Bier Meister Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Well, then Orton is your guy. Have fun. no.. not really. i never thought he was good for denver. he has just done better than what i expected from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 no.. not really. i never thought he was good for denver. he has just done better than what i expected from him. Check his splits in the 10 loses last year and let me know if he still impresses you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) week 1: L 17-24 @ jax. 295 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 63.6%, rtg of 89.8 week 3: L 13-27 vs indy. 476 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 64.9% rtg of 89.5 week 5: L 17-31 @ bal. 314 yds, 2 tds, 0 int. 60.5%, rtg of 104.5 week 6: L 20-24 vs jets. 209 yds, 1 td, 0 int. 41.2%, rtg of 71,8 week 7: L 14-59 vs oak. 198 yds, 2 tds, 1 int. 41.4%, rtg of 73.6 week 8: L 16-24 @ sfo. 370 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 70%, rtg of 96.9 week 10: L 14-35 @ sd. 217 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 63.2%, rtg of 76.3 week 11: L 33-36 vs stl. 347 yds, 3 tds, 0 int. 58.5%, rtg of 110.5 week 12: L 6-10 @ kc. 117 yds, 0 td, 0 int. 32.1%, rtg of 46.3 week 13: L 13-43 @ arz. 166 yds, 0 tds, 3 ints. 46.3%, rtg of 27.1 so..... from what i see is a list of decent numbers except for weeks 12 and 13. 4 were playoff teams. 7 had records of 8-8 or better. 6 were on the road. their defense gave up a ton of pts. edit: missed an int in week 7 Edited July 5, 2011 by Bier Meister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 week 1: L 17-24 @ jax. 295 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 63.6%, rtg of 89.8week 3: L 13-27 vs indy. 476 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 64.9% rtg of 89.5 week 5: L 17-31 @ bal. 314 yds, 2 tds, 0 int. 60.5%, rtg of 104.5 week 6: L 20-24 vs jets. 209 yds, 1 td, 0 int. 41.2%, rtg of 71,8 week 7: L 14-59 vs oak. 198 yds, 2 tds, 0 int. 41.4%, rtg of 73.6 week 8: L 16-24 @ sfo. 370 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 70%, rtg of 96.9 week 10: L 14-35 @ sd. 217 yds, 1 td, 1 int. 63.2%, rtg of 76.3 week 11: L 33-36 vs stl. 347 yds, 3 tds, 0 int. 58.5%, rtg of 110.5 week 12: L 6-10 @ kc. 117 yds, 0 td, 0 int. 32.1%, rtg of 46.3 week 13: L 13-43 @ arz. 166 yds, 0 tds, 3 ints. 46.3%, rtg of 27.1 so..... from what i see is a list of decent numbers except for weeks 12 and 13. 4 were playoff teams. 7 had records of 8-8 or better. 6 were on the road. their defense gave up a ton of pts. Here's the compilation of your "decent" numbers: 10 games 211 completions in 379 attempts for a 55.7% comp % 2709 yds 12 TDs 8 INTs 15 rushes 93 yds Those kinds of numbers contribute directly to loses in the NFL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Here the NFL ranking of those pass Ds by overall rating: week 1: L 17-24 @ jax. #31 week 3: L 13-27 vs indy. #27 week 5: L 17-31 @ bal. #5 week 6: L 20-24 vs jets. #6 week 7: L 14-59 vs oak. #18 week 8: L 16-24 @ sfo. #26 week 10: L 14-35 @ sd. #4 week 11: L 33-36 vs stl. #9 week 12: L 6-10 @ kc. #8 week 13: L 13-43 @ arz. #16 5 good pass Ds, 2 average pass Ds, 3 crappy pass Ds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Here's the compilation of your "decent" numbers: 10 games 211 completions in 379 attempts for a 55.7% comp % 2709 yds 12 TDs 8 INTs 15 rushes 93 yds Those kinds of numbers contribute directly to loses in the NFL. averaged 270 yds/game (including the 2 crappers in weeks 12 & 13) 4, nearly 5 300 yd games. 12 tds, 7 ints (3 in 1 game)... essentially a 3:1 td:int ratio their defense gave up less than 20 once gave up more than 30 5 times also...pass defense: sd #1 oak #2 nyj #6 indy #13 kcc #17 stl #19 bal #21 arz #23 sf #24 jax #28 again with the exception of 2 games, decent numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 as always, you bring solid info. "They" say that a QB really earns his paycheck on third down, where Orton completed 50% (60 of 120 passes) with 3 TDs and 5 INTs. Orton's 2010 completion percentage on 3rd down with the following yds to go for a 1st down: <3 yds 44.4% 3-7 yds 48.1% 8-11 yds 48.4% > 11 yds 57.7% More than half his opportunities were in the 7 yds or less range. The guy simply did not keep the chains moving regularly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Orton's 2010 completion percentage on 3rd down with the following yds to go for a 1st down: <3 yds 44.4% 3-7 yds 48.1% 8-11 yds 48.4% > 11 yds 57.7% More than half his opportunities were in the 7 yds or less range. The guy simply did not keep the chains moving regularly. he got better the more predictable the play calling got Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) 12 tds, 7 ints (3 in 1 game)... essentially a 3:1 td:int ratio Now I see why you are confused. First off, I have 3 different sites where he threw 12 TDs vs 8 INTs in loses. Not sure where you got your info. 12/8 = 1.5 So his TD/INT ration isn't 3:1, it's 1.5:1 Also, throwing 12 TDs in 10 loses hardly contributes a lot of points in what is now a passing league (and when he is behind and getting a chance to throw more), especially when he's throwing 8 INTs in those same 10 games to go with it. But like I said, you like his numbers so hopefully he'll end up starting for your favorite team, and you can go get his jersey and cheer him on.. Edited July 5, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) Now I see why you are confused. First off, I have 3 different sites where he threw 12 TDs vs 8 INTs in loses. Not sure where you got your info. 12/8 = 1.5 So his TD/INT ration isn't 3:1, it's 1.5:1 Also, throwing 12 TDs in 10 loses hardly contributes a lot of points in what is now a passing league (and when he is behind and getting a chance to throw more), especially when he's throwing 8 INTs in those same 10 games to go with it. But like I said, you like his numbers so hopefully he'll end up starting for your favorite team, and you can go get his jersey and cheer him on.. i was conceding the 2 crap games. so...looking at 80% (8 games) of those losses: 2426 yds= 303/game 12 tds; 5 int's (the 1 i missed was from week 7. will correct that in a moment) 