52 replies to this topic

[muck]

http://www.bloomberg...lly-repaid.html

And, the Fed still owns 61% of AIG.  If they sell their stock at an average price between $27-28 bucks, they'll break even.  It closed today at a shade over $31.

I wish I could find the link to my post where I told everyone that I was pretty sure the taxpayers would make a profit on the AIG bailout...but, I couldn't find it...  alas ...

Anyhow, I thought you all would like to see the good news.

[Big John]

muck, on 14 June 2012 - 05:47 PM, said:

I wish I could find the link to my post where I told everyone that I was pretty sure the taxpayers would make a profit on the AIG bailout...but, I couldn't find it...  alas ...

http://forums.thehud...revised-opinion

[keggerz]

For some reason something still stinks to me.

[i_am_the_swammi]

keggerz, on 14 June 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

For some reason something still stinks to me.

Could be the crow that the righties are eating

[Chavez]

i_am_the_swammi, on 14 June 2012 - 09:08 PM, said:

Could be the crow that the righties are eating

Um, yeah, right.

Being a member of the GOP means never having to say you're sorry. Or you were wrong. Or someone from the other side of the aisle may conceivably have a point or a good idea.

[bushwacked]

Chavez, on 14 June 2012 - 09:34 PM, said:

Um, yeah, right.

Being a member of the GOP means never having to say you're sorry. Or you were wrong. Or someone from the other side of the aisle may conceivably have a point or a good idea.

Well, in their defense, a Kenyan born Socialist Muslim has never been right, had a valid point, or a good idea.

[muck]

I'm generally pretty conservative and I was the one who suggested that the taxpayer would probably make some money on the AIG bailout.

So, presumably you're not talking about me...

[Chavez]

muck, on 14 June 2012 - 11:35 PM, said:

I'm generally pretty conservative and I was the one who suggested that the taxpayer would probably make some money on the AIG bailout.

So, presumably you're not talking about me...

No, I didn't mean you at all. I'm pretty left and thought that AIG and the big banks should go  hang, and it turned out to be a net gain for the US's bottom line.

I don't think I was necessarily wrong, but at least the decision I disagreed with ended as good as one could have hoped.

[Clubfoothead]

keggerz, on 14 June 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

For some reason something still stinks to me.

Chavez, on 15 June 2012 - 06:45 AM, said:

No, I didn't mean you at all. I'm pretty left and thought that AIG and the big banks should go  hang, and it turned out to be a net gain for the US's bottom line.

I don't think I was necessarily wrong, but at least the decision I disagreed with ended as good as one could have hoped.

I'm pretty sure I concur with keg and Chavez.  I was no fan of the bailout myself but trusted those who said we had no choice, including :gulp: the Coward in Chief, 43.  Looks like everything worked out for everyone except the people who lost their houses.  Glad the taxpayer is apparently not taking this one in the a$$ but something doesn't feel right.

This is a legitimate question:  What has AIG done so great in this lousy economy that they are able to repay such a sizeable loan, with interest, in such a short period of time?

[muck]

Club ... they are (essentially) an insurance company, and the insure a very wide variety of risks all around the world ... and for any client that wants their insurance to continue, they must pay their premiums ... and whatever is left over after paying claims is available to repay debts.  That, plus, AIG has sold some huge subsidiaries for billions and billions, and these proceeds have been used to repay loans.

**********************

As an aside, I remain pretty convinced the auto bailouts will be a huge loss for the taxpayer.

[delusions of grandeur]

Yay, rewarding bad behavior rocks!

(Unless of course you're not "too big to fail". Then you can go F yourselves)

[Brentastic]

How exactly is the taxpayer being paid back in this situation?

[muck]

$ received by the UST from AIG & Banks > $ given by the UST to AIG & Banks


$ received by the UST from US Auto Manufacturers < $ given by the UST to US Auto Manufacturers

[Brentastic]

But the article only mentions that the Fed was repaid the portion that the Fed lent.  It mentions nothing about the UST being repaid and in fact mentions that the UST still owns 61% of AIG.   So the taxpayers have not been paid back in any way.  The UST still owns a majority of the company which means the UST has not been made square until it sells it's shares.

