keggerz Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) Rivera said in his presser (I am paraphrasing) that he sees the Panthers D as a 4-3 D...said personnel is set up for it...personnel set up if can make a couple of additions to it can be a solid unit and have success early....likes the situation the defense is in...some elements of the 3-4 that can be used and use the personnel properly to give opponents a little bit of trouble .... Edited January 11, 2011 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Kinda expected . . . but good to hear from an IDP standpoint for their front 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) Kinda expected . . . but good to hear from an IDP standpoint for their front 4 front SEVEN. agreed and fixed Edited January 11, 2011 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 agreed and fixed Really? Obviously we will differ on this but when it comes to the d-line (depending on scoring) they collectively do not as much value as a d-line in a 3-4 where the nose and linemen tie up linemen instead of accumulate tackles/sacks as in a 4-3. Some linebackers increase in value moving to 3-4 versus a 4-3, while some decrease, but I would guess (becasue I am too lazy to look it up) that the overall value for d-line is less in a 3-4 versus a 4-3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 Really? Obviously we will differ on this but when it comes to the d-line (depending on scoring) they collectively do not as much value as a d-line in a 3-4 where the nose and linemen tie up linemen instead of accumulate tackles/sacks as in a 4-3. Some linebackers increase in value moving to 3-4 versus a 4-3, while some decrease, but I would guess (becasue I am too lazy to look it up) that the overall value for d-line is less in a 3-4 versus a 4-3. staying in the 4-3 is good for the front 7: 4 DL: DE Charles Johnson (his value would have taken a HUGH hit going to a 3-4) DE Everette Brown (has upside in a 4-3, in a 3-4 would have probably been moved to LB, not good) DTs(Landri and Draft Pick probably)...not much value IDP wise but would have been even less going to a 3-4 3 LBs: Beason would have been productive in a 3-4 but not near the upside he more than likely keeps in the 4-3 that the Panthers will run Thomas Davis or whoever they line up at WLB is going to have very good value...much better than playing SILB in a 3-4 and in a 3-4 Davis very likely could have been moved to a rush OLB spot James Anderson his value was going to take a hit no matter what but in a 3-4 he more than likely would have been moved to SILB which would still be an ok move but the big plus is for Beason/Davis(wlb) and Charles Johnson...all of which would have very likely had their stats negatively hit with a move to a 3-4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 Really? Obviously we will differ on this but when it comes to the d-line (depending on scoring) they collectively do not as much value as a d-line in a 3-4 where the nose and linemen tie up linemen instead of accumulate tackles/sacks as in a 4-3. Some linebackers increase in value moving to 3-4 versus a 4-3, while some decrease, but I would guess (becasue I am too lazy to look it up) that the overall value for d-line is less in a 3-4 versus a 4-3. ok and to clarify...4-3 DEs usually will have MUCH more value than a 3-4 DE(there are rare occasions they can be productive but it isn't the norm) and while some LBs perform well in a 3-4 (Willis, Timmons & Donnie Edwards in the past) the 4-3 for Carolina helps to keep their LBs at their value and there aren't any worries about who moves to play a rush OLB spot (like Ware, Merriman, Phillips) which would equate to very inconsistent stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 ok and to clarify...4-3 DEs usually will have MUCH more value than a 3-4 DE(there are rare occasions they can be productive but it isn't the norm) and while some LBs perform well in a 3-4 (Willis, Timmons & Donnie Edwards in the past) the 4-3 for Carolina helps to keep their LBs at their value and there aren't any worries about who moves to play a rush OLB spot (like Ware, Merriman, Phillips) which would equate to very inconsistent stats. Ahh . . you are calculating value in a DE moving positions to a LB, correct? I wasnt looking at individuals and how they would be impacted, but moreso as an overall assessmnet of IDP value of a traditional 3-4 DE versus a traditional 4-3 DE. I wasnt specifically assigning position changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 Ahh . . you are calculating value in a DE moving positions to a LB, correct? I wasnt looking at individuals and how they would be impacted, but moreso as an overall assessmnet of IDP value of a traditional 3-4 DE versus a traditional 4-3 DE. I wasnt specifically assigning position changes. correct, i think but yes for sure the IDP Value of a 4-3 DE normally far far outweighs that of a 3-4 DE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staniels12 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 correct, i think but yes for sure the IDP Value of a 4-3 DE normally far far outweighs that of a 3-4 DE AND a DE from a 4-3 takes a death blow when they go 3-4 and have to be started as a LB. You need tackles from your LBs, and sacks are just gravy. See: Jason Taylor. From Hero to Zero with the scheme change. Of course he's getting a little long in the tooth as well. Now if your DE is also playing some LB, but you can START him as a DE, then that will work to your advantage if he's getting the extra tackles AND still scoring some sacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staniels12 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 correct, i think but yes for sure the IDP Value of a 4-3 DE normally far far outweighs that of a 3-4 DE Keggerz - don't think you saw this, as it was the last post before the topic got buried. Thought you'd appreciate it. My bad Keggerz! How could I leave you out of the props line?!? And we started out back in 1992 in my first apartment without even planning on going IDP (we had NO idea what we were doing, but we realllllly wanted to try this "Rotisserie Football" thing), but then somebody called out "Reggie White" halfway through the draft. The other 7 of us just looked around at each other and finally said "what the f, I guess we're gonna do defensive guys too!" And that started the first "run" on a position we had ever seen, as everybody scrambled to get the big names on defense. I was THRILLED to score Cortez Kennedy after all the other sack guys had been scooped up. Of course it never even crossed our minds that mayyyyybe we shoulda grabbed the LBs first because tackle points would be more valuable. Ignorance was bliss, lemme tell ya! Good times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 Keggerz - don't think you saw this, as it was the last post before the topic got buried. Thought you'd appreciate it. My bad Keggerz! How could I leave you out of the props line?!? And we started out back in 1992 in my first apartment without even planning on going IDP (we had NO idea what we were doing, but we realllllly wanted to try this "Rotisserie Football" thing), but then somebody called out "Reggie White" halfway through the draft. The other 7 of us just looked around at each other and finally said "what the f, I guess we're gonna do defensive guys too!" And that started the first "run" on a position we had ever seen, as everybody scrambled to get the big names on defense. I was THRILLED to score Cortez Kennedy after all the other sack guys had been scooped up. Of course it never even crossed our minds that mayyyyybe we shoulda grabbed the LBs first because tackle points would be more valuable. Ignorance was bliss, lemme tell ya! Good times. I did see that, thanks and that is a cool story about gettting started in IDP too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 Greg Manusky (formerly DC for SF) to take over as DC for the Chargers...3-4 will remain the D in SD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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