a great read about steak

[muck]

this is a good book, very enjoyable ... will cause you to think about what makes good steak good ... and may change what you expect from steak when its in your mouth

 

I know I'm starting to think differently about steak after having read it.

 

Two thumbs up!

 

*********************************

 

As an aside, I've spent the better part of the last two years reading about raising beef cattle --- everything from soils and grass management to genetics, etc. it looks like I'm going to be getting 2-4 cows this spring in hopes of starting a small herd. If any of you want to buy some beef that you know where it came from, I'm possibly going to be selling a few interests in the herd (which will result in the other herd owners getting deliveries of some (hopefully!) awesome beef for their freezers. The most important thing for me in this herd will be its flavor, tenderness, juciness ... in other words umami ...

Edited December 16, 2011 by muck

[Scooby's Hubby]

All I gotta say is make sure you are wearing gloves while you are playing doctor with cows all day - really long gloves.

[SEC=UGA]

this is a good book, very enjoyable ... will cause you to think about what makes good steak good ... and may change what you expect from steak when its in your mouth

 

I know I'm starting to think differently about steak after having read it.

 

Two thumbs up!

 

*********************************

 

As an aside, I've spent the better part of the last two years reading about raising beef cattle --- everything from soils and grass management to genetics, etc. it looks like I'm going to be getting 2-4 cows this spring in hopes of starting a small herd. If any of you want to buy some beef that you know where it came from, I'm possibly going to be selling a few interests in the herd (which will result in the other herd owners getting deliveries of some (hopefully!) awesome beef for their freezers. The most important thing for me in this herd will be its flavor, tenderness, juciness ... in other words umami ...

 

What you growing? Beef Master, Angus, Limousin, Santa Gertrudis?

 

My neighbor has a fairly large herd of Beffmaster, they're cute, friendly and very tasty.

[muck]

Probably Aubrac. While they're an unconventional breed, I think they are perfectly suited for my situation, and are quite tasty!

 

I may work on a composite that would maybe include Galloway, Braunveih and Bison, in with the Aubrac. Galloway and Bison are extraordinarily hardy animals with thick woolly coats ... which they shed in the late spring and grow back in the fall --- and are also known for producing world-class beef.

 

I want to avoid all Bos indicus cattle (which would primarily include Brahma, and animals that have Brahma influence). Indicus cattle are known for, generally, being quite a bit tougher to chew, less flavorful and less juicy --- basically, less palatable than non-indicus cattle.

[SEC=UGA]

Probably Aubrac. While they're an unconventional breed, I think they are perfectly suited for my situation, and are quite tasty!

 

I may work on a composite that would maybe include Galloway, Braunveih and Bison, in with the Aubrac. Galloway and Bison are extraordinarily hardy animals with thick woolly coats ... which they shed in the late spring and grow back in the fall --- and are also known for producing world-class beef.

 

I want to avoid all Bos indicus cattle (which would primarily include Brahma, and animals that have Brahma influence). Indicus cattle are known for, generally, being quite a bit tougher to chew, less flavorful and less juicy --- basically, less palatable than non-indicus cattle.

 

Bovine snob.

 

I suppose Jersey and Guernsey dairy cattle aren't good enough for ya either...

 

But, seriously, sounds like you've really thought this through. It sounds like you're gonna do very small lots of cattle. You gonna kill 'em kosher or do the sledgehammer to the head thingy?

 

Killing 'em kosher/halal really does make a difference in the taste of the meat, it is amazing.

 

Reminds me of this time I was on a Dormus (a mini-bus with about 26 people on it) in Turkey, hungover, kids who had the flu crawling all over me, it was awful... Anywho, we were riding through the market area on the south side of Adana, we stop to let some filthy people off and my buddy says, "look" and points out the window to my right... Where the butcher has just grabbed hold of the snout of a sheep, lifts it's head up and slices right across the jugular veins. The sheep drops to it's knees, lists over to the left and starts shaking... Rivers of blood are running down the sidewalk and pooling in the gutter, he grabs another little yew... and the Dormus pulls away...

