Has anyone ever emailed Yahoo for a stat correction?

[gbpackersfan]

I realize this is worth only 1pt, but Ive been beat by that far too many times to let it pass.

 

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2011110610/2...s&tab=recap

 

If you watch the highlights in that game, the first one it shows is Desmond Bishop tipping a pass that leads to a pick 6. We start 1 idp in our league, and we credit them for "pass defended". Shouldnt Bishop be rewarded for 1pt for that play? And if you believe that qualifies as a "pass defended", how would you go about emailing yahoo to ask for a stat correction? Sorry if this is the wrong place for this post.

[keggerz]

I realize this is worth only 1pt, but Ive been beat by that far too many times to let it pass.

 

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2011110610/2...s&tab=recap

 

If you watch the highlights in that game, the first one it shows is Desmond Bishop tipping a pass that leads to a pick 6. We start 1 idp in our league, and we credit them for "pass defended". Shouldnt Bishop be rewarded for 1pt for that play? And if you believe that qualifies as a "pass defended", how would you go about emailing yahoo to ask for a stat correction? Sorry if this is the wrong place for this post.

Yahoo has nothing to do with the stats that you see points awarded for...they get a feed like all other providers....Elias handles all scoring changes for the NFL....they are usually issued by Thursday...I know that they are available to be implemented in MFL by 10ish AM on Thursdays...fwiw, I would be shocked if that is included in the scoring changes/updates...I don't remember ever seeing someone awarded a pass defended or having one taken away.

[PPIchamp]

I've done Yahoo leagues since 2007 and never seen them credit any forced fumbles until the next day.

[detlef]

I guess the big question is whether or not that counts as a "pass defended". I mean, I understand why it would be, but would that mean that, every time a D-lineman puts his mitt up and tips a pass, that counts as a "pass defended"? Was he the one covering the receiver on the play?

 

Not asking to be confrontational, but rather curious what the official definition is.

[Azazello1313]

I guess the big question is whether or not that counts as a "pass defended". I mean, I understand why it would be, but would that mean that, every time a D-lineman puts his mitt up and tips a pass, that counts as a "pass defended"? Was he the one covering the receiver on the play?

 

Not asking to be confrontational, but rather curious what the official definition is.

 

why shouldn't that count as a pass defended?

[gbpackersfan]

Yeah I was kinda confused about that as well. While he did tip the pass, it was intercepted. So maybe the INT overrules the "pass defended". I wasnt really sure about that.

[keggerz]

I guess the big question is whether or not that counts as a "pass defended". I mean, I understand why it would be, but would that mean that, every time a D-lineman puts his mitt up and tips a pass, that counts as a "pass defended"? Was he the one covering the receiver on the play?

 

Not asking to be confrontational, but rather curious what the official definition is.

Yes, when a D-lineman puts his mitt up and tips a pass it does count as a "pass defended"

 

I haven't seen all of these plays but I feel safe in assuming that these DTs weren't out in pass coverage

 

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...1180&P=8253

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...1180&P=4896

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...180&P=10319

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...1180&P=7900

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...180&P=10383

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...1180&P=9875

http://football19.myfantasyleague.com/2011...1180&P=8365

Edited November 7, 2011 by keggerz

[detlef]

why shouldn't that count as a pass defended?

Like I said, I was just curious about the ruling. I've never played IDP before this year, so I've never thought twice about what does, and doesn't fit the description.

[keggerz]

Like I said, I was just curious about the ruling. I've never played IDP before this year, so I've never thought twice about what does, and doesn't fit the description.

I have a contact (lead programer for NFL statistics) so I will send him an email and see if I can get an exact definition

[stevegrab]

Is this another one of those highliy subjective statistical categories? Like errors in baseball where the scorekeeper at the game does one thing (usually to benefit home team players) and then the official (Elias for NFL) sports stat company reviews it and makes frequent corrections?

 

According to this page on ESPN, the definiton is

Pass defended definition

 

PD Pass Defended

Any pass which a defender, through contact with the football, causes to be incomplete

 

 

Based on that an interception CANNOT have a pass defended stat as well, since it isn't incomplete.

