21 replies to this topic

[LordOpie]

Quote

By Tom McGhee
The Denver Post


Aurora police had information that a bank robber was in one of a group of vehicles stopped at Iliff Avenue and Buckley Road Saturday night when they stopped traffic and pulled a number of people out of cars, handcuffing and questioning them, said police spokesman Frank Fania.

Fania admitted that taking motorists from their cars en-masse was unusual. "I have been doing this for 24 years and I don't ever remember a situation like that."

Police arrested a man taken from one of the vehicles, he said.

"Somebody made a quick decision to stop all of them and hold them and figure out what they were going to do next. We didn't have a vehicle description, we didn't even have his race."

The robber was wearing a mask when he walked into the Wells Fargo branch at 15301 East Hampden Ave. about 10 minutes before the bank's 4 p.m. closing time.

Not everyone taken from 19 cars at the intersection was put in handcuffs, Fania said. "I don't know why certain ones were and others were not," he said.

Police reportedly searched the cars as well.

Traffic was stopped at the Buckley intersection about 30 minutes after the robbery and held for about two hours.

I'm only a little surprised... and very concerned. Seems like innocent people could've been hurt by a pissed off cop when they refused to allow their car to be searched. What kind of poop would've hit the fan if a handcuffed citizen got shot by the bad guy? What if someone was legally CC their firearm?

[westvirginia]

Need a little more info.  How credible was the information?  If it was just some anonymous tip then some folks should lose their jobs at the very least.  If they had some solid evidence that then maybe, maybe there was probable cause.  To my way of thinking though, this wouldn't be a lot different than "suspect is a white male w/brown hair and brown eyes over 6" tall".  Would anyone think it's OK to stop every man fitting that description and handcuff them while searching their vehicle?  I sure wouldn't.  

[The Irish Doggy]

Wow, if I had been one of the innocent people handcuffed, I might have blown an artery.

[LordOpie]

westvirginia, on 06 June 2012 - 09:31 AM, said:

Need a little more info.  How credible was the information?  If it was just some anonymous tip then some folks should lose their jobs at the very least.  If they had some solid evidence that then maybe, maybe there was probable cause.  To my way of thinking though, this wouldn't be a lot different than "suspect is a white male w/brown hair and brown eyes over 6" tall".  Would anyone think it's OK to stop every man fitting that description and handcuff them while searching their vehicle?  I sure wouldn't.  

I've read all the local news papers, they all say the same, they knew nothing... "We didn't have a vehicle description, we didn't even have his race."

All they were looking for were firearms and cash.

[LordOpie]

The Irish Doggy, on 07 June 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

Wow, if I had been one of the innocent people handcuffed, I might have blown an artery.

right, then what? Then you, a law abiding citizen who was rightfully upset that his rights were trampled, would have been beaten and arrested.

How about the fact that they claim that the thief was an armed threat to society and the cops had a bunch of innocent, now DEFENSELESS citizens in handcuffs? If one of them had gotten hurt... sh1tstorm!

[The Irish Doggy]

LordOpie, on 07 June 2012 - 09:06 AM, said:

right, then what? Then you, a law abiding citizen who was rightfully upset that his rights were trampled, would have been beaten and arrested.

Huh? I didn't say I would go postal on the cops. I was just imagining sitting there in cuffs being completely pissed off.

[LordOpie]

The Irish Doggy, on 07 June 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

Huh? I didn't say I would go postal on the cops. I was just imagining sitting there in cuffs being completely pissed off.

I wasn't talking about what you, specifically, would do, but more about a "what if" for any citizen. They don't train for this scenario, so it's easier for mistakes to happen. Then the situation could become a riot.

[electricrelish]

They should have stripped searched them too.

[matt770]

I don't believe a word of it.  These things only happen in other countries.

[westvirginia]

matt770, on 07 June 2012 - 10:11 AM, said:

I don't believe a word of it.  These things only happen in other countries.

Yeah, and the cops won't steal confiscate a large wad of cash from your pocket and make you prove you got it legally to get it back, either.

[matt770]

westvirginia, on 07 June 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

Yeah, and the cops won't steal confiscate a large wad of cash from your pocket and make you prove you got it legally to get it back, either.

Let that be a lesson for all of us...don't go....driving around...in your car........

[sundaynfl]

The good news is that they caught the guy and confiscated his weapons. As long as we are playing the what if game; what if the robber shot people in his next robbery? What if he killed several people during a get away?? And the media found out that the police had this opportunity a few days ago...

[Yukon Cornelius]

when is the government going to take all my guns?

Edited by Yukon Cornelius, 07 June 2012 - 02:24 PM.