[muck]

Bovine snob.

 

I suppose Jersey and Guernsey dairy cattle aren't good enough for ya either...

 

But, seriously, sounds like you've really thought this through. It sounds like you're gonna do very small lots of cattle. You gonna kill 'em kosher or do the sledgehammer to the head thingy?

 

Killing 'em kosher/halal really does make a difference in the taste of the meat, it is amazing.

 

Reminds me of this time I was on a Dormus (a mini-bus with about 26 people on it) in Turkey, hungover, kids who had the flu crawling all over me, it was awful... Anywho, we were riding through the market area on the south side of Adana, we stop to let some filthy people off and my buddy says, "look" and points out the window to my right... Where the butcher has just grabbed hold of the snout of a sheep, lifts it's head up and slices right across the jugular veins. The sheep drops to it's knees, lists over to the left and starts shaking... Rivers of blood are running down the sidewalk and pooling in the gutter, he grabs another little yew... and the Dormus pulls away...

 

Bovine snob?

 

People spend considerable sums trying to get the right wine, going to tastings, reading magazines, etc. about varietals and fermentation methods ... and have ZERO idea about the meat they are pairing with their wine.

 

So, I guess the world needs a few bovine snobs to pair with the wine snobs! HA!

 

Anyhow, I understand that Jersey cattle are quite good eating ... however, very very slow growing and do not have much meat on the carcass (therefore, are (generally) a bad deal for the herd owner, unless they're running a non-profit herd).

 

There are four things that go into determining the palatability of the meat:

 

* Genetics (fyi, Angus really aren't the end-all, be-all of bovine carcasses)

* Management (i.e., what do they eat and when)

* Slaughter (if a cow has a surge of adrenaline as they're being killed, the meat will be tougher and, often less flavorful) ... also they way a carcass is hung can make a difference, as can the length of time its aged, and whether its wet-aged or dry-aged

* Preparation

 

So, if you get the first three right, and then screw up in the kitchen or on the grill, it wouldn't matter if you'd started with shoe leather.

[The Holy Roller]

Sounds good! I ordered the steak book (and two others that looked interesting). What are you going to feed your herd? How will you finish your beeves before slaughter and how big (weight) will your animals be when you slaughter them? I ask because I'm in the business and am always curious about others expectations.

[bpwallace49]

The massive elk steak I had for dinner tonight was delicious.

 

Unfortunately the elk did not provide a gastro-historical context to me prior to being shot to death.

[muck]

Sounds good! I ordered the steak book (and two others that looked interesting). What are you going to feed your herd? How will you finish your beeves before slaughter and how big (weight) will your animals be when you slaughter them? I ask because I'm in the business and am always curious about others expectations.

 

One of the things that has come to my attention in all my reading is that good flavor is a function of age --- the older the cow, the better the "beefy flavor". However, if the cow is too old, it can get tough. However, one way to compensate for the toughness is to run a cow leaner in the winter, reducing his/her body condition, and then pop the condition on the huge amounts of grass that grow in the spring and very early summer --- a fast growing animal is a tender animal. Further, procesing in a no/low stress environment is key. There is some who believe that hanging a carcass by the hips (not the feet) allow the muscles to stretch more fully, thereby freeing up the enzymes that improve tenderness. And, lastly, dry-aging is important, but don't take it too far as you don't want mold to develop.

 

Now, as it regards feeding ... in all the blind taste-tests stuff I've been able to see ... plus the personal anecdotal evidence I have experienced ... tell me that grain-finished beef do not have as much "beefy flavor" as grass-finished. Being able to finish on grass is a function of management and stocking rates. Cattle thrived for centuries without feedlots, and they can today --- however --- not all breeds are well suited to finish on grass (and even some animals in some breeds are not well suited for grass finishing).

