delusions of grandeur Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) None of this is for the league to decide. Period. Name me one other time in the history of the NFL where the league office hand picked what team a player would go to? If the coaches at Buf and Cin have no control over their players, why doesn't the league step in and tell the team to get new coaches? How would that be any different? If this is true, the league will have some serious explaining to do. Goodell did not have to allow him to be reinstated to the league... These guys are public figures when they become part of the NFL, hence why they have a personal conduct policy that can punish you for what you do off the field... If he did more than just "sway" Vick, then yes that's pushing it, but for them to want for him to go to a stable organization where he wouldn't be asked to be in the spotlight as a starter right away and tarnish their image before the public got past the whole debacle, then it was absolutely in the league's best interest to convince him to go where he can succeed and not be a league-wide distraction while it was fresh in peoples' minds. It may sound a little scummy, but the NFL is absolutely interested in maintaining a positive public image. Edited August 18, 2011 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBunz Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Uhhh......original posting of this story? Feb 2, 2010 Sounds like a bit of an agenda to me rehashing it now and making it look like the interview was yesterday. I'm surprised ESPN is getting rooked into reporting this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 The league controls their image. Of course they are going to steer Vick, the biggest story of the last five years arguably, into a situation where it won't blow up in their face again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Uhhh......original posting of this story? Feb 2, 2010 Sounds like a bit of an agenda to me rehashing it now and making it look like the interview was yesterday. I'm surprised ESPN is getting rooked into reporting this. Wow I didn't even bother to go that far and I guess ESPN didn't either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Next Generation Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 None of this is for the league to decide. Period. Name me one other time in the history of the NFL where the league office hand picked what team a player would go to? If the coaches at Buf and Cin have no control over their players, why doesn't the league step in and tell the team to get new coaches? How would that be any different? If this is true, the league will have some serious explaining to do. Vick was on indefinite suspension from the league. It seems like the league didn't necessarily say sign with Philly, rather they said if you choose BUF or CIN, you wouldn't be welcomed back because we would consider that suspect judgement and we don't want to deal with you in that situation. I'm sure there were other teams that would have fit the bill besides the Eagles (Pats, Packers, Colts, maybe...). Just that the Eagles were willing to take him on where some of the others probably weren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Oh give me a break. Yes I agree he needs to keep his mouth shut and just play football, but some of y'all are just waiting to jump on Vick for anything he says or does... What was so bad about what he said? Seems to me the point he's trying to make is that it wasn't just an isolated thing Vick was involved in, it's totally a cultural thing, which I can attest to, knowing people who've rescued a number pitbulls from fighting rings... So basically his point is that while most people have dogs, poor people FIGHT dogs for money... What's untrue about that, and why shouldn't he let people know it's a societal thing where he wasn't the only one? He did say "I know that it's wrong. But people act like it's some crazy thing they never heard of. They don't know." All this is is a case of a man trying to make people understand how he could do such heinous things, but he's already owned up to it before now and payed for it, so why not make people understand? It isn't like he had to do that, or anything, when he's already getting paid again (and honestly I think that's what really irks some of you more than the statements). And yes, Bronco Billy, just like the interview where they asked Eli if he compared himself to Tom Brady, and then only published his answer to make him sound conceited, this is a clear case of taking the guy out of context to gain ratings, because well, readers like you are jumping all over the opportunity to complain about it... So your position is that crime is okay as long as you have a tough upbringing? I'd also venture that most poor people abhor Vick for what he did for dogs, rather than torture them as you seem to think poor people do to amuse themselves. Vick is a scumbag. He has a full dosier of antisocial behavior issues. I don't think it is justice that he is such a piece of excrement and yet gets millions for playing football. IMO, justice would be a dog running onto the field and ripping Vick's achilles tendon out. I also wish that OJ Simpson would fall in front of a moving bus. It's not going to happen, so I'll just have to deal with it, but that doesn't mean I'll like it or refuse to have an opinion about it. Thanks for not answering my simple request, though, as usual. I guess you couldn't back up your contention that the reporter misrepresented what Vick said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 SI_PeterKing Peter King From @gregaiello: "The commissioner would never steer players to or away from particular teams and did not do so in this case.'' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) So your position is that crime is okay as long as you have a tough upbringing? I'd also venture that most poor people abhor Vick for what he did for dogs, rather than torture them as you seem to think poor people do to amuse themselves. Vick is a scumbag. He has a full dosier of antisocial behavior issues. I don't think it is justice that he is such a piece of excrement and yet gets millions for playing football. IMO, justice would be a dog running onto the field and ripping Vick's achilles tendon out. I also wish that OJ Simpson would fall in front of a moving bus. It's not going to happen, so I'll just have to deal with it, but that doesn't mean I'll like it or refuse to have an opinion about it. Thanks for not answering my simple request, though, as usual. I guess you couldn't back up your contention that the reporter misrepresented what Vick said. Damn. Wouldn't want to make a mistake around you. Guess you don't believe in people fixing themselves. That's fine, to each his own! Edited August 18, 2011 by Goopster24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Damn. Wouldn't want to make a mistake around you. Guess you don't believe in people fixing themselves. That's fine, to each his own! when BB see's an opening, he pounces Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Damn. Wouldn't want to make a mistake around you. Guess you don't believe in people fixing themselves. That's fine, to each his own! What in Vick's quotes do you perceive as his having fixed himself? He's back to taking no personal responsibility for his actions. You make a "mistake" - own it. And some "mistakes" transcend simply obliterating them from memory just because someone has been through the justice system and taken some punishment. That doesn't wipe the slate completely clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 So your position is that crime is okay as long as you have a tough upbringing? I'd also venture that most poor people abhor Vick for what he did for dogs, rather than torture them as you seem to think poor people do to amuse themselves. Now THAT is how you take someone's words out of context and twist them to make a point... Thanks Billy, I knew we could count on ya! I don't need to give an example. You're proving nicely how simple interview questions about a real cultural issue can be twisted into hate-speech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbahawk Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 ok maybe i am missing something here but why is it even news! I don't see anything wrong with any of his statments in the article. The guy made a mistake paid his debt lost everything he had got a second chance and made the most of it. we knew all this before! as faw as the league steering him tword a team...GOOD! it was in his and the leagues best interest to go somewhere stable. No one would have guessed he would be this good let alone be a starter. i just don't understand what the big deal is yes Vick killed dogs that is horrable but Stallworth killed people and no one cares! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 ok maybe i am missing something here but why is it even news! I don't see anything wrong with any of his statments in the article. The guy made a mistake paid his debt lost everything he had got a second chance and made the most of it. we knew all this before! as faw as the league steering him tword a team...GOOD! it was in his and the leagues best interest to go somewhere stable. No one would have guessed he would be this good let alone be a starter. i just don't understand what the big deal is yes Vick killed dogs that is horrable but Stallworth killed people and no one cares! It's mostly because Vick doesn't act like McNabb. Vick has kept the ghetto mannerisms and is making much more than any of us here. That breeds alot of hate. He was hated even before the dog fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) Now THAT is how you take someone's words out of context and twist them to make a point... Thanks Billy, I knew we could count on ya! I don't need to give an example. You're proving nicely how simple interview questions about a real cultural issue can be twisted into hate-speech. Thanks for not disappointing me. What's so bad about what he said? Really? And who exactly is the hater here when you put forth the proposition that torturing and killing dogs by fighting them is acceptable because it is a cultural thing and that it is normal for poor people to do? I expect more out of my fellow human beings regardless that they were raised in an impovershed condition. You on the other hand think that poor people are apparently inherently antisocial and can't help themselves, and thus are incapable of ethical and moral behavior. Edited August 18, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 What in Vick's quotes do you perceive as his having fixed himself? He's back to taking no personal responsibility for his actions. You make a "mistake" - own it. And some "mistakes" transcend simply obliterating them from memory just because someone has been through the justice system and taken some punishment. That doesn't wipe the slate completely clean. No one is asking for the slate to be completely clean. The guy is trying to make a difference. Obviously there are many, like you, who believe it's all a show and he doesn't give a sh*t but that comes with anyone in this situation; most convicted criminals experience an extremely tough time reacclimating to society. In this case, Vick has the media and his football talent to help aid the "recovery." The guy wants to be a part of the solution, not the problem. Again, whether he really means that, that's for people to decide. Clearly you have made up your mind. Like I said earlier, the guy's problem is trying to get EVERYONE back on his side. Just isn't going to happen. If the guy talks and shares his story honestly, he will be crucified. If he doesn't do anything at all, people will think he doesn't care and isn't remorseful. The guy can and will never win. Like said in the article, no matter what accomplishments he finishes his career with, his dogfighting charges will be the first thing remembered. And that's expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Now THAT is how you take someone's words out of context and twist them to make a point... Thanks Billy, I knew we could count on ya! I don't need to give an example. You're proving nicely how simple interview questions about a real cultural issue can be twisted into hate-speech. Amen bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) He never said it was acceptable. He is attempting to tell a story; his story. This is where the Mike Vick hate comes into play. There is a difference! Is it not a fact that dogfighting is viewed this way in many urban areas, many of which are populated more with blacks than white? Edited August 18, 2011 by Goopster24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Which quotes exactly show he isn't owning to his mistakes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Thanks for not disappointing me. What's so bad about what he said? Really? And who exactly is the hater here when you put forth the proposition that torturing and killing dogs by fighting them is acceptable because it is a cultural thing and that it is normal for poor people to do? I expect more out of my fellow human beings regardless that they were raised in an impovershed condition. You on the other hand think that poor people are apparently inherently antisocial and can't help themselves, and