy choice is too often the choice in a situation like this. (I link again to this recent column that runs through how the AP voting panel works and who’s on it.) I believe Cedric Benson, who was a bust let go by the team that drafted him and resurfaced to run for 1,251 yards for Cincinnati, was a better candidate. I think Cadillac Williams, who came back from two knee injuries to run effectively for the Bucs, was better, too. Vince Young got seven votes and finished third. To me, that’s another example of easy name recognition at work. Like Benson, he did well to revive his career. But while Chicago jettisoned the running back, Young always had the support of Titans owner Bud Adams and was consistently touted as the future even while he bottomed out. I was very impressed with Young. Once he was reinserted, he did far better than I expected, though questions remain. While he didn’t finish especially well, he’s grown by leaps and bounds. His performance against Arizona was spectacular. But it’s not that long of a trip to come back from anywhere if you’ve remained a favorite of the guy who writes the checks. Paul Kuharsky on espn.com Edited January 7, 2010 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) very interesting article linked in my post above. decided to post it too: Peyton Manning is expected to win the NFL MVP award, which will come to light Jan. 9. Like the three he’s won before, the MVP award won’t come with the support of Indianapolis Star reporter Mike Chappell or any other reporter from any medium who has seen all of Manning’s games. That’s because no one who covers the Colts has a vote. Manning’s win will be primarily a testament to his performance, and perhaps a bit of a testament to voter habit. It also speaks to the national scope of the league the voters cover and the neutrality of the panel put together by the Associated Press. Still, I believe the system can be seen as somewhat flawed. The 50 voters will submit their ballots Monday and the news of the seven individual awards and the All-Pro team will start coming out Tuesday. I’ve voted once, in 1995 when I covered the Raiders for the Oakland Tribune. Back then it was my understanding that there was one voter from each NFL market among the panelists. I am told that hasn’t been the case for some time even though many people, including several voters I’ve spoken with, still believe it is. AP says it has not fueled that impression. “It’s really pretty tough to put a panel together,” AP sports editor Terry Taylor said. “… We have a core who does a very, very good job -- who are conscientious, who call, who ask questions, whose jobs really haven’t changed that much. If you look at the list, it is pretty much a national list. That’s not the end-all be-all, but we don’t tinker with it too much.” “… If you look at some of the names on here, we’re very proud of this panel. There wasn’t a lot of, ‘Let’s build another contraption.’ ” AP is quick to provide the list of voters (see below; it includes three people who work for ESPN: Chris Berman, John Clayton and Chris Mortensen) and I’ve given it a thorough look this week. Barry Wilner, AP’s football writer, oversees the panel and manages the votes and results. He and AP are not focused on balance, either in terms of voters’ primary focus on their jobs or where they live and work. “We try to get the most informed vote that we can get,” Taylor said. “That’s not only for this panel, that’s for the polls that we have. It’s folks who pay attention to the game, who cover the game, who make it their business not to focus on just one team but are informed about the sport of pro football.” The emphasis is on national reporters and analysts who watch multiple games or travel the country getting close looks at numerous teams over the 17-week regular season. I understand that and think it’s a reasonable approach for the individual awards, though maybe not the most effective way to determine the All-Pro teams. It’s the smattering of local reporters that causes me some concern. Division Breakdown Teams represented by beat reporters who see every game: AFC East: Buffalo, New England, N.Y. Jets, Miami AFC North: Cleveland (twice), Pittsburgh AFC South: Houston AFC West: Denver, Kansas City, Oakland NFC East: Dallas, N.Y. Giants, Philadelphia, Washington NFC North: Chicago, Green Bay NFC South: New Orleans NFC West: San Francisco, Seattle, Arizona Teams not represented by beat reporters who see every game: AFC North: Baltimore, Cincinnati AFC South: Indianapolis, Jacksonville, Tennessee AFC West: San Diego NFC North: Detroit, Minnesota NFC South: Atlanta, Carolina, Tampa Bay NFC West: St. Louis There are 21 by my count who may follow the league but are locked in on one team all season, following a team home and away. Their presence has the potential to throw things off for the 12 teams whose markets don’t have such a focused representative. It’s complicated, of course. In these economic times, a “national” NFL newspaper writer often isn’t heading to see a different game every week. Instead he can be cast as a home-team columnist on game day or he can report to work one day to find out he’s become part of the coverage team on the local beat. At least a dozen panelists fit that category. Two voters the AP considers national cover the Cleveland Browns full time, including home and away games. I suspect if a left guard from the AFC South or NFC South -- divisions that have only one voter tied to them -- lost an All-Pro spot narrowly to a member of the Browns, there could be