CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Well, hopefully his story will be told, because the "insiders" on the PSU boards are saying that Paterno complained every single time he saw Sandusky. He went to the President of the university and asked him to be barred from using any campus facilities, but, was told he didn't have the power to do that. Then he should have gone to someone that had the power. It was his moral obligation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Right, but without quotes, nobody knows for sure (without opening the link) where the article stops, and where your own comments start (or vice versa). I wasn't giving you a hard time, but rather, just making a suggestion. And, for what it's worth, when I said quotes, I meant like this (which makes it very clear where the quoted article stops/starts): Got it........I've been here since 1997 and didn't know how to do the quote thing, unless I was quoting someone else's post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) Being that the stress and regret likely precipitated his quick demise, is reason enough for me to have some sympathy for him and his family (more importantly his family)... If the guy only cared about himself, I don't think you would have seen his health decline so quickly. JMHO though... But moreover, it's not really the time to hash out the guy's "legacy" today, and have respect for the deceased.... You might despise the guy (no comment from me), but the people who are saddened by this don't need all of this thrown back in their face as they mourn... Edited January 22, 2012 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Then he should have gone to someone that had the power. It was his moral obligation. He went to the head of the campus police, who hold complete jurisdiction on crimes that occur on campus. Where else should he have gone ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 But moreover, it's not really the time to hash out the guy's "legacy" today, and have respect for the deceased.... You might despise the guy (no comment from me), but the people who are saddened by this don't need all of this thrown back in their face as they mourn... This, I agree with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 He went to the head of the campus police, who hold complete jurisdiction on crimes that occur on campus. Where else should he have gone ? What if it was your son. What would you have wanted him to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 He went to the head of the campus police, who hold complete jurisdiction on crimes that occur on campus. Where else should he have gone ? Same as I don't think it's the right time to slam the guy, statements like this are only going to continue the scrutiny... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 First of all, on large campuses, the campus police hold jurisdiction to an act that was committed on campus. The State College police have already said that they wouldn't have been able to do anything, as they would have turned it over to the campus police force. Paterno passed on the information, which McQueary has admitted was limited and vague, he received to the person in charge of the campus police. He was told it would be taken care of. Months later, he questioned why nothing had taken place, and he was again told that it was being taken care of. Was that enough ? No, it wasn't, and Paterno has admitted that in hindsight he wished he had done more. However, those acting like he completely turned a blind eye and did nothing are wrong. Some are placing him in the same category as Sandusky, which is sad. He didn't handle it perfectly, but, I don't believe that he was part of some large cover-up, as that isn't his character. Every single player that has played for him, coaches that has coached with him, and those that have played / coached against him who have spoken up, have nothing but positive things to say. Hundreds of them are coming out now and speaking of how much they respect the man. I will take the opinions of those who knew him over my own and others, who are all assuming they know exactly what did or didn't happen (myself included). Like I said, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but, saying good riddance and calling him an a-hole, when you have no idea of what exactly occurred is extremely classless. I don't want to get into a pissing match with you since neither of us know all the facts. What I said is not classless it is my opinion about a man who allowed some of the the most heinous events to occur under his watch for many, many years. Campus police are not the correct "authorities" to report this to. That is following the same protocol as the catholic church. Those police work for Penn ST. I am not saying he didn't do good or even great things. But he mistake(s) , from what I've read and heard are unforgivable. I stand by what I said and I'm sorry if that offends you. He on the other hand offended thousands+. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 What if it was your son. What would you have wanted him to do? Czarina asked me the same thing. Please see my reply to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tally Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 When the decision is ratified over and over again, hour after hour, day after day, year after year, I would not call that one decision. Still, I do not know the facts, and I do not know the man's heart. It is an interesting question whether one matter can, does, or should define a man. For me, I'll not participate in that discussion in this thread beyond what I said above. At this time i hope his passing eases the pain and suffering of his family and of others. +1 He protected that child rapist for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 He went to the head of the campus police, who hold complete jurisdiction on crimes that occur on campus. Where else should he have gone ? State Police maybe????