thus are incapable of ethical and moral behavior. Quite the jump in logic. Again, look at facts and look at the situation. He is telling the story of his upbringing. And because of the truth, people will always hate hearing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lawofmurphy Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 So much to unravel here. First of all, this is from the Sep 2011 GQ. The yahoo story originally linked links to an older story from Feb 02, 2010. So the new quotes are new. As for the Goodell steering Vick to the Eagles...if that did happen, I would agree it's bad form. We have no idea if it did. The commissioner's office is denying it. I have a feeling any "guidance" the commissioner gave Vick would be "as a friend" and not officially as the commissioner. And I don't say that to absolve Goodell. I think if Goodell personally thought Vick would better serve the NFL's interest by going to a "more stable" organization, all of that would be done in a wink-wink manner. Again, I don't think that's right, but I don't think there's going to be any way to prove it happened. As for whether Vick is TRULY sorry...who the hell knows. I suspect he regrets the situation he caused. I suspect he doesn't look at dogs trained to fight the same way he looks at dogs who are family pets. I suspect he doesn't see how killing dogs trained to fight is any worse than hunting deer. I suspect he feels like he was made an example of since basically no one has been punished nearly as severely as he was for that crime. Basically, there's so much gray-area in this whole thing...it's gonna take him writing a book to even approach understanding any of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) Thanks for not disappointing me. What's so bad about what he said? Really? And who exactly is the hater here when you put forth the proposition that torturing and killing dogs by fighting them is acceptable because it is a cultural thing and that it is normal for poor people to do? I expect more out of my fellow human beings regardless that they were raised in an impovershed condition. You on the other hand think that poor people are apparently inherently antisocial and can't help themselves, and thus are incapable of ethical and moral behavior. Dude, you are ridiculous when you're hell-bent on proving a point. Neither I, nor Vick even said that what he did was acceptable. I made sure to quote the "I know it was wrong" part, just to make that clear... But you're being absolutely being ignorant if you don't think that a culture in place can justify (in their minds) really twisted behavior. I mean, just look how Hitler was able to justify genocide to a struggling desperate country. That's not to excuse it, but to draw attention to something that is larger than just Vick... Is it self-serving to try to justify his actions that way, yes I'll concede that, but it doesn't mean that there's not an element to truth to it... No one is exucsing what Vick did, nor should they (and I personally hate the guy for what he did to the Falcons)but you simply want to crucify the guy for trying to maybe explain to everyone what really goes on, and a maybe even a little bit of truth about what he was thinking to be dumb enough to risk his future for it... He ain't your QB and they ain't your dogs, so let it go... Edited August 18, 2011 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Bronco Billy, are you black? Do you know a black person or call a black person a friend? Do you know anyone who is below the poverty line or was below the poverty line? Did you grow up in the inner city somewhere? Do you know someone who did? I find your comments and hatred towards Mike Vick incredibly insensitive. If you're expecting "more" of your fellow human being, than I should be able to expect the idea of forgiveness and redemption and the idea that a man can grow and become miles and miles better than he once was. This is the problem with the real "Mike Vick Experience." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Dude, you are ridiculous when you're hell-bent on proving a point. Neither I, nor Vick even said that what he did was acceptable. I made sure to quote the "I know it was wrong" part, just to make that clear... But you're being absolutely being ignorant if you don't think that a culture in place can justify (in their minds) really twisted behavior. I mean, just look how Hitler was able to justify genocide to a struggling desperate country. That's not to excuse it, but to draw attention to something that is larger than just Vick... Is it self-serving to try to justify his actions that way, yes I'll concede that, but it doesn't mean that there's not an element to truth to it... No one is exucsing what Vick did, nor should they (and I personally hate the guy for what he did to the Falcons)but you simply want to crucify the guy for trying to maybe explain to everyone what really goes on, and a maybe even a little bit of truth about what he was thinking to be dumb enough to risk his future for it... He ain't your QB and they ain't your dogs, so let it go... Well said sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearBroncos Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Thanks for not disappointing me. What's so bad about what he said? Really? And who exactly is the hater here when you put forth the proposition that torturing and killing dogs by fighting them is acceptable because it is a cultural thing and that it is normal for poor people to do? I expect more out of my fellow human beings regardless that they were raised in an impovershed condition. You on the other hand think that poor people are apparently inherently antisocial and can't help themselves, and thus are incapable of ethical and moral behavior. You have to admit, you actually provided a brilliant example of taking ones stance out of context. DoG never made any such claim as you mentioned but based upon how you translated his stance, you made him to appear that he's an advocate of crime... LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjpro11 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 the guy is just sick in the head and a piece of garbage human.. if the culture he grew up around thinks it's okay to kill and torture dogs, then they're all sick in the head too and quite honestly, are worthless humans who deserve put down themselves. you can't even call what they do animal-like behavior, doing so would be an insult to animals. animals don't even torture each other. when they kill or harm each other, they do so for survival. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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