fair grounds for debate. “What would we tell somebody if he lost out to a guy from Cleveland?” Taylor said. “We’re pretty transparent. We’d call the voters. You got the list. We don’t keep that a secret. We can ask them what they thought.” Seeing a player more often in person doesn’t necessarily sway an opinion or a vote. I believe all these people strive to be impartial, following the entire league more than well enough to fill out a fair ballot. It takes reporting beyond what they do for their jobs to do it well, and if they do it well the AP holds on to them tight. They are unlikely to be praised for getting it right, and very likely to be bashed if something comes to light where they are perceived to be wrong. All for free. But each person is on the panel because of his specific expertise, which surely has a bearing on his opinion. And through networks that connect them, semi-formally and informally, they exchange thoughts on candidates and make the case for or against players or coaches they cover. National or not, the fact that the AFC East has a voter connected to each of its teams means more visibility through voters' lenses for a player on a team in that division than for one in the AFC South or NFC South. In 2003, when Manning and Steve McNair split the MVP award, there was a voter who covered the Titans, but not one who covered the Colts. The Titans writer backed McNair. If there had been a vote out of Indy, it could have offset that and McNair might not have won his half of the trophy. That’s an extreme example, and we can pick apart any vote in any variety of ways. But when we’re talking league history, Hall of Fame résumés and contract bonuses, perhaps the potential for such things needs to be minimized. Geography is not a big factor for AP when considering national voters. Why should their location be an issue? Well, I lean toward Cincinnati running back Cedric Benson for comeback player of the year, but Tom Brady is a popular candidate as well. Maybe with TV and the Internet, no one really qualifies as local anymore. Still, I’d feel better about Benson getting a fair shake against such a notable name and story if a Cincinnati representative were in position to make a case for him in the chatter building up to the voting. It seems most fair to me to have a voter from each of the 32 markets plus national folks, but the days where that’s feasible are probably ending as the media landscape continues to evolve. There were about six spots that changed hands this year. We shouldn’t expect a perfect distribution, and it shouldn’t be the AP’s goal. It’s not realistic to seek national NFL reporters or analysts who are based in San Diego or Kansas City or Indianapolis. Still, that 20 percent of the voters are New York-based or 32 percent come from New York, Baltimore, Washington and Philadelphia lends itself to complaints of East Coast bias -- an issue I am usually loath to give any credence. For a league that extends from San Diego to Miami to Minneapolis, could things be better dispersed? “You’re looking at this regionally, and I’ve just never looked at it regionally,” Taylor said. “You can see there are voters from the West, the South, the East. I just never broke it down geographically.” I’ve seen no huge controversy erupt out of AP award results, and I hope one doesn’t come up. If it did, I suspect we’d revisit much of this again. I also can’t remember a conversation hashing this out, and thought it wouldn’t be a bad thing if we started one here as you check out the 50 people who will cast ballots Monday. link Edited January 7, 2010 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Stanky Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 The hate, ignorance or pure stupidity continues....Hatriot Nation is still alive and well.It amazes me. I haven't seen anything like it, except in the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry. I recall, back around the beginning of the season, many people saying Brady would need 2 years to fully recover.... That still may be true, but before you dismiss Brady's year and deserving CPOTY award, consider this, In 2009, one year after having his MCL and ACL shredded, missing 99.9% of the 08' season, he comes back and puts up the second highest numbers of his Hall of Fame career. Second only to the record breaking stats he posted in 2007. Stats second only to the 2007 season: Completion % Attempts (3rd, 07' and 02' he had more) Completions (371, he had 373 in 02') Passing Yards Touchdowns ( 28, same as 02' and 04) Passing Yards per game QB Rating 16 Sacks, lowest of his career Yeah, I guess you could say he had a decent season This isn't just a comeback/attack to your post dforbes, it's more a general reply to the haters. If you're gunna rip the guy, at least do it with a little humor (read, hair, etc), that's funny. But the facts are the facts and the stats are the stats. IMO, he fully deserved the award. Yes, he put up his 2nd best statistical season of his career, but you fail to mention that it was his second full season with Moss and Welker at his disposal. I definitely think Brady was a candidate, but I still feel that others were more deserving. Truthfully, wouldn't we have all been really surprised if Brady didn't have a good year? Like stated before, Knee ligament injuries aren't nearly as difficult to come back from for QB's. What Cadillac did this year is simply amazing. I would venture to say that the majority of us here, as well as the majority of personnel people in the NFL thought his career was