Furd Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Because.......? You mean the same team that contends every year? Because, as far as I am aware, no 2-14 team has rebounded to seriously contend for the Super Bowl the following year. And I don't think that an aging QB recovering from an injury is going to change that, no matter how good he was 2 years prior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolandb Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 What if they cut Manning and keep Caldwell. Who would have ever seen that one coming? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Because, as far as I am aware, no 2-14 team has rebounded to seriously contend for the Super Bowl the following year. Ignoring the "it won't happen because it hasn't yet" thing, I suggest you check out the Colts in 98 and then in 99. Things like that happen and could easily happen again and for exactly the same reason, ie the same person. And I don't think that an aging QB recovering from an injury is going to change that, no matter how good he was 2 years prior. You again seem to forget who we're talking about and all the other specifics of the situation. There's no reason to believe they won't contend in 2012 if he's healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Ignoring the "it won't happen because it hasn't yet" thing, I suggest you check out the Colts in 98 and then in 99. Things like that happen and could easily happen again and for exactly the same reason, ie the same person. You again seem to forget who we're talking about and all the other specifics of the situation. There's no reason to believe they won't contend in 2012 if he's healthy. I'm not forgetting about anything. You're pointing to a historic event - the greatest turnaround in NFL history (the Colts were 3-13 BTW, not 2-14) - after an infusion of great young talent by the Colts. Manning was a young man back then. He had Marvin Harrison and Edgerrin James. Manning will not be as good as he was in 1999. Replace James ( a stud that year) with Addai or Bown. Replace an in his prime Harrison with a past his prime Reggie Wayne or an average Pierre Garcon. Throw in a crummy defense. I think that you are delusional if you think that the Colts can contend for the Super Bowl next year even if Manning returns. There no way that I would pay that kind of money with him on the downside of his career. Edited January 5, 2012 by Furd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyGal2011 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 You again seem to forget who we're talking about and all the other specifics of the situation. There's no reason to believe they won't contend in 2012 if he's healthy. AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturphy Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Does the firing of the Polians provide any insight? Were they going to fight to keep Manning or not release him to avoid fan backlash? Or were they more inclined to want to release him and Isray is against that? Or just a general changing of the guard, and no real impact on the Manning decision? Or did Polian just screw up this contract so badly that no one had a plan at all? Did they just take Manning and his agent at their word and not perform due diligence? This is what I wonder about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Fan Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Also, for those concerned about the dollars going to Luck, remember that the new CBL has a rookie cap, so his contract/bonus will be SUBSTANTIALLY lower than any first pick in years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackass Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Also, for those concerned about the dollars going to Luck, remember that the new CBL has a rookie cap, so his contract/bonus will be SUBSTANTIALLY lower than any first pick in years. If by 'years' you mean last year, then yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 That's completely ridiculous. The city/team owes him EVERYTHING. No they don't. They paid him quite well for everything he did. The Colts did well having Manning, but Manning also did well by the Colts. He deserves and deserved nothing more than the paycheck he got. I feel that way about all professional athletes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBoog Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 ThIs situation is exactly the reason why "injuries" ARE an excuse. Or should the Colts have easily won the division anyway? It will be weird and sad to see PM in a different uniform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 ThIs situation is exactly the reason why "injuries" ARE an excuse. Or should the Colts have easily won the division anyway? It will be weird and sad to see PM in a different uniform. I think he'll look pretty slick with a dolphin on his helmet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditkaless Wonders Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Bold move, no doubt. I'm sure there would be manifest caterwauling from the media about the lack of loyalty from IND and the disrespect shown, but the NFL is first and foremost a business, and this would be a good business decision. Manning has made enough money in IND to buy and furnish a small country, so the disrespect angle is complete hogwash, but we'll hear it no doubt. Manning gets to try to win one more ring as a hired gun, and IND can rebuild around a hopeful up-and-coming future star QB. Win-win. A healthy Manning in Denver, a Manning approaching his former self, well that would be a team instantly competing for a Superbowl. They have a defense, a running game of sorts, and their recievers would show quite well with Manning as the trigger man. Hell make the man your Q.B. Offensive coordinator, and official cheerleader inspector. Give him whatever he wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isleseeya Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 we are talking about Peyton Freking Manning If he is healthy , you Have to keep him imho No reason to believe he cant put up significant Peyton like numbers next year if he is healthy I will take the very proven over a QB coming from college who may not be anywhere near as good as advertised Anyone remember Ryan Leaf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I'm not forgetting about anything. You're pointing to a historic event - the greatest turnaround in NFL history (the Colts were 3-13 BTW, not 2-14) I figured you'd be a nitpicky dbag about that, which is why I said things like that happen. The point is the same. A really bad team can turn around the next year and contend. And again, if you actually examine the facts and unique specifics of the situation, it's extremely obvious that it could very easily happen w/this one. Very easily. Manning will not be as good as he was in 1999. No, he'll probably be better. He really wasn't all that amazing in 99. Replace James ( a stud that year) with Addai or Bown. Replace an in his prime Harrison with a past his prime Reggie Wayne or an average Pierre Garcon. Throw in a crummy defense...and you have a team which still made the playoffs year after year. I think that you are delusional if you think that the Colts can contend for the Super Bowl next year even if Manning returns. There no way that I would pay that kind of money with him on the downside of his career. Short of some dramatic personnel changes (possible), I KNOW you are delusional if you think that the Colts CAN'T contend with a healthy Manning, given they've done it so many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 A healthy Manning in Denver, a Manning approaching his former self, well that would be a team instantly competing for a Superbowl. Replace Denver