 

Before anyone thinks that "grass finished beef" is poor, it means you've had poor grass finished beef ... not that it can't be done.

 

BPW --- I doubt your Elk was grain finished, and as you said, "it was delicious".

 

************************

 

So, bottom line ... the objective is to harvest grass-finished beef between 18-24 months after birth (I'm expecting Aubrac and Aubrac-cross steers to be in the 1200-1400lb range at that age)... and to manage the herd on a very (VERY!) low-input model. High input models (which are generally focused on the color of the hide at the expense of all else) generally only enrich the vets, chemical sales people, the grain sales people, the feedlots and the sale barn ... and not the rancher who raises the cows.

 

And yes, I realize that this is not how most people do it. I also realize that many/most people in cattle get their butts handed to them (eventually), because (imo) they have too many fixed costs in their operation (medicine, grain, machinery, hay, etc.) to be able to sustain themselves through tough times. Besides, as a newer guy to raising cattle, the fewer things I need to worry about, the more likely it is that I'm not going to screw something up --- so, all I have to worry about is fencing, water, pasture rotation, and maybe a bit of irrigation.

 

...essentially, a cow converts sunshine into protein with the soil and grass as a medium through which it makes the conversion...so, healthy soil and grasses equal a calm, healthy, growing cow...who will be tasty on the table...

 

{sorry for rambing a bit}

 

What other books did you get? How do you run your operation?

Edited December 22, 2011 by muck

[detlef]

Nice to see you thinking this through all the way. There's a ton of people raising beef around here but few bother to find breeds that make sense with our climate. A total waste.

 

Let me know when you've got some nice steaks, perhaps we can figure out a trade of sorts.

[muck]

Nice to see you thinking this through all the way. There's a ton of people raising beef around here but few bother to find breeds that make sense with our climate. A total waste.

 

Let me know when you've got some nice steaks, perhaps we can figure out a trade of sorts.

 

That's a flattering comment. Thank you!

 

In a perfect world, I'm looking for a handful of clients to whom I can supply a seasonal beef product.

 

In most cases, this would be a family that would look to take delivery of a 1/4, 1/2 or whole beef (or in your case, multiple whole beeves) once a year.

 

I am working with two partners in Aubracs (and Aubrac crosses), so if you (or anyone else) would need/want more than I could personally provide, they would be in a position to augment what I'm (planning on) doing.

 

***************************

 

One of the things I want to do is to have "beef tastings" where identical cuts from different breeds are prepared identically ... or ... identical cuts from the same breed, but finished differently ... or ... identical cuts from the same breed who are finished identically, but are of a different age ... are prepared and sampled, and the attendees can vote/score their favorites ... and then, based on what they determined was their favorite, we would deliver that specific type of animal to them for their coming season.

 

Much like being a partial owner in a vinyard would allow (for example) you to take three cases of wine of a pressing of your chosing ... and you may elect one year to take a case of Merlot and two cases of Cabernet ... but ... the next year, you may take a case of Reisling, a case of Pinot Noir and a case of Cabernet ...

 

...but to be able to give that sort of customization to the consumer (herd owner?) will take time...

[The Holy Roller]

One of the things that has come to my attention in all my reading is that good flavor is a function of age --- the older the cow, the better the "beefy flavor". However, if the cow is too old, it can get tough. However, one way to compensate for the toughness is to run a cow leaner in the winter, reducing his/her body condition, and then pop the condition on the huge amounts of grass that grow in the spring and very early summer --- a fast growing animal is a tender animal. Further, procesing in a no/low stress environment is key. There is some who believe that hanging a carcass by the hips (not the feet) allow the muscles to stretch more fully, thereby freeing up the enzymes that improve tenderness. And, lastly, dry-aging is important, but don't take it too far as you don't want mold to develop.

