WR Larry Fitzgerald

[j2v]

Larry Fitzgerald has spent the last three seasons building a case as the NFL’s top receiver, averaging 1,300 yards and a dozen touchdowns per year over that span. And he won’t have to battle Anquan Boldin for looks anymore, with his former wingman now plying his trade in Baltimore.

 

However, the retirement of Kurt Warner has upset the apple cart in Arizona. It’s now Matt Leinart at the helm, and on the heels of that personnel change Ken Whisenhunt wants the Cards to be more of a running team behind 2009 first-round pick Beanie Wells.

 

That’s a ton of upheaval this offseason—some in Fitz’s favor, some maybe not so much. When the dust settles in Arizona, is Fitzgerald still the 150-plus targeted stud despite the quarterback change and philosophical reset? Or does he get caught up in the Cardinals’ changes to the detriment of his fantasy productivity?

[Seahawks21]

It is really hard to think of Larry Fitzgerald as anything but an elite receiver, but I don't know that he can be with Leinart at the helm, at least until they build some kind of connection.

[BeeR]

I recall that Leinert actually favored Boldin, FWIW. Anyway until he shows he can do anything consistently besides suck, Fitz will be no more than "good" vs "great"

[buddahj]

It is really hard to think of Larry Fitzgerald as anything but an elite receiver, but I don't know that he can be with Leinart at the helm, at least until they build some kind of connection.

agree

[darin3]

Go on, keep undervaluing him.

[tazinib1]

Go on, keep undervaluing him.

 

I'm not so sure its Larry that is getting undervalued but the fact that Leinart is so pedestrian. He has failed miserably getting the ball deep to Larry so far. I think Larry's biggest chance to retain his current stat line is to have the Cardinal brass realize Leinart is not the answer and insert a cannon for an arm Skelton. Derek Anderson is no prize either and I thank you for trading both of them to me in AFL. I'll be kicking both of them to the curb next year.

[Scorcher]

Fitzgerald's situation makes me think of Moss at Oakland.

[buddahj]

Fitzgerald's situation makes me think of Moss at Oakland.

Maybe, but I don't think he'll quit on his team like Moss did.

[Scorcher]

Maybe, but I don't think he'll quit on his team like Moss did.

 

 

I agree, but he can't catch what isn't there. Do you think Fitz will be double teamed? If so how well do you think Leinert will deal with that?

[buddahj]

I agree, but he can't catch what isn't there. Do you think Fitz will be double teamed? If so how well do you think Leinert will deal with that?

Oh, he'll be doubled teamed all season. IMO, Leinart hasn't shown any ability to perform @ the NFL level. Hopefully, the Cards organization will recognize that Leinart isn't the answer.

[MTSuper7]

Steve Smith (CAR) put up decent numbers despite having similarly pedestrian QB play. If we agree that Fitz is a better WR than Steve Smith, why would we let Leinart drag down his value more than we let Delhomme (in past years) drag down Smith's?

[buddahj]

Steve Smith (CAR) put up decent numbers despite having similarly pedestrian QB play. If we agree that Fitz is a better WR than Steve Smith, why would we let Leinart drag down his value more than we let Delhomme (in past years) drag down Smith's?

IMO, in his prime...Delhomme was a better QB than Leinart.

[Scorcher]

Steve Smith (CAR) put up decent numbers despite having similarly pedestrian QB play. If we agree that Fitz is a better WR than Steve Smith, why would we let Leinart drag down his value more than we let Delhomme (in past years) drag down Smith's?

 

 

 

 

Last year Smith had 7 TD's , 3 of which came in conscutively in 3 games with Matt Moore at the end of the season. Had Delhomme finished the season, Smith's numbers would have been considerably less than they ended up being. In the 1st 12 weeks he had 4 total touchdowns as Delhomme's primary target. Leinart will never match Delhomme in his prime. Leinart will never play in a SB unless he backs up someone who gets injured in the actual game.

Edited August 16, 2010 by Scorcher

[MTSuper7]

Last year Smith had 7 TD's , 3 of which came in conscutively in 3 games with Matt Moore at the end of the season. Had Delhomme finished the season, Smith's numbers would have been considerably less than they ended up being. In the 1st 12 weeks he had 4 total touchdowns as Delhomme's primary target. Leinart will never match Delhomme in his prime. Leinart will never play in a SB unless he backs up someone who gets injured in the actual game.

