tazinib1 Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Rumor has it Washington is gonna throw in the kitchen sink in order to pick RGIII. Sending the Redskins top 3 picks this year AND their 1st in 2013. How can you turn something like that down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonsoxandy Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 That sucks hard for Browns fans. Another year of Colt McCoy for them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 That sucks hard for Browns fans. Another year of Colt McCoy for them! So Washington is rumored to give up 2012 1st, 2nd, 3rd+ 2013's 1st... Cleveland can always beat out Washingtons offer by trading both 1's this year, 2nd and 3rd from this year, and that will beat the Skins offer. One this is sure, the Rams are going to get all of the pieces to build a nice foundation with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 That sucks hard for Browns fans. Another year of Colt McCoy for them! So maybe they should draft Justin Blackmon and give him someone to work with who has some talent of note Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 So maybe they should draft Justin Blackmon and give him someone to work with who has some talent of note Waay too high for Blackmon. I think the masses will be disappointed by what he does at the NFL. I firmly think he's the third best WR. Either way, I don't think he deserves to get the hype he's getting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted February 26, 2012 Author Share Posted February 26, 2012 Waay too high for Blackmon. I think the masses will be disappointed by what he does at the NFL. I firmly think he's the third best WR. Either way, I don't think he deserves to get the hype he's getting. Agreed.....I have my crosshairs firmly set on Floyd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Dick Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 So Washington is rumored to give up 2012 1st, 2nd, 3rd+ 2013's 1st... Cleveland can always beat out Washingtons offer by trading both 1's this year, 2nd and 3rd from this year, and that will beat the Skins offer. One this is sure, the Rams are going to get all of the pieces to build a nice foundation with. This scenario makes more sense than Washington. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 That sucks hard for Browns fans. Another year of Colt McCoy for them! As a Browns fan I'd prefer we address other needs instead of spending another high pick on a player that may not help much now or in the long term. McCoy may not be as good as RG3 but he is capable of being a long term starting QB in the NFL. He had a new offense last year, no offseason to work, lost his starting RG before the season, Hillis was not as good as 2010, receivers are still mediocre. We need OL, WR, RB, and lots of help on defense more than we need another QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice1 Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) Waay too high for Blackmon. I think the masses will be disappointed by what he does at the NFL. I firmly think he's the third best WR. Either way, I don't think he deserves to get the hype he's getting. I think you are wrong by a lot on the view of the masses and being the third best WR in this class. I get opinions vary but when you focus on the footwork of Blackmon on any route it is very impressive. He can cut seamlessly with either foot on any route. I see a lot of Larry Fitzgerald when I see his route running. Not saying he will be that good but he has a real chance at being a big time star. Blackmon is quicker than fast but has the ability to destroy press coverage and he cuts so well he will be extremely hard to cover in the NFL. I do like Floyd but very few would consider him in the same class. I like him 2nd best but the gap in my mind is pretty wide. These are the only two WR's I think go in round 1 this year. HIll could go late round 1 due to upside. I do think Washingon has the inside track on moving up to the #2 spot. Edited February 27, 2012 by Ice1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Blackmon is this years Crabtree. Overhyped....and for what its worth, I see up to 4 WR's going in the first round. You might wanna do some more research ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonsoxandy Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Blackmon is gonna be something. I think he needs some work to play at the NFL level but every rookie does when they are going into the league...but the kid is ridiculously talented and I highly doubt he will be a bust like Crabtree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice1 Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) Blackmon is this years Crabtree. Overhyped....and for what its worth, I see up to 4 WR's going in the first round. You might wanna do some more research ... Overhyped? Biletnikoff Award 2010 and 2011 All American Consensus 2010 and 2011 Paul Warfield Trophy 2010 Fiesta Bowl MVP 2012 2010 111 receptions 1782 20 TD's 2011 121 receptions 1522 18 TD's There could be more than 2 WR's taken, I see 3 tops but obviously that is speculation at this point. I will be stunned if Balckmon is not the 1st WR taken and believe every team in the league will rate him #1 at the position on thier draft boards. Edited February 27, 2012 by Ice1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 a 6ft WR going into the draft as the best WR on the board? I think not....he didn't even run at the combine because of a hamstring tweak? give me a break....we'll see what he does during his