over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) +1 Wish the world would get off the New England jock. Cadillac Williams, Cedric Benson, Vince Young, hell even Ricky Williams hitting 1,000 after six years.... All of them better candidates imo. Disagree on C Wms but otherwise yeah. Young IMO is the easy choice; choosing Brady is NE lovefest and idiotic choice. It's not like he sucked last year and "came back." He returned from injury, so yeah gee I guess he did a lot better than last year. He had a great year and credit to him, but didn't deserve this. Edited January 7, 2010 by BeeR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbforbes Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 The hate, ignorance or pure stupidity continues....Hatriot Nation is still alive and well.It amazes me. I haven't seen anything like it, except in the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry. I recall, back around the beginning of the season, many people saying Brady would need 2 years to fully recover.... That still may be true, but before you dismiss Brady's year and deserving CPOTY award, consider this, In 2009, one year after having his MCL and ACL shredded, missing 99.9% of the 08' season, he comes back and puts up the second highest numbers of his Hall of Fame career. Second only to the record breaking stats he posted in 2007. Stats second only to the 2007 season: Completion % Attempts (3rd, 07' and 02' he had more) Completions (371, he had 373 in 02') Passing Yards Touchdowns ( 28, same as 02' and 04) Passing Yards per game QB Rating 16 Sacks, lowest of his career Yeah, I guess you could say he had a decent season This isn't just a comeback/attack to your post dforbes, it's more a general reply to the haters. If you're gunna rip the guy, at least do it with a little humor (read, hair, etc), that's funny. But the facts are the facts and the stats are the stats. IMO, he fully deserved the award. pig devilz: While your post may not, as you profess, be "just a comeback/attack" to my previous post, your references to perceived "hate, ignorance or pure stupidity" more accurately portray your own mental state. Unfortunately, I've read too many of your posts over the months. Although I am not going to go back and reread your drivel again to ensure complete accuracy, to my recollection they almost invariably swallow the Patriots' and/or Brady's baby hose, to the exclusion of all else. When finished, wipe the juice from your lips, as its not polite to wear a milk moustache all day long. As for humor, while I do like Brady as much as any fantasy football player (in 2007 he gave me 2 regular season chamionships before, unfortunately, crumbling during weeks 14 through 16), I saw nothing funny about giving the CPOY award to him - again, a lovefest - when there are more worthy players out there. Happy new year! dbforbes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig devilz Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 pig devilz: While your post may not, as you profess, be "just a comeback/attack" to my previous post, your references to perceived "hate, ignorance or pure stupidity" more accurately portray your own mental state. Unfortunately, I've read too many of your posts over the months. Although I am not going to go back and reread your drivel again to ensure complete accuracy, to my recollection they almost invariably swallow the Patriots' and/or Brady's baby hose, to the exclusion of all else. When finished, wipe the juice from your lips, as its not polite to wear a milk moustache all day long. As for humor, while I do like Brady as much as any fantasy football player (in 2007 he gave me 2 regular season chamionships before, unfortunately, crumbling during weeks 14 through 16), I saw nothing funny about giving the CPOY award to him - again, a lovefest - when there are more worthy players out there. Happy new year! dbforbes it's all right there, bolded above. you have just added to the hate, ignorance and stupidity with your attempt at humor. being the n00b that you are, i take it you were not around for the bashing in 2007 and last year. try searching for any post from 2007 regarding the Patriots...you'll see that you have fallen right in line and proved me correct. while you're at it, you may stumble across chief dicks(?) hair thread...now that was funny! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbforbes Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 it's all right there, bolded above. you have just added to the hate, ignorance and stupidity with your attempt at humor. being the n00b that you are, i take it you were not around for the bashing in 2007 and last year. try searching for any post from 2007 regarding the Patriots...you'll see that you have fallen right in line and proved me correct. while you're at it, you may stumble across chief dicks(?) hair thread...now that was funny! [/quote n00b? Do you this of this as your own little butt-pirate fraternity or something? While I was not on this forum until this season, I've been a Huddle member for years. Regardless, the nonsensical crap you write, and the term "write" is quite genereous, remains crap,no matter if you've been writing it for days, weeks, months or years. I sincerely loose brain cells after each and every one of your posts. I'm sure that too many others feel the same way. Maybe you should go out, find a man, and take the pole you always been dreaming of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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