 

OK, then consider the numbers Calvin Johnson has been able to put up with crappy/unproven QBs. And let's also consider that Matt Moore may or may not be better than Matt Leinart (the jury's out, yes?). I guess my point is that elite level WRs can beat double teams, and they can get theirs regardless of the QB situation. I'd argue that the offensive line is probably the bigger concern. Because as long as they can keep Leinart upright, Fitzgerald is going to be Leinart's first read the majority of the time. Sure, bump him down some because Warner retired, but bumping him to the point where he gets taken after guys like Roddy White and Greg Jennings is a mistake IMO. Not sure if anyone is bumping him to the bottom of the top 10 or not... To me he's still top 5 after AJ, Wayne, Austin and probably Moss (in a PPR, I think I like Fitz more than Moss actually).

[MTSuper7]

IMO, in his prime...Delhomme was a better QB than Leinart.

 

Delhomme had two decent seasons in '04 and '05, and he didn't make an impact in the NFL until he was 29 years old... Maybe it's just me, but I feel like Leinart is still young enough where maybe we haven't yet seen his best. And even if all we get out of Leinart is middle of the road play (i.e. Kyle Orton), I'm still comfortable with the idea that Fitzgerald is going to get the majority of targets.

[delusions of grandeur]

OK, then consider the numbers Calvin Johnson has been able to put up with crappy/unproven QBs. And let's also consider that Matt Moore may or may not be better than Matt Leinart (the jury's out, yes?). I guess my point is that elite level WRs can beat double teams, and they can get theirs regardless of the QB situation. I'd argue that the offensive line is probably the bigger concern. Because as long as they can keep Leinart upright, Fitzgerald is going to be Leinart's first read the majority of the time. Sure, bump him down some because Warner retired, but bumping him to the point where he gets taken after guys like Roddy White and Greg Jennings is a mistake IMO. Not sure if anyone is bumping him to the bottom of the top 10 or not... To me he's still top 5 after AJ, Wayne, Austin and probably Moss (in a PPR, I think I like Fitz more than Moss actually).

 

Could not agree more. I think Calvin is a perfect example. Take away last year with a rookie QB, injuries and triple-teams, and Calvin was completely unstoppable in 2008 with horrible QBs throwing to him... Why? Because he's Calvin Johnson.

 

For me, the same goes for Fitz. I've seen him double-teamed before with an off throw going to him, but does that ever stop him? As Warner said himself (I paraphrase) "I'd throw a bad ball to Fitzgerald, and he'd come down a get it, and say 'Thanks, that's exactly where I wanted it'".

 

Now if Leinart doesn't end up getting it done, then he'll be replaced by someone who can take advantage of one of the most talented freakish receivers in the game. I guess I can see the risk in redraft, but I don't see Fitz falling off, regardless of his supporting cast.

[Scorcher]

OK, then consider the numbers Calvin Johnson has been able to put up with crappy/unproven QBs. And let's also consider that Matt Moore may or may not be better than Matt Leinart (the jury's out, yes?). I guess my point is that elite level WRs can beat double teams, and they can get theirs regardless of the QB situation. I'd argue that the offensive line is probably the bigger concern. Because as long as they can keep Leinart upright, Fitzgerald is going to be Leinart's first read the majority of the time. Sure, bump him down some because Warner retired, but bumping him to the point where he gets taken after guys like Roddy White and Greg Jennings is a mistake IMO. Not sure if anyone is bumping him to the bottom of the top 10 or not... To me he's still top 5 after AJ, Wayne, Austin and probably Moss (in a PPR, I think I like Fitz more than Moss actually).

 

 

Megatron had 5 td's last year and 3 less yards than Smith. There is no denying the tremendous talent of Fitz as well the other WR's discussed here but without the Qb I don't see it happening. Can anyone name a WR that had a great year with a so-so QB? Actually I just thought of one as I was posting, Brandon Marshall.

[delusions of grandeur]

Megatron had 5 td's last year and 3 less yards than Smith. There is no denying the tremendous talent of Fitz as well the other WR's discussed here but without the Qb I don't see it happening. Can anyone name a WR that had a great year with a so-so QB? Actually I just thought of one as I was posting, Brandon Marshall.

 

Take away last year with a rookie QB, injuries and triple-teams, and Calvin was completely unstoppable in 2008 with horrible QBs throwing to him... Why? Because he's Calvin Johnson.

[Scorcher]

Delusions: For some reason I couldn't copy your quote. Add a rookie or so-so Qb instead of taking away and were you happy with Megatron last year? I had him and I wasn't. Do I deny his talent? No, but his circumstances made him a less than stellar fantasy wr last year. I had him on my lowest scoring team.

[delusions of grandeur]

Delusions: For some reason I couldn't copy your quote. Add a rookie or so-so Qb instead of taking away and were you happy with Megatron last year? I had him and I wasn't. Do I deny his talent? No, but his circumstances made him a less than stellar fantasy wr last year. I had him on my lowest scoring team.