 

Now, as it regards feeding ... in all the blind taste-tests stuff I've been able to see ... plus the personal anecdotal evidence I have experienced ... tell me that grain-finished beef do not have as much "beefy flavor" as grass-finished. Being able to finish on grass is a function of management and stocking rates. Cattle thrived for centuries without feedlots, and they can today --- however --- not all breeds are well suited to finish on grass (and even some animals in some breeds are not well suited for grass finishing).

 

Before anyone thinks that "grass finished beef" is poor, it means you've had poor grass finished beef ... not that it can't be done.

 

BPW --- I doubt your Elk was grain finished, and as you said, "it was delicious".

 

************************

 

So, bottom line ... the objective is to harvest grass-finished beef between 18-24 months after birth (I'm expecting Aubrac and Aubrac-cross steers to be in the 1200-1400lb range at that age)... and to manage the herd on a very (VERY!) low-input model. High input models (which are generally focused on the color of the hide at the expense of all else) generally only enrich the vets, chemical sales people, the grain sales people, the feedlots and the sale barn ... and not the rancher who raises the cows.

 

And yes, I realize that this is not how most people do it. I also realize that many/most people in cattle get their butts handed to them (eventually), because (imo) they have too many fixed costs in their operation (medicine, grain, machinery, hay, etc.) to be able to sustain themselves through tough times. Besides, as a newer guy to raising cattle, the fewer things I need to worry about, the more likely it is that I'm not going to screw something up --- so, all I have to worry about is fencing, water, pasture rotation, and maybe a bit of irrigation.

 

...essentially, a cow converts sunshine into protein with the soil and grass as a medium through which it makes the conversion...so, healthy soil and grasses equal a calm, healthy, growing cow...who will be tasty on the table...

 

{sorry for rambing a bit}

 

What other books did you get? How do you run your operation?

 

I don't mind the rambling a bit! Unlike some, I enjoy a det-like explanation of why folks do what they do and especially when they do so with passion.

 

I usually buy 500 lb feeder calves in early spring (usually late March) from a friend who raises pure-bred black Angus. We then pasture them on a salad bar buffet of grasses here on our farm. By the end of November they are 900-1000 pounds and ready for processing. I'm not wanting to overwinter any thing (yet) because I don't have the time. One day I will. I really believe in the Joel Salatin model and am a subscriber to most everything I read in The Stockman GrassFarmer by Allan Nation. I believe the quality of all our food is directly related to the health of the soil in/on which the food is produced. And your observation about the conversion of solar energy into food is spot on. I also believe there is a spiritual side to producing food that is completely lost in the food distribution system in the U.S. today. There is very little connection between the producer and the consumer and that lack of understanding/communication between the food eaters and the food providers has led us to a fragile and dangerous situation. I could go on for awhile.

 

AND AS I SPEAK...the UPS truck came down the driveway and brought me...Steak, and my other books, Raising Beef Cattle by Heather Thomas and Grass-Fed Cattle by Julius Ruechel.

 

Good luck with your endeavors!

 

Dave (The Holy Roller) Busby

[muck]

OHHHH!!!! BOY!

 

We have some stuff in common.

 

The Stockman Grass Farmer = da bomb!

 

I've been to Greg Judy's ranch (and correspond with him from time to time). Very nice guy (and his cows taste excellent).

 

MIG is very intuitive. Stocking rates are important. Forage efficiency. Early fertility. Genetic palatability. Soil fertility. Grasses, legumes, etc.

 

Over the past three years, I've researched Senepol, Aubrac, Galloway, Gaur, Pinzgauer, Romagnola, Bison, and a bajillion other breeds (including Angus and LowLine, which is a straing of pure Angus genetics developed in Australia in the mid-1900s that are all-Angus, just smaller animals) ... my focus is on finding animals with a genetic predisposition towards tasty beef produced on a "salad bar buffet" (Salatin) ... early maturity, genetic predisposition against disease, foraging focused, easy temperments (calm cattle = tasty cattle), longevity, etc. I've read the MARC research. I've had some research translated from French to English.

