Big news in Indianapolis! Dedicated discussion on the Colts

[cthomte]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81b7...h-hand-injuries

 

With there being some big injury news in Indianapolis with the Colts. I decided I would dedicate a post to discussing these injuries and talking about who is going to step up to the plate; who is going to fill the shoes of Collie and Clark?

 

Collies value had gone up with the injury of Clark but now that Collie is out for 2-6 weeks! Who is the guy that will benefit? Who is going to man up?

 

Of course Reggie Wayne and Garcon will continue to perform, but Collie has 6 touchdowns in 6 games of this season (he missed one in a game against KC because of injuries). A go to guy in the end-zone?

 

As mentioned in this post:

http://forums.thehuddle.com/index.php?showtopic=337236

 

There are rumors that Blair White is dealing with neck injuries (not sure how creditable this source is). Is Anthony Gonzalez going to be the guy who takes Collies place? Is Collie going to lose his starting job before he can return from his injury?

Edited October 21, 2010 by cthomte

[cthomte]

Hey, thanks for the input. Ill be sure to pick them up.

[cthomte]

 

I'd wait for them to be picked up by IND first.

 

Wasn't sure how to include the sarcasm in my statement. Would have helped?

[Gdawg]

Would you two like some privacy?

[cthomte]

More news from the RUMOR: Collie injured post..

 

http://forums.thehuddle.com/index.php?show...25&start=25

 

Looks like Gonzo is the definite starter?

 

From the colts news:

http://www.colts.com/sub.cfm?page=article7...6e-e70b30e5c898

Edited October 21, 2010 by cthomte

[cthomte]

Ugh decisions decisions... with 5 players on a bye week do I take this week as a loss and pick up Gonzalez..

 

What impact do you think Gonzalez will have in fantasy? How many looks, receptions, yards per reception, touchdowns??? What does everyone think?

[Balzac]

From the colts news:

http://www.colts.com/sub.cfm?page=article7...6e-e70b30e5c898

 

unless I missed something, that's a really old article that doesn't add much info to the present dilemma

[Balzac]

Ugh decisions decisions... with 5 players on a bye week do I take this week as a loss and pick up Gonzalez..

 

What impact do you think Gonzalez will have in fantasy? How many looks, receptions, yards per reception, touchdowns??? What does everyone think?

 

I wouldn't go bananas - it's not like Collie had been lighting it up since Garcon came back anyway. This is still very much going to be the Wayne/Garcon show . . . remember that Collie did most of his damage when Garcon was out. I think Gonzalez will be, at best, a WR3 in ppr leagues.

[Delicious_bass]

More news from the RUMOR: Collie injured post..

 

http://forums.thehuddle.com/index.php?show...25&start=25

 

Looks like Gonzo is the definite starter?

 

From the colts news:http://www.colts.com/sub.cfm?page=article7...6e-e70b30e5c898

The story at the end of that link is from May

 

By John Oehser - Special to Colts.com

Friday, May 21 2010

[cthomte]

The story at the end of that link is from May

 

Well don't I look dumb

 

Here we go:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/HeadLines...L&hl=187088

 

And im not sure what your talking about? Collie has been lighting it up all season? 6 touchdowns and still had one when Garcon came back.. Still a solid starter each week.

Edited October 21, 2010 by cthomte

[Brentastic]

I just picked up Gonzo in all 3 of my leagues (I have Collie in one of them). I had to drop Lance Moore in one league but with Bush coming back it seemed like a safe play.

 

I'll take my chances with a more proven Gonzo than an un-drafted White. Hopefully Gonzo is the play although his recent injury history is a worry.

[cthomte]

I just picked up Gonzo in all 3 of my leagues (I have Collie in one of them). I had to drop Lance Moore in one league but with Bush coming back it seemed like a safe play.

 

I'll take my chances with a more proven Gonzo than an un-drafted White. Hopefully Gonzo is the play although his recent injury history is a worry.