with any team and the answer is the same. If he can make this POS team perennial contenders, he could do it anywhere else. Again assuming he's healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Short of some dramatic personnel changes (possible), I KNOW you are delusional if you think that the Colts CAN'T contend with a healthy Manning, given they've done it so many times. Have they done it with a 36 year old Manning after he missed a year because of an injury that required 3 surgeries in 19 months? Sorry, but your precious Peyton is on the decline. His QB ratings have dropped each year since 2004 but one, as have his yards per attempt. Many of the great QBs hit a wall at 35-36 even when they are "healthy." So its a virtual certainty that his numbers drop. The question is how much. And getting back to the original point, do you really want to pay that kind of money for a guy past his prime whose realistic window to compete is pretty small? You're living in the past. A professional sports team doesn't have that luxury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Manning 2010 at the advanced age of 34: 4700 yds, 33/17 91.9 rating Yeah he's so past his prime; he's done. Are you fishing or just clueless? One more time: remember who we're talking about. The cap and his health are the only issues. Both big ones for sure. But acting like if healthy he is likely to miss a beat or the Colts aren't playoff contenders is pretty ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) I think the writing is on the wall. Miami, Washington or Jets here I come. Edited January 5, 2012 by Seahawk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papajohn Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 If he plays, I think you probably can. Remember who we're talking about and I'm not trying to just "gush" about him, but he is very much the Ironman type, plus he rarely gets hit, plus this is his neck, not his knee or shoulder. His age is IMO a modest factor at most again because of who we are talking about. If his neck is good enough to play, there's no reason to think he won't be at or very near the same levels Thank God it is only his neck, and not something important like his knees or shoulders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caddyman Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 we are talking about Peyton Freking Manning If he is healthy , you Have to keep him imho No reason to believe he cant put up significant Peyton like numbers next year if he is healthy I will take the very proven over a QB coming from college who may not be anywhere near as good as advertised Anyone remember Ryan Leaf I have a bad feeling about Luck. I think he has been the annointed one for just a little too long. It's just a hunch, but I think that any Colts fan that thinks that he will be Manning reincarnated is going to be in for a let down. Something about his demeanor on the field that makes me think he may struggle. He tries too hard to be the leader everyone wants him to be. Frankly it looks fake. I think that act will get old fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 I have a bad feeling about Luck. I think he has been the annointed one for just a little too long. It's just a hunch, but I think that any Colts fan that thinks that he will be Manning reincarnated is going to be in for a let down. Something about his demeanor on the field that makes me think he may struggle. He tries too hard to be the leader everyone wants him to be. Frankly it looks fake. I think that act will get old fast. He's produced at a high level for two years. He's not a one year wonder like Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, or David Carr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caddyman Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 He's produced at a high level for two years. He's not a one year wonder like Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, or David Carr. Just a feeling, that's all. And i am not saying total bust either like Leaf or Akili Smiff. Just saying that I don't believe he ends ups as Manning Part II. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Manning 2010 at the advanced age of 34: 4700 yds, 33/17 91.9 rating Yeah he's so past his prime; he's done. Are you fishing or just clueless? One more time: remember who we're talking about. The cap and his health are the only issues. Both big ones for sure. But acting like if healthy he is likely to miss a beat or the Colts aren't playoff contenders is pretty ridiculous. I'm not fishing. You're just pretty dumb and/or your love for Manning blinds you to the truth. Of course he is going to "miss a beat." Older doesn't mean better at this point in his career. He's declining. Its inevitable, even when it is "he that we are talking about." Surely, even the slowest of the slow must acknowledge this. And your reading comprehension is poor, which is not surprising. I never said that he is "done." I said the he cannot carry a sh*tty team like the Colts to a Super Bowl. Given that the Denver f'n Broncos are in the playoff, I wouldn't say that the Colts would not be "playoff contenders." But in 2010, with a younger and healthier Manning, the Colts were one and done. Why would you expect more than that in 2012? The Colts were the worst team in football this year. A Manning in his prime couldn't make that team a Superbowl contender without help. In any event, paying Manning some money short term to play for a Superbowl contender makes sense. Paying Manning $28M or whatever to play for a bad team does not. At least not to anyone but you, apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorttynaz Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 That's the problem. I don't see the Colts having any idea if Manning is healthy enough to play by March 8. That's 64 days away. And I don't think the Colts should risk $28 million and the future of their cap. They already took a bath on Manning this year due to their sheer stupidity of not having Manning take a physical before they signed this contract. THIS is why the Polians were fired.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The cap and his health are the only issues. Both big ones for sure. But acting like if healthy he is likely to miss a beat or the Colts aren't playoff contenders is pretty ridiculous. Ridiculous? Really? Age can catch up with players very quickly. The difference between a 34 yr old QB and the same guy at 36 yrs old can be enormous. Manning's drop down the rungs may have already started. Or it may start in 6 months, or a year. His injury risk - especially a neck injury - makes that even more likely. Do you think a person with fused vertebrae can perform just as well as the same person without? Now that's ridiculous. Then look at their recent drafts. Where are the high impact guys? I'll give you Angerer. Who else? The team was already weak on D but always had Manning's arm to protect them. Now the team looks even weaker and has a questionable Manning at QB. And yet your contention is that it's ridiculous to think they're not an automatic contender if they simply bring Manning back? Really? Manning is going to use up way too much cap space for as great a risk as he is - both in regard to potential decline in performance as well as the potential for future injury - when he comes back. IND doesn't have enough team around him right now to make that investment worth while. I'd argue they'd be much, much better off cutting bait and starting over with their next potential franchise QB. Let Manning make his deal with a team that has many more pieces in place to make a SB run, a team that is in its window right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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