[keggerz]

Is this another one of those highliy subjective statistical categories? Like errors in baseball where the scorekeeper at the game does one thing (usually to benefit home team players) and then the official (Elias for NFL) sports stat company reviews it and makes frequent corrections?

 

According to this page on ESPN, the definiton is

Pass defended definition

 

PD Pass Defended

Any pass which a defender, through contact with the football, causes to be incomplete

 

 

Based on that an interception CANNOT have a pass defended stat as well, since it isn't incomplete.

An INT does indeed get a pass defended and an INT is an incomplete pass on the QBs stat line.

[Azazello1313]

PD Pass Defended

Any pass which a defender, through contact with the football, causes to be incomplete

 

 

Based on that an interception CANNOT have a pass defended stat as well, since it isn't incomplete.

 

I think that is probably wrong. an intercepted pass is certainly not a completed pass. and if it's not completed, it's incomplete. it definitely counts as an 0/1 (incompletion) on the QB stat line.

[keggerz]

I think that is probably wrong. an intercepted pass is certainly not a completed pass. and if it's not completed, it's incomplete. it definitely counts as an 0/1 (incompletion) on the QB stat line.

correct

[gbpackersfan]

An INT does indeed get a pass defended and an INT is an incomplete pass on the QBs stat line.

 

Im thinking in this case, if the ball wouldve gone incomplete, than Bishop wouldve been credited with a "pass defended".

 

But since the tip caused it to be intercepted, it took that away. For example, if a ball is batted around 2-3 times by defensive players, and than intercepted, all of those defenders wouldnt have gotten credit for a "pass defended".

[gbpackersfan]

Yahoo has nothing to do with the stats that you see points awarded for...they get a feed like all other providers....Elias handles all scoring changes for the NFL....they are usually issued by Thursday...I know that they are available to be implemented in MFL by 10ish AM on Thursdays...fwiw, I would be shocked if that is included in the scoring changes/updates...I don't remember ever seeing someone awarded a pass defended or having one taken away.

 

Thanks for the info. Any idea of how I could email Elias and ask them about that play?

[stevegrab]

correct

 

Semantics I guess. An 0/1 stat line is 0 completions in 1 attempt. When a pass is interecepted I don't consider that to be incomplete, sure it isn't completed either, it is an intereception (one of 3 possible outcomes on a pass, complete, incomplete, intercepted).

 

I guess Elias Sports Buearu would be the ultimate source of info for a definition, but I couldn't find one.

[keggerz]

Semantics I guess. An 0/1 stat line is 0 completions in 1 attempt. When a pass is interecepted I don't consider that to be incomplete, sure it isn't completed either, it is an intereception (one of 3 possible outcomes on a pass, complete, incomplete, intercepted).

 

I guess Elias Sports Buearu would be the ultimate source of info for a definition, but I couldn't find one.

a pass is either complete or incomplete...and INT=incomplete

 

I am waiting to hear back from my contact at the NFL and will post whatever he can provide me

[keggerz]

Thanks for the info. Any idea of how I could email Elias and ask them about that play?

my guess is that it would fall on deaf ears but here is their contact info: http://www.macraesbluebook.com/search/comp...?company=742717

[CaptainHook]

The intercepting player gets credit for the "defended pass". They don't give out two of them, or split them in half, like they do for a sack.

 

If the pass had fallen incomplete, he would have been credited with the defended pass.

 

Let me know if you hear anything from Elias. They incorrectly credited a player with a solo tackle in Week 1. I watched it several times. They never corrected it either. It's still an inexact science.

[keggerz]

The intercepting player gets credit for the "defended pass". They don't give out two of them, or split them in half, like they do for a sack.

 

If the pass had fallen incomplete, he would have been credited with the defended pass.

 

Let me know if you hear anything from Elias. They incorrectly credited a player with a solo tackle in Week 1. I watched it several times. They never corrected it either. It's still an inexact science.

Sacks will always get corrected because they are an official NFL stat....tackles aren't official so they are much more suspect when it comes to corrections..also, fwiw, there have been corrections that have given a pass defended to a player this year.