 

My summary is that most people are "doing it wrong".

 

I've found some likeminded gentlemen (one of whom is credited in "STEAK" as having inspired/helped the author) who have said they're going to "stake me" in my first foray into cattle. We're set to move a bit further into "the sticks" in January, so, it looks like I'm going to be partnering with them in starting a small herd of Aubracs and Aubrac crosses in south KC within the next couple of months. Aubracs are (per my research) far superior to most Angus lines in terms of forage efficiency, overall palatability, etc.

 

Something to think about about your Angus calves ... if you have animals that thrive in feedlot conditions, and breeding decisions are made with feedlot metrix in mind, do you think you'll end up with animals that are predisposed to excel on grass only? Again, I have zero idea about how your friend runs his Angus ... but, if he turns most of his into the feedlot, and he makes his breeding decisions based on the feedlot, then your animals aren't hard-wired to excel at the things you want them to excel at...

 

Recent reads that you may also enjoy:

Time to Change --- Chip Hines

Thoughts and Advice from an Old Cattleman --- Dr. Gordon Hazard {this one will really change how you think about when you sell and when you buy your cows; he's never lost money in any year in more than 60yrs in the cattle business; read the book to figure out why}

 

*********************

 

PS -- To anyone reading all this nonsense ... did you know that "Certified Angus Beef" may contain 0% Angus genetics? The only thing required for an animal to be labelled "Certified Angus" is a hide that is at least 51% Black ... which means that that burger you just bought at Hardees may be 100% Holstein (from New Zealand). If you focus on the color of the hide when picking the beef you'll eat, you're REALLY missing out!

 

PPS -- There is NOT a perfect correlation between palatability and marbling. Anyone who thinks as much has spent too much time listening to things put out by the Angus marketing associations! It is not uncommon for animals with nice marbling taste like so much warmed over water...generally, these are animals raised in feedlots, processed while not gaining weight, or any of a number of other factors...

Edited December 26, 2011 by muck

[Jimmy Neutron]

Awesome. You guys get this all down to a science. I hope to land on some acerage in the next move or two and am interested in raising a few beef cattle. I have a hs friend who ranches organic, grass fed fancy cows outside Billings, MT. I bought from her once when I was in the neighborhood and it was fantastic.

 

I think you are spot on Dave, regarding the "spiritual" connection to land and food. This is now primarily why I hunt. There is little thrill in the kill for me now days, but a tremendous satisfaction in being at one with nature and knowing where my food comes from. I garden for the same reason.

 

I have ceased eating almost any processed food, opting for fresh and as local as I can get. I can't begin to say how much better I feel.

 

Best of luck to you guys and your herds. Be sure to post updates!

[muck]

It looks like the first of the cows may arrive around the first of April.

 

Woo Hoo!

[SEC=UGA]

It looks like the first of the cows may arrive around the first of April.

 

Woo Hoo!

 

Are they walking to your house?

[bpwallace49]

This thread is making me hungry

[muck]

Are they walking to your house?

 

Yes. From Wyoming, they're walking to my house. If they hustle, they should be here before tax day.

[SEC=UGA]

Yes. From Wyoming, they're walking to my house. If they hustle, they should be here before tax day.

 

Sweet.

[Chief Dick]

Yes. From Wyoming, they're walking to my house. If they hustle, they should be here before tax day.

 

How does that extra exercise impact the tenderness of the meat? Not to mention the different types of grasses they'll eat on the way.

[muck]

How does that extra exercise impact the tenderness of the meat? Not to mention the different types of grasses they'll eat on the way.

 

I think of it as a good, long, extended stretch.

 

The additional grasses will add a variety of tones and hints to the flavor.

 

*************************

 

In all seriousness, my partner will bring them to me on his way to visit a friend of his in FL who is sick w/ cancer to help him with his cattle. He's taking a load of animals to me, driving an empty trailer to FL, and then driving a full trailer back to WY.