Pro Day. We'll address this issue same time next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flemingd Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Paying the reported price Washington is offering would derail Cleveland - what's the sense getting a franchise guy if you can't give him any weapons nor fill the gaping holes around him? Either take Blackmon at 4 or trade down to 20 or so (SD 18 and Chicago 19, maybe someone loves Blackmon?), draft Floyd, add some picks, and reach for a QB at 22 if you must. FTR I think Blackmon will be a stud - he's not a blazer, but he's fast enough, and his ability to track the ball and attack it before the defender can get involved is surreal. I just think Cleveland has so many holes another year of trading back to pick up quality bodies is in order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 . FTR I think Blackmon will be a stud - he's not a blazer, but he's fast enough, and his ability to track the ball and attack it before the defender can get involved is surreal. Nah, he sucks, just ask Taz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris N Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 blackmon to crabtree is a fair comparison but blackmon's hands are 8 million times better than crabtree's. i see blackmon being a solid nfl wr but not a game breaker because of his size and i think we will see him in the 4.5 range rather than the 4.3/4.4 range. and there will be 4 wr's taken in the first round (blackmon in top 10, floyd in the top 15, kendall wright and alshon jeffrey in the 2nd half of round 1). there are a couple other kids who got a shot to go at the end of the round but i think the beginning of the 2nd round is where you will see a bunch of wr's go (sanu, hill, toon, randle, criner) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby's Hubby Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Either way, we will now have 7 years of comparing Luck with RG III, not to mention comparing RG III to Cam Newton. Unfortunately for RG III (if he goes to Wash) he will be in a division stacked with pass rushers and agressive defenses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) So Washington is rumored to give up 2012 1st, 2nd, 3rd+ 2013's 1st... Cleveland can always beat out Washingtons offer by trading both 1's this year, 2nd and 3rd from this year, and that will beat the Skins offer. One this is sure, the Rams are going to get all of the pieces to build a nice foundation with. The Rams don't need to offer a 2nd and 3rd too to beat Washington's offer, it's the exact opposite that Washington has to put up that much more to beat Cleveland, because Cleveland has the 1.04, so the Rams could move back only two spots, pick up another late first-rounder (the Falcons) and still take Blackmon or Kahlil. Cleveland wouldn't have to give up nearly as much, because they're only asking the Rams to move back two spots (also right ahead of Tampa, who's a potential landing spot for Blackmon). They mgiht have to add something small because RG3's value is rising, but not to match all of Washington's picks offered. Quite the opposite. (Edit: just realized Washington is actually 1.06, so it could be a comparable deal, but I think Cleveland has alot mroe leverage only moving them back to 1.04 with another late first-rounder this year too). I think Cleveland makes all too much sense. Giving 2 first-rounders might prevent them from filling one of their holes, but a guy like RG3 can cover up your weaknesses as you develop and build around him. Edited February 28, 2012 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 The Rams don't need to offer a 2nd and 3rd too to beat Washington's offer, it's the exact opposite that Washington has to put up that much more to beat Cleveland, because Cleveland has the 1.04, so the Rams could move back only two spots, pick up another late first-rounder (the Falcons) and still take Blackmon or Kahlil. Cleveland wouldn't have to give up nearly as much, because they're only asking the Rams to move back two spots (also right ahead of Tampa, who's a potential landing spot for Blackmon). They mgiht have to add something small because RG3's value is rising, but not to match all of Washington's picks offered. Quite the opposite. Washington on the other hand is asking the Rams to move out of the top 10, so that's why they're having to stack up the picks they're offering; They're trying to make their offer as desirable as Cleveland.... Think about how much the Falcons had to pay for Julio Jones, and that was because they were only offering late round picks, a huge drop from the top to the bottom of the first. Redskins might not be as low, but they're trying to get to the top 2 for a franchise QB, so midround picks aren't that inticing without a bunch of them. I think Cleveland makes all too much sense. Giving 2 first-rounders might prevent them from filling one of their holes, but a guy like RG3 can cover up your weaknesses as you develop and build around him. If the Browns make this move the bolded part better be true. I just think that for a team that has a lot of wholes to fill giving up high draft picks to fill someting of a lower need is a big mistake. RG3 cannot fill the holes we have on D (pretty much everywhere). How much better will the offense be with McCoy - RB? - Little, Blackmon vs. RG3 - RB? - Little, Massaqui (or whoever). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 If the Browns make this move the bolded part better be true. I just think that for a team that has a lot of wholes to fill giving up high draft picks to fill someting of a lower need is a big mistake. RG3 cannot fill the holes we have on D (pretty much everywhere). How much better will the offense be with McCoy - RB? - Little, Blackmon vs. RG3 - RB? - Little, Massaqui (or whoever). Well, I do have ot defer to you about how many glaring holes and how guys are coming along, but I am aware that you guys got a bunch of holes to fill (obviously why they made the Julio deal to collect picks). But I'm just not sure I see alot of point in building around McCoy just to be a middle-of-the-pack team. I mean, no offense but I just don't see you filling all the holes around him, and it all of the sudden making the Browns a contender. I think back on what Vick could have been if he had his head screwed on straight and had an accurate arm and size of this kid. Also, when the Falcons drafted Ryan, I wanted to them to go ahead and rebuild the defense instead of drafting him, since it seemed we were so far away from contending; But even with the Falcons unable to quite get over the hump yet with some big holes, they're still a playoff contender every year behind Ryan and won a playoff game with Vick... Only maybe 1 year under Ryan or Vick can I recall having a really strong defense. Brady also got to a SB this year with offensive strength, and of course the game is shifting that way... Though RG3 would be working with less weapons, but you can't underestimate what just the threat of that third-dimension, knowing he could take off at any time. Defenses might have figured out Vick pretty well, but when you prove you can chuck the ball too, it becomes a game of pick your poison. I mean, just think if Tebow could progress to an accurate passer with his running ability. I watched Griffin's 40, and what I noticed is he seems yo have a big second-gear boost right when he gets around where he'd be hitting the edge, so a play breaks down and he finds an alley or makes them miss like he can do, he could be gone... If it's gonna take the Browns at least a couple years to be a real contender, then I'd be hitching my wagon to the can't-miss franchise QB you know can build around to contend, not to do it quicker with a guy who might never get you over the hump to be better than middle of the pack. Browns had a strong running game a couple years ago, so I don't really see how a guy like Richardson is going to improve things much, or even Blackmon... I thought you didn't draft Julio because you had other needs to fill on top of that, but if those other draft picks don't work out, then all you've done is get a potentially sizeable downgrade from Julio to Blackmon. I'd be cashing in my chips to get the can't -miss QB who'd be the undisputed #1 any other year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Well, I do have ot defer to you about how many glaring holes and how guys are coming along, but I am aware that you guys got a bunch of holes to fill (obviously why they made the Julio deal to collect picks). But I'm just not sure I see alot of point in building around McCoy just to be a middle-of-the-pack team. I mean, no offense but I just don't see you filling all the holes around him, and it all of the sudden making the Browns a contender. I think back on what Vick could have been if he had his head screwed on straight and had an accurate arm and size of this kid. Also, when the Falcons drafted Ryan, I wanted to them to go ahead and rebuild the defense instead of drafting him, since it seemed we were so far away from contending; But even with the Falcons unable to quite get over the hump yet with some big holes, they're still a playoff contender every year behind Ryan and won a playoff game with Vick... Only maybe 1 year under Ryan or Vick can I recall having a really strong defense. Brady also got to a SB this year with offensive strength, and of course the game is shifting that way... Though RG3 would be working with less weapons, but you can't underestimate what just the threat of that third-dimension, knowing he could take off at any time. Defenses might have figured out Vick pretty well, but when you prove you can chuck the ball too, it becomes a game of pick your poison. I mean, just think if Tebow could progress to an accurate passer with his running ability. I watched Griffin's 40, and what I noticed is he seems yo have a big second-gear boost right when he gets around where he'd be hitting the edge, so a play breaks down and he finds an alley or makes them miss like he can do, he could be gone... If it's gonna take the Browns at least a couple years to be a real contender, then I'd be hitching my wagon to the can't-miss franchise QB you know can build around to contend, not to do it quicker with a guy who might never get you over the hump to be better than middle of the pack. Browns had a strong running game a couple years ago, so I don't really see how a guy like Richardson is going to improve things much, or even Blackmon... I thought you didn't draft Julio because you had other needs to fill on top of that, but if those other draft picks don't work out, then all you've done is get a potentially sizeable downgrade from Julio to Blackmon. I'd be cashing in my chips to get the can't -miss QB who'd be the undisputed #1 any other year. I don't see the Browns being a real contender any time soon, and by that I mean being considered to have a legit shot at winning a title. I'd like to see steady improvement, a consistently winning team (above .500) and then making the playoffs. I think they can do that just as soon with McCoy as with RG3. I just think too many are blown away