 

EDIT: I just quickly went thru the stat changes for all of 2010 and of the changes that didn't have anything to do with a sack, forced fumble or iNT, there were only about 5-6 corrections on solo tackles, a few more on assists and a few on special team tackles...about 6-7 pass defended correct too.

Edited November 8, 2011 by keggerz

[mitpdub]

I realize this is worth only 1pt, but Ive been beat by that far too many times to let it pass.

 

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2011110610/2...s&tab=recap

 

If you watch the highlights in that game, the first one it shows is Desmond Bishop tipping a pass that leads to a pick 6. We start 1 idp in our league, and we credit them for "pass defended". Shouldnt Bishop be rewarded for 1pt for that play? And if you believe that qualifies as a "pass defended", how would you go about emailing yahoo to ask for a stat correction? Sorry if this is the wrong place for this post.

 

 

Sorry, but I dont see that as a pass defended. It's an interception because his teammate ended up with the ball. If the ball after he tipped it fell to the ground incomplete then it could be a pass defended.

 

With IDP I see other stats not really make it, like when a db shoves a receiver out of bounds after a reception, it won't always count as a tackle made.

[flemingd]

Like I said, I was just curious about the ruling. I've never played IDP before this year, so I've never thought twice about what does, and doesn't fit the description.

Best I could find

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pass_defended

In American football a pass deflected, also known as a pass defended, a pass defensed, a pass knock down, or a pass break up, is an incomplete pass that is caused by a defensive player. This is done by slapping or blocking the ball, and is an important statistic for determining a defensive back's effectiveness.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2128923

PD Pass Defended

Any pass which a defender, through contact with the football, causes to be incomplete

[Kris N]

the INT takes away the pass defended. had that pass fallen incomplete, desmond would have been credited with the PD. and d linemen dont get credit for PD because they arent in coverage with the receivers

[flemingd]

d linemen dont get credit for PD because they arent in coverage with the receivers

Are you talking about a rule specific to your league? Because DL most certainly do get credit for PD. Why wouldn't they, when they are, well, defending a pass attempt?

 

http://www.nfl.com/player/vincewilfork/2505916/profile

Jared Allen

Lamar Houston

Many Others

[keggerz]

This is the response that I got from my source, and it addresses the exact issue in question (highlighted in BLUE)

 

EDIT: fwiw this is what I asked in my email:

Can you tell me what the definition or criteria that official scorers use to designate a "pass defended".

 

This is the definition given to the clubs in the League’s PR Manual, I don’t know how many stat crews would have seen it.

 

PASSES DEFENSED — If a pass falls incomplete because of the defensive efforts of one player, that player should be credited with a pass defensed. This may come about in two principal ways. (1) A defensive player who makes contact with the football, thus preventing the intended receiver from making the catch, should be credited with a pass defensed. (2) A defensive player who tackles the intended receiver simultaneously with the arrival of the football, thus preventing the reception, should also be credited with a pass defensed.

 

A defensive player who neither touches the football nor tackles the receiver simultaneously with the arrival of the football ordinarily should not be credited with a pass defensed. No pass defensed credit should be given on plays on which the ball is overthrown or thrown out-of-bounds.

 

NOTE: In rare instances, it may be possible for two defensive players to play such equal roles in the defensing of a forward pass that it is not possible to determine which player was more responsible. In such a rare instance, credit both players with a pass defensed.

 

NOTE: The defensive team’s total of passes defensed must not exceed the total number of incomplete passes by the offensive team unless the rare circumstance cited in the above paragraph has occurred during the course of the game. Even then, in most instances, the defensive team’s total of passes defensed will not equal the total number of incomplete passes by the offensive team.

 

PLEASE NOTE: When a first defensive player defends against a pass in such a manner that he normally would be credited with a pass defensed and a second defensive player intercepts the pass, the first defensive player still should be credited with a pass defensed while the second player is credited with an interception and a pass defensed. The theory of this guideline is that the first defensive player should not be penalized because of the ensuing interception when, in fact, the first defensive player’s action may have played a major role in making the interception possible.

Edited November 8, 2011 by keggerz