 

Yep I picked up Gonzo and White because with this bye week White might be fine in week 8 and get the go-ahead. My fantasy team is a mess right now and I think I might just take this week as a loss

[untateve]

I wouldn't go bananas - it's not like Collie had been lighting it up since Garcon came back anyway. This is still very much going to be the Wayne/Garcon show . . . remember that Collie did most of his damage when Garcon was out. I think Gonzalez will be, at best, a WR3 in ppr leagues.

 

But you also have to factor in that Dallas Clark is out and Clark was more like a receiver than a tight end. Those receptions have to go somewhere. I happen to believe there will be plenty the the 3 WR in the colt offense.

 

[i hope so. I've picked up just about every available colt]

[Balzac]

Well don't I look dumb

 

Here we go:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/HeadLines...L&hl=187088

 

And im not sure what your talking about? Collie has been lighting it up all season? 6 touchdowns and still had one when Garcon came back.. Still a solid starter each week.

 

just look at his game log - he's been solid but his two HUGE games came when Garcon wasn't around

[Balzac]

But you also have to factor in that Dallas Clark is out and Clark was more like a receiver than a tight end. Those receptions have to go somewhere. I happen to believe there will be plenty the the 3 WR in the colt offense.

 

[i hope so. I've picked up just about every available colt]

 

as do I - I just don't think it'll be a top 10 WR worth's of production, which is what Collie has been to date

[cthomte]

I dont think we all expected Collie to put up 20+ points weekly? Im happy with a solid 10 points? A touchdown per week is a solid start IMO.. He still had 11 points last week with Garcon putting up around 19 points?

 

So dont rule Collie out because of Garcon coming around.. the Manning - Collie connection was great.. I think its who Manning looked to when he needed to make a solid play. And especially with Reggie Wayne being double covered, more looks go to Collie.

 

So who is it that will fill the shoes? And how long will Collie even be out?

Edited October 22, 2010 by cthomte

[Balzac]

I dont think we all expected Collie to put up 20+ points weekly? Im happy with a solid 10 points? A touchdown per week is a solid start IMO.. He still had 11 points last week with Garcon putting up around 19 points?

 

So dont rule Collie out because of Garcon coming around.. the Manning - Collie connection was great.. I think its who Manning looked to when he needed to make a solid play. And especially with Reggie Wayne being double covered, more looks go to Collie.

 

So who is it that will fill the shoes? And how long will Collie even be out?

 

My intention wasn't to rule anyone out - I just think that some people have a higher view of Collie because of what he did the first 3 weeks. To me, he's a low end WR2 or high end WR3 - that's why I think Gonzo will be, at best a WR3.

[Brentastic]

just look at his game log - he's been solid but his two HUGE games came when Garcon wasn't around

I think that's a poor correlation. Collie didn't just stumble into 11 and 12 receptions in two separate games because Garcon was out. Garcon and Collie had nearly identical stats last season with Collie hauling in 3 more TDs than Garcon. It was clear from this pre-season that Garcon still has issues catching the ball AND Collie is more reliable (while Garcon is more explosive and physical). Collie was clearly becoming a favorite target of Mannings but in the end, Manning will let the defense decide who has the BIG game. No stud WR has a great game EVERY game either. Equating Collie's more earthly stats to Garcon's return is not recognizing Collie's value - he would have ended up a top 5 WR by year-end without this injury.

[Balzac]

I think that's a poor correlation. Collie didn't just stumble into 11 and 12 receptions in two separate games because Garcon was out. Garcon and Collie had nearly identical stats last season with Collie hauling in 3 more TDs than Garcon. It was clear from this pre-season that Garcon still has issues catching the ball AND Collie is more reliable (while Garcon is more explosive and physical). Collie was clearly becoming a favorite target of Mannings but in the end, Manning will let the defense decide who has the BIG game. No stud WR has a great game EVERY game either. Equating Collie's more earthly stats to Garcon's return is not recognizing Collie's value - he would have ended up a top 5 WR by year-end without this injury.