by the hype of a player, whether it be RG3, Luck, the next great RB, WR, or really any position. According to you RG3 is a can't miss franchise QB, but according to most Luck is much better, and the closest thing to a sure thing we've seen in many years. Sorry but I'm not buying that, we keep hearing these "can't miss claims" every year, and "no we really mean it this time, forget about those past can't miss guys". Maybe that is why you feel the Browns should take RG3, because you think he will be a franchise QB, or a stud/elite player. Other people I talk to give him a 50/50 chance of success. I'm more in that camp, and that's why I feel that the upgrade of RG3 over McCoy is not worth the price the Browns would have to pay and the other holes they wouldn't be filling. As far as the Browns strong running game a couple of years ago, you mean 2010 with Hillis when they had a merry go round of QBs, and very few other weapons on offense. So yeah while they ran well, their offense as a whole wasn't very good. And we saw how well Hillis did last year, curse, injuries, etc. Personally I don't think RB is a huge need, unless they cannot sign him. WR, OL (esp RT), another LB (Fujita is getting too old), another CB (Sheldon Brown is getting old). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted February 28, 2012 Author Share Posted February 28, 2012 Thank god for the new CBA and the rookie cap. We would not even be talking about somebody trading UP to the 1.2 under the old CBA. A franchise QB for $22 million vs the ungodly $50 million contracts those cats were signing for without ever playing a down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I don't see the Browns being a real contender any time soon, and by that I mean being considered to have a legit shot at winning a title. I'd like to see steady improvement, a consistently winning team (above .500) and then making the playoffs. I think they can do that just as soon with McCoy as with RG3. I just think too many are blown away by the hype of a player, whether it be RG3, Luck, the next great RB, WR, or really any position. According to you RG3 is a can't miss franchise QB, but according to most Luck is much better, and the closest thing to a sure thing we've seen in many years. Sorry but I'm not buying that, we keep hearing these "can't miss claims" every year, and "no we really mean it this time, forget about those past can't miss guys". Maybe that is why you feel the Browns should take RG3, because you think he will be a franchise QB, or a stud/elite player. Other people I talk to give him a 50/50 chance of success. I'm more in that camp, and that's why I feel that the upgrade of RG3 over McCoy is not worth the price the Browns would have to pay and the other holes they wouldn't be filling. As far as the Browns strong running game a couple of years ago, you mean 2010 with Hillis when they had a merry go round of QBs, and very few other weapons on offense. So yeah while they ran well, their offense as a whole wasn't very good. And we saw how well Hillis did last year, curse, injuries, etc. Personally I don't think RB is a huge need, unless they cannot sign him. WR, OL (esp RT), another LB (Fujita is getting too old), another CB (Sheldon Brown is getting old). I completely understand your point of view, and I didn't mean "can't-miss" as much as I think he's far less likely than even most #1 QBs taken msot years to be a bust. His accuracy has apparently been impressive, and really every thing about him at the combine with his size and speed (he measured 6'2 3/8, whiched eased the concrens of some who thought he may be more like 6'1 and too short). I'd be surprised if the people in the know still put him at 50/50, which I'd say is more in line with the #1QB taken most years, where there are some more valid concerns. If Luck weren't such a student of the game, I'd say his potential to be a bust could actually be higher. I'm just not sure how you think you're going to be better off with McCoy, when you say that you're not close to competing. You pointed to the QB carossel, but is Colt that much better to really put up points, even with a strong cast around him? Further, I'm not even sure that I buy the idea that it'd take any less time to build a team that can make the playoffs around Colt, let alone be able to lead you on a Superbowl run. You'd have Griffin for at least the next 5 years, probably even longer, and like I said, I think the 3rd dimension he can bring to an offense makes him dangerous, when he doesn't have to run but can throw a good accurate ball too. (ETA: oh, and did anyone catch him on with Mooch last night? Check it out. He seems to have a good understanding of the game.) Edited February 28, 2012 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyce Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Being a Washington fan I feel if they give up that much for RG3 they are stupid. If the scenerio with Manning falls through then trade down and take Tanehill. I feel Manning is closer to signing with the Skins then most people think. Skins are under the cap by a mile which means they can bring in Wayne with Manning. Bring in Saturday as well because he might be 37 but he is better then what we have. You can still try to lure Colston away from the Saints as well. Not to mention they still have the 6th pick in the draft. Just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Fan Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 MWU - HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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