[yo mama]

Yukon Cornelius, on 07 June 2012 - 02:22 PM, said:

when is the government going to take all my guns?

As soon as you quit serving in a well-regulated militia.

[electricrelish]

sundaynfl, on 07 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

The good news is that they caught the guy and confiscated his weapons. As long as we are playing the what if game; what if the robber shot people in his next robbery? What if he killed several people during a get away?? And the media found out that the police had this opportunity a few days ago...

Then I'd probably have been shot.

[Pope Flick]

And here I thought you guys all supported profiling. In this case, they profiled whether you had a car.

[Yukon Cornelius]

Pope Flick, on 08 June 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:

And here I thought you guys all supported profiling. In this case, they profiled whether you had a car.

[Clubfoothead]

matt770, on 07 June 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

Let that be a lesson for all of us...don't go....driving around...in your car........

Diving is not a right.  Just like a large Coke.

[delusions of grandeur]

sundaynfl, on 07 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

The good news is that they caught the guy and confiscated his weapons. As long as we are playing the what if game; what if the robber shot people in his next robbery? What if he killed several people during a get away?? And the media found out that the police had this opportunity a few days ago...

What you just said justified why they needed to stop traffic and search for the guy... Hell, it even justified asking people to look into their cars and make sure they could find the armed man... Things like this are legitimate reasons to forego 4th amendment rights in the name of public safety, even moreso than are normal roadblacks... As a libertarian, I have no big issues with this at all, because it's a right you sacrifice in a time when it's in the public's interest of safety as well as justice for an armed and potentially violent criminal.

But to go in and handcuff compliant innocent people, and I've even heard it was at gun point (though I'm not sure if it's been verified or not), is a gross overuse of police power. You can't just go into people's cars and start cuffing them to find 1 guy, nor does it make sense to.... How about simply saying "please stay in your cars" and handcuff anyone acting suspiciously to get out of their car during a roadblock. It was absolutely unnecessary, and if they really were doing it at gun-point, completely dangerous and rife for an "accident".

Further, it doesn't seem very safe at all to remove and restrain the people who could very quickly become a helpless victim if the robber comes out shooting... Why in the world would they not just keep people in their cars? It not only seems very unneccesary, but not at all safe either.

Edited by delusions of grandeur, 08 June 2012 - 01:45 PM.

[BillyBalata]

sundaynfl, on 07 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

The good news is that they caught the guy and confiscated his weapons. As long as we are playing the what if game; what if the robber shot people in his next robbery? What if he killed several people during a get away?? And the media found out that the police had this opportunity a few days ago...

what if he had taken a family in one of those cars hostage and forced them to say he was their uncle to try and get thru the roadblock? How should they go about determining that?  The article stated not all of the people stopped were put in handcuffs.  I would assume the ones getting handcuffed looked suspicious enough they felt the safest option was to handcuff them until they determined who they were.

[sundaynfl]

BillyBalata, on 08 June 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

what if he had taken a family in one of those cars hostage and forced them to say he was their uncle to try and get thru the roadblock? How should they go about determining that?  The article stated not all of the people stopped were put in handcuffs.  I would assume the ones getting handcuffed looked suspicious enough they felt the safest option was to handcuff them until they determined who they were.

The cops would have seen him leave his vehicle and try to get into another one...

delusions of grandeur, on 08 June 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

What you just said justified why they needed to stop traffic and search for the guy... Hell, it even justified asking people to look into their cars and make sure they could find the armed man... Things like this are legitimate reasons to forego 4th amendment rights in the name of public safety, even moreso than are normal roadblacks... As a libertarian, I have no big issues with this at all, because it's a right you sacrifice in a time when it's in the public's interest of safety as well as justice for an armed and potentially violent criminal.

But to go in and handcuff compliant innocent people, and I've even heard it was at gun point (though I'm not sure if it's been verified or not), is a gross overuse of police power. You can't just go into people's cars and start cuffing them to find 1 guy, nor does it make sense to.... How about simply saying "please stay in your cars" and handcuff anyone acting suspiciously to get out of their car during a roadblock. It was absolutely unnecessary, and if they really were doing it at gun-point, completely dangerous and rife for an "accident".

Further, it doesn't seem very safe at all to remove and restrain the people who could very quickly become a helpless victim if the robber comes out shooting... Why in the world would they not just keep people in their cars? It not only seems very unneccesary, but not at all safe either.

I agree with you. Just like when you get pulled over the cops don't want you to get out of the car.

[ABearWithFurniture]

Clubfoothead, on 08 June 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

Diving is not a right.  Just like a large Coke.

Works on a lot of levels there Club