 

I couldn't disagree with you more. Just look at Collie's targets over the last 2 games since Garcon has come back - they're way down. Frankly, I'm not sure how you could reasonably argue that these two guys don't leech a significant amount of fantasy value away from one another when they're both in the game. Way I see it, Collie is a WR1 when Garcon isn't running around stealing looks from him; he's a WR2/3 when they're both out there. That is, I'm not saying Collie is junk when Garcon is out there - he's just not going to be as productive as he would otherwise be on his own. I'm also not comparing them - doesn't matter which of the 2 is the better WR for this analysis.

[Brentastic]

I couldn't disagree with you more. Just look at Collie's targets over the last 2 games since Garcon has come back - they're way down. Frankly, I'm not sure how you could reasonably argue that these two guys don't leech a significant amount of fantasy value away from one another when they're both in the game. Way I see it, Collie is a WR1 when Garcon isn't running around stealing looks from him; he's a WR2/3 when they're both out there. That is, I'm not saying Collie is junk when Garcon is out there - he's just not going to be as productive as he would otherwise be on his own. I'm also not comparing them - doesn't matter which of the 2 is the better WR for this analysis.

I think it's coincidental that Collie had reduced production with Garcon in the lineup because if you look at last year's game logs (a full season) that correlation doesn't match. My point is that ANY WR, even the uber studs, have 'down' games. In fact I would say that any given stud on a good year only has 8 GREAT games and even that's a stretch. So because Collie had 2 average games with Garcon in the lineup is purely coincidental because a sample size of 2 games isn't enough to draw a valid correlation. If it played out like that for another 5 games or so then I might lean your way but as of now I don't think you can make that correlation. Again, look at last season's game logs if you want a 16 game sample. The fact is that Manning will find the open man and the production of either receiver is more dependent on who the defense decides it wants to focus on - bottom line. That means some games Collie's production could be enhanced with Garcon on the field (if the defense focuses more on Garcon) and vice versa. It really depends on the defense.

Edited October 22, 2010 by Brentastic

[Balzac]

I think it's coincidental that Collie had reduced production with Garcon in the lineup because if you look at last year's game logs (a full season) that correlation doesn't match. My point is that ANY WR, even the uber studs, have 'down' games. In fact I would say that any given stud on a good year only has 8 GREAT games and even that's a stretch. So because Collie had 2 average games with Garcon in the lineup is purely coincidental because a sample size of 2 games isn't enough to draw a valid correlation. If it played out like that for another 5 games or so then I might lean your way but as of now I don't think you can make that correlation. Again, look at last season's game logs if you want a 16 game sample. The fact is that Manning will find the open man and the production of either receiver is more dependent on who the defense decides it wants to focus on - bottom line. That means some games Collie's production could be enhanced with Garcon on the field (if the defense focuses more on Garcon) and vice versa. It really depends on the defense.

 

So . . . why wasn't Collie a stud fantasy WR last year (is there a huge difference in 2010 over 2009 that I'm just not thinking of)? My point is really quite simple - there are only so many balls to go around when all of their targets are healthy. When it's just Wayne, Clark and Collie, more balls will (on average) go to each. What am I missing here?

[BearBroncos]

I wouldn't go bananas - it's not like Collie had been lighting it up since Garcon came back anyway. This is still very much going to be the Wayne/Garcon show . . . remember that Collie did most of his damage when Garcon was out. I think Gonzalez will be, at best, a WR3 in ppr leagues.

 

That's the thing. Manning does this with returning starters. Garcon wasn't going to get that same kind of action but Manning likes to get the player re-involved. I think he will do it again with Gonzales as long as he isn't making mistake. If he drops a catchable ball or doesn't hussle, Manning will stop throwing to him. But Manning is NETORIOUS for feeding the returning guy and against Houston.... WHOA!!

[MikesVikes]

Hasn't Collie been banged up himself the last few weeks when he's been playing alongside Garcon? Why does Garcon's injury factor in but not Collie's?

[SatchDork]

I think they should just trade for Vincent Jackson

[Big John]

I think they should just trade for Vincent Jackson

The trading deadline was Tuesday.