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I don't want to get into a pissing match with you since neither of us know all the facts. What I said is not classless it is my opinion about a man who allowed some of the the most heinous events to occur under his watch for many, many years. Campus police are not the correct "authorities" to report this to. That is following the same protocol as the catholic church. Those police work for Penn ST. I am not saying he didn't do good or even great things. But he mistake(s) , from what I've read and heard are unforgivable. I stand by what I said and I'm sorry if that offends you. He on the other hand offended thousands+. So, you admit that you don't know the facts, but, you stand by calling him an a-hole and saying "good riddance" ? I don't know the facts either, I know what I believe. I'll leave the judging to someone of a higher power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I think my anger and downright hate would be focused on Sandusky and THOSE WHOSE JOB IT WAS TO ACT ON THE INFORMATION THAT JOE PATERNO PASSED ONTO THEM. Joe wishes he had done more in hindsight, because he found out how many kids were affected. The fact that his name is getting drug through the mud more than those whose job it was to act on the information he provided is sad. What is even more sad, is because of his fame, many seem to be putting him into the same group as the sick s.o.b. who actually committed the crimes. Sorry, that's simply not good enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 State Police maybe????? It has been reported several times that going to the State Police would have accomplished nothing. They would have sent it back to campus police, as it is under their jurisdiction. If Campus Police comes to the State Police for assistance, that is different, but, it had to start with the campus police force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menudo Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Alright, obviously I'm not going to change anyone's mind, and I'm hurting for a man who I always admired and believe was a GREAT man. It is probably best that I stay out of these threads for a while, as it is just making me more upset. I'm probably just a bit too close to the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 So, you admit that you don't know the facts, but, you stand by calling him an a-hole and saying "good riddance" ? I don't know the facts either, I know what I believe. I'll leave the judging to someone of a higher power. I don't know all the facts, I said. You judged me as much as I judged him by calling him an a-hole. I hope the full story comes out. Until then we will be at odds on this one. Everyone has their opinion. I have to ask though.....Are you an alum or just a fan or both? You don't have to answer it just seems that some alum view him as a higher power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) I actually can understand what you are going through, to an extent. I was always a big Bob Knight supporter. Even after he was fired, I believed it was wrong. But years later, after being involved in youth coaching, and putting some time between the situation, I have an entirely different perspective on the man. He was a tyrant and a bully. There is NEVER an excuse to put your hands on a child you are coaching in anger. He did some great things. He was a great coach. But I no longer respect him or the way he treated people. And if it had been a recent issue that had been reported, I would be more sympathetic toward Paterno. If the allegations were within the last year or so, I would understand how difficult a situation that had to have been for him. But I'd have told every person that would listen what a sick SOB Sandusky was. I'd talk to McQueary again. We'd keep talking until something was done. 10 years worth of silence and 10 years worth of new victims. Edited January 22, 2012 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) McQueary testified to the grand jury, among other things: "I went to his house and sat at his kitchen table and told him I saw Jerry with a young boy in the shower. That it was way over the lines and extremely sexual in nature. The rough positioning I described but not in much detail." He said Paterno told him, "Sorry you had to see that. You did the right thing." Paterno followed up with him several times in the months following the incident, McQueary testified. Paterno testfied, after being instructed not to go into graphic detail (which boggles my mind): Q: Without getting into any graphic detail, what did Mr. McQueary tell you he had seen and where? Mr. Paterno: Well, he had seen a person, an older — not an older, but a mature person who was fondling, whatever you might call it — I’m not sure what the term would be — a young boy. Q: Did he identify who that older person was? Mr. Paterno: Yes, a man by the name of Jerry Sandusky who had been one of our coaches, was not at the time. Q: You’re saying that at the time this incident was reported to you, Sandusky was no longer a coach? Mr. Paterno: No, he had retired voluntarily. I’m not sure exactly the year, but I think it was either ‘98 or ‘99. Q: I think you used the term fondling. Is that the term that you used? Mr. Paterno: Well, I don’t know what you would call it. Obviously, he was doing something with the youngster. It was a sexual nature. I’m not sure exactly what it was. I didn’t push Mike to describe exactly what it was because he was very upset. Obviously, I was in a little bit of a dilemma since Mr. Sandusky was not working for me anymore. So I told — I didn’t go any further than that except I knew Mike was upset and I knew some kind of inappropriate action was being taken by Jerry Sandusky with a youngster. Q: Did Mike McQueary tell you where he had seen this inappropriate conduct take place? Mr. Paterno: In the shower. Q: Where was the shower? Mr. Paterno: In the Lasch Building. Q: Is that on the campus of Penn State University? Mr. Paterno: It’s right on the campus. Q: Did you tell Mike McQueary at that time what you were going to do with that information that he had provided to you? Mr. Paterno: I don’t know whether I was specific or not. I did tell Mike, Mike, you did what was right; you told me. Even though Jerry does not work for the football staff any longer, I would refer his concerns to the right people. Q: You recall this taking place on a Saturday morning, the conversation with Mike? Mr. Paterno: Yes. Q: When did you — did you do something with that information? Mr. Paterno: Well, I can’t be precise. I ordinarily would have called people right away, but it was a Saturday morning and I didn’t want to interfere with their weekends. So I don’t know whether I did it Saturday or did it early the next week. I’m not sure when, but I did it within the week. Paterno did not act like a "great man" in that instance. He did not act like a man at all. And we may never know what he knew or inferred or reasonably should have inferred about Sandusky over the course of many years. I suspose its up to each one of us to look at that, and to look at the other acts in his life, and arrive at our own conclusions about Paternos legacy. Me, I'm not reveling in his death. But I couldn't give two sh*ts about him and his legacy. I think that you have your head deep in the sand if you are celebrating a man who didn't question McQueary, who didn't call the police and who didn't even want to bother his superiors after he learned that a man "fondled" and engaged in conduct of a "sexual nature" with a young boy. Edited January 23, 2012 by Furd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joessfl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 