 

Either hit quote or reply, underneath my reply.

 

Again, you HAVE to take away last season where everything was working against Megatron... Two years ago, he did great with an awful QB and only double-teams...

 

So do you think Fitz will be triple-teamed like Calvin was last year? Probably not, because Breaston, Doucet, Roberts and the running game are all better than what Calvin was working with last year.

 

Do you think Leinart is going to be worse than a rookie QB, who was admittedly "held back" and with his only good target was constantly covered? I don't.

 

Fitz might not have an ideal situation, but 2008 Calvin is a prime example of what a WR can do with much less. Fitz is not in that bad of a situation for a reciever of his freakish ability. Should I even get started with what Crabtree did, coming in late with no experience in that offense?

Edited August 16, 2010 by delusions of granduer

[i_am_the_swammi]

If Kyle Orton can get the ball to a double-teamed Brandon Marshall 100+ times, I have no reason to think Larry Fitz won't have 90+ receptions and 9+ TDs.

[MTSuper7]

Yeah, Megatron missed a couple games last year and played quite a bit less than 100%. He still almost had 1000 yards and was just shy of 70 catches. Who knows where his numbers end up if he's healthy the whole year.

 

As for other WRs who put up good numbers with iffy QB situations:

 

Chad Johnson put up 90-1355-10 with Jon Kitna in 2003

Randy Moss put up sick numbers with Randall Cunningham (age 35), Jeff George, Daunte Culpepper, and even had 1,000 yds and 8TDs his first year in Oakland with Kerry Collins as his QB.

Andre RIson put up solid numbers his first 4 years with Atlanta despite Chris Miller, Billy Joe Tolliver, Wade Wilson, etc.(and we're talking double digit TDs each year, over 80 catches, etc.)

 

Without looking for more examples, suffice it to say that WRs can make the QB in many cases. Randy Moss is a good example. Look at Culpepper without Moss... So if Leinart can just learn to heave the ball to Fitz and pray, he should be fine...

[bankerboy]

Now the real question is...can Fitz provide top 5 production while double-teamed...a poor (potentially maturing) qb AND a bum knee?

Edited August 16, 2010 by bankerboy

[delusions of grandeur]

As for other WRs who put up good numbers with iffy QB situations:

 

Chad Johnson put up 90-1355-10 with Jon Kitna in 2003

Randy Moss put up sick numbers with Randall Cunningham (age 35), Jeff George, Daunte Culpepper, and even had 1,000 yds and 8TDs his first year in Oakland with Kerry Collins as his QB.

Andre RIson put up solid numbers his first 4 years with Atlanta despite Chris Miller, Billy Joe Tolliver, Wade Wilson, etc.(and we're talking double digit TDs each year, over 80 catches, etc.)

 

Great list, and there certainly is precedence here... And another Atlanta WR, this one who put up great numbers with awful QBs: Roddy White in 2007.

 

In the 4-12 aftermath of Vick's arrest, Roddy was thrown to all season by Joey Harrington, Chris Redman and Leftwich. However, this was also Roddy's breakout season, his first of 3 seasons with over 1200 yards.. He finished with 83 receptions, 1200 yards, and 6TDs, all easily career highs at the time.

 

Now the real question is...can Fitz provide top 5 production while double-teamed...a poor (potentially maturing) qb AND a bum knee?

 

The ankle is for sure the concern. If that becomes a nagging thing, then it might be a case where everything works against Fitz this season... But if he's back to full-health, then a QB can only hold back his tremendous talent so much, and I'm not convinced that the former Heisman Leinart is going to be so terrible that he won't be able to consistently connect with one of the leagues' easiest receivers to connect with.

 

(ETA: Hell, even with Leinart's dissapointing 2006 season, where Fitz missed a few games due to injury, he still put up 69/946/6.)

Edited August 16, 2010 by delusions of granduer

[ROYALWITCHEESE]

Hmm. I think a good way to look at this is that Fitz's ceiling is lower than his final tally from last season. "How much lower?", is the real question IMO.

 

With Leinhart, they are going to run it more and air it out less.

 

Warner is one of the most accurate QBs in NFL history. To expect Leinhart to come even close to duplicating that brilliance is very irresponsible.

 

Fitz is more likely to be injured with Leinhart at QB than Warner. It has already happened. One of Leinhart's moon balls (high and inside) forced Fitz to put himself in harm's way and a sprained MCL was the result. Looking at the play, he is lucky to come away with minimal damage.

 

I think he'll still be a fringe top 10 WR, but expecting him to challenge for anything close to the top spot is asking too much this year.

 

950 yards 9 TDs