2.2 ratio 12 td's is not staggering, but not abysmal either. my point was that it was that you could not pin those losses on him, but other factors had a heavier weight than you were accounting for. he indeed had to play from behind. when that occurs i expect to see higher yards and tds, with increases in sacks and picks as well. i was saying similar things about cutler's last year when he was on their 5th rb and had even worse defensive woes..... dcs know you are passing.... i think both did decent jobs of not turning it over more. edit: unfortunately, orton would improve my team. but i still wouldn't want him. Edited July 5, 2011 by Bier Meister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montster Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 So, have we decided whether Arizona is ready for the R. Williams/Hightower combo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 AZ is incapable, from a coaching and/or personnel standpoint, of fielding a good run game, so I'd avoid them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 Maybe my expectations for Hadnot and Faneca were too high? Arizona has been a pass heavy offense for years. They have never had to rely on the run. To say they are incapable from a coaching or personal standpoint is asinine. As evidenced by there draft history, they have continuously passed on strong RB's in the 1st round (they took Levi Brown in 2007 at 1.5 instead of Adrian Peterson )They tried to rectify that with Beanie the Weanie and I laughed. Luckily they have realized there gaff and drafted a kid who is gonna be a very good starter very quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 umm, I suggested that they're personnel dept might have issues... you say that's asinine, but then you say that they passed on AP, then you laughed that they took Beanie... aren't those poor personnel decisions? So, I'm not sure where the asinine part comes from if you agree that those were poor decisions. But now they've fixed their problems cuz you agree with the choice of RW? do they have the same coaching staff or front office that they had in 2007 or even 2 years ago? I'm sure there has been some house cleaning. And just to be clear, when I'm saying something is asinine, I'm not calling the poster that....I'm calling the statement that. And yes.....my agreement is critical for any teams success..I'm glad you finally get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron2112 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Bush isn't going anywhere. He only has 3 years after spending the first year on the Non Football Injury List (NFI) and have tendered him at the highest possible level. That's what Raider fans are hoping for, but from what I've heard, the new collective bargaining agreement is leaning towards an outcome where Bush would likely be credited with 4 years, and thus an unrestricted free agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron2112 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Orton's obviously a guy you're always looking to upgrade. If you have a great running game, good receivers, and an awesome defense, I think he could take you to the playoffs... but I wouldn't count on him winning a high stakes game in the postseason if it all fell on his shoulders. He's decent... I would take him over Jason Campbell as I think he's smarter(less propensity for dumbass interceptions) with the football, and makes quicker decisions, but his arm shortens the field and limits the offense some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 That's what Raider fans are hoping for, but from what I've heard, the new collective bargaining agreement is leaning towards an outcome where Bush would likely be credited with 4 years, and thus an unrestricted free agent. From what I understand, you cannot incure a year of service when placed on the Non Football Injury list. That would give him only 3 years. I'm not aware of it being a negotiating point for the players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron2112 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) From what I understand, you cannot incure a year of service when placed on the Non Football Injury list. That would give him only 3 years. I'm not aware of it being a negotiating point for the players. I can't say for sure what will happen, but from the Raider forum I frequent there are alotta guys that post reporter blogs and such, and everyone there seems to think the new CBA is trending toward setting a guy like Bush free. They talk about possibly signing a guy like Le'Ron McClain(who Hue Jackson would be familiar with from his Ravens days) to replace Bush's role, also see the drafting of Tawain Jones partially as insurance as well. Sure hope it doesn't happen. Edited July 5, 2011 by byron2112 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearBroncos Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Here's the compilation of your "decent" numbers: 10 games 211 completions in 379 attempts for a 55.7% comp % 2709 yds 12 TDs 8 INTs 15 rushes 93 yds Those kinds of numbers contribute directly to loses in the NFL. You can't rest those numbers solely at the feet of Orton, however. McDaniels made the QB, regardless who was taking the snaps, nearly impossible with never getting a run attack established. I think Orton did fairly well, considering the hand dealt. He also had his best receiver taken from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooty Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 you guys are still confusing good FANTASY Qbing with good NFL QBing Wins and losses. Orton is about as mehhh as it gets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) around the time of the trade this is a major step backwards for denver's offense. orton had forte. cutler carried the team when everyone knew they were passing. trust me, this is very bad. simms and orton are not the answer. chat during a den/pit game good game plan: take away den's run and make orton beat you. it ain't gonna happen. he is not that type of qb. Edited July 7, 2011 by Bier Meister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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