What if it was your son. What would you have wanted him to do? I would have not stopped until I was satisfied. By satisfied, I mean until I get myself into trouble for defamation or libel or whatever other laws Sandusky could bring on me...campus police, State Police, newspapers on campus and off. Then again, if the Campus police said if was a false report and they talked to McQuery and the family, etc, then I would have to ask my close peer Sandusky what the hell was going on and what his take on it was? In the beginning it was reported that they wetre once friends. "Hey Jerry, what was all the shower-play? Was it really snapping towels? Why didnt you all get together and shower, coaches and kids and teach hygene? Why one on one? Maybe just tape a PSA around good athlete hygene for all to see?" "Hey newspaper, beings that I am a father-figure to the masses, I am curious if you saw the campus police blotter for the month and saw this issue on it? No, hmmm...as a father figure, I ask you the newspaper to follow up for me to inquire why it wasnt on the police blotter. Oh, it was on the police blotter? Wanna follow up with the family, etc?" Maybe he didnt have the time since he was so much more than a coach. But maybe thats what I am getting at, he was mayne just a great coach. Nothing more. That is all. He doesnt happen to be the spirit of the college, the students are. They used him to personify the college. Maybe right, maybe wrong. The students should take it from here, and never forget this dark time. to question authority more, to question and think dynamically, and do what is right in your heart. When you dont get answers, or get the idea that there wasnt enough follow through, to follow through. Dont be complacent. My thoughts and feeling are now rampant after reading all this thread. but maybe I should take some of that ander towrds others in the situation. I am also mad ad McQuery and the others, but they werent being stood up as the "Father figure" of so many kids. I am sitting across from my boy right now as I read this and I am begining to lose it. As a father, I am now exhausted, that if that was my boy, I would be out of my mind and no one would be able to shut me up. Sorry for the rant. I need to stop now. My apoligies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I would have not stopped until I was satisfied. By satisfied, I mean until I get myself into trouble for defamation or libel or whatever other laws Sandusky could bring on me...campus police, State Police, newspapers on campus and off. Then again, if the Campus police said if was a false report and they talked to McQuery and the family, etc, then I would have to ask my close peer Sandusky what the hell was going on and what his take on it was? In the beginning it was reported that they wetre once friends. "Hey Jerry, what was all the shower-play? Was it really snapping towels? Why didnt you all get together and shower, coaches and kids and teach hygene? Why one on one? Maybe just tape a PSA around good athlete hygene for all to see?" "Hey newspaper, beings that I am a father-figure to the masses, I am curious if you saw the campus police blotter for the month and saw this issue on it? No, hmmm...as a father figure, I ask you the newspaper to follow up for me to inquire why it wasnt on the police blotter. Oh, it was on the police blotter? Wanna follow up with the family, etc?" Maybe he didnt have the time since he was so much more than a coach. But maybe thats what I am getting at, he was mayne just a great coach. Nothing more. That is all. He doesnt happen to be the spirit of the college, the students are. They used him to personify the college. Maybe right, maybe wrong. The students should take it from here, and never forget this dark time. to question authority more, to question and think dynamically, and do what is right in your heart. When you dont get answers, or get the idea that there wasnt enough follow through, to follow through. Dont be complacent. My thoughts and feeling are now rampant after reading all this thread. but maybe I should take some of that ander towrds others in the situation. I am also mad ad McQuery and the others, but they werent being stood up as the "Father figure" of so many kids. I am sitting across from my boy right now as I read this and I am begining to lose it. As a father, I am now exhausted, that if that was my boy, I would be out of my mind and no one would be able to shut me up. Sorry for the rant. I need to stop now. My apoligies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joessfl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) I dont know what that means exactly, but that little icon made me laugh out loud. And in my mood, it doesnt matter...right now I needed that. ETA: I was frothing at the mouth looking into the abyss and Captain pulled me out. You complete me. Edited January 22, 2012 by Joessfl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Alright, obviously I'm not going to change anyone's mind, and I'm hurting for a man who I always admired and believe was a GREAT man. It is probably best that I stay out of these threads for a while, as it is just making me more upset. I'm probably just a bit too close to the situation. that sums up every thread about this scandal since it started Menudo . . . I think that bolded part is a great idea, as you will just get increasingly angry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Hoyle Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Right or wrong, I still respect what Paterno did for football. However, it is unfortunate that this entire ordeal is going to tarnish his legacy. He SHOULD HAVE done more to follow up on this. IMHO. The one who I feel is totally wrong would be McCreary!! Again, my opinion. If I were to walk in on that...the SOB would need to get picked up by an ambulance or coroner. End of Story. Whether it was my kid or not he would never touch another kid again. Same goes for priests. As for the rest of the cover up, I think they should ALL lose their jobs and be named in any suit against Penn State. It is just too bad this is always going to put an asterisk next to Paterno's legacy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 It is just too bad this is always going to put an asterisk next to Paterno's legacy. That's the sad part. It didn't have to. If he runs Sandusky out of Penn State, or refuses to drop it until law enforcement has to look, he is a hero. He gets to finish coaching this year. And dies a legend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 That's the sad part. It didn't have to. If he runs Sandusky out of Penn State, or refuses to drop it until law enforcement has to look, he is a hero. He gets to finish coaching this year. And dies a legend. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.