E2A:

"Taxpayers remain at risk in the wake of the September 2008 bailout of AIG, once the world’s largest insurer, which swelled to $182.3 billion in value. The Treasury Department still owns 61 percent of the New York-based company and needs to sell theshares at an average price of $28.72 apiece to break even. The Fed may still generate profits as it disposes of remaining assets in the vehicles."

The banks always win and us taxpayers always lose.  Borrower is servant to the lender.

Edited by Brentastic, 15 June 2012 - 01:56 PM.

[Savage Beatings]

Getting paid back is great (obviously).  That doesn't mean that using taxpayer money to bail out private business is necessarily the right decision.  I'm sincerely glad it worked out.  But I would most likely be against it should a similar situation come up again.

[bushwacked]

Sounds like a lot better deal than my tax $$ going to Iraqis.

[delusions of grandeur]

bushwacked, on 15 June 2012 - 02:01 PM, said:

Sounds like a lot better deal than my tax $$ going to Iraqis.

Don't worry, it should all be heading to Syria and Iran soon enough. Go big government!!

[bushwacked]

We better get to Syria and Iran before the American economy collapses, because that has been about to happen for a good 5 years now.

[muck]

Brent ===> the closing price of AIG today was 31.45 ... about 15% above the price needed for us to break even ... so, while you're right that the UST needs to sell it's shares in order for us to realize the gain, my point was that the financial system bailout has turned out (so far) far better for the tax payers than many expected it would.

Now, the auto bailout and the stimulus spending is a whole other ball of wax.

[Big Country]

Brentastic, on 15 June 2012 - 01:53 PM, said:

But the article only mentions that the Fed was repaid the portion that the Fed lent.  It mentions nothing about the UST being repaid and in fact mentions that the UST still owns 61% of AIG.   So the taxpayers have not been paid back in any way.  The UST still owns a majority of the company which means the UST has not been made square until it sells it's shares.

E2A:

"Taxpayers remain at risk in the wake of the September 2008 bailout of AIG, once the world’s largest insurer, which swelled to $182.3 billion in value. The Treasury Department still owns 61 percent of the New York-based company and needs to sell theshares at an average price of $28.72 apiece to break even. The Fed may still generate profits as it disposes of remaining assets in the vehicles."

The banks always win and us taxpayers always lose.  Borrower is servant to the lender.

The UST holds an asset that currently has more value than what they spent. If they fail to make a profit by not selling what they can now, then the American People's ire should be pointed directly at the UST decision makers that fail to act, not at AIG in this situation.

[Clubfoothead]

Big Country, on 15 June 2012 - 03:26 PM, said:

The UST holds an asset that currently has more value than what they spent. If they fail to make a profit by not selling what they can now, then the American People's ire should be pointed directly at the UST decision makers that fail to act, not at AIG in this situation.

If it is being bought by the jerkoff managing my 401(k) I'm not sure how eagerly I am looking forward to it being sold off.  That jacka$$ doesn't have a very good track record.

[Brentastic]

Big Country, on 15 June 2012 - 03:26 PM, said:

The UST holds an asset that currently has more value than what they spent. If they fail to make a profit by not selling what they can now, then the American People's ire should be pointed directly at the UST decision makers that fail to act, not at AIG in this situation.

I understand but the bottom line is that they can't sell that many shares at today's price.  What we also don't know is if there was a reverse split in the stock price to where the current value is mis-leading.  All I know is that until the UST actually sells and makes a profit, the taxpayers are not off the hook.  This whole experiment also sets a very bad precedent.

[Brentastic]

muck, on 15 June 2012 - 03:10 PM, said:

Brent ===> the closing price of AIG today was 31.45 ... about 15% above the price needed for us to break even ... so, while you're right that the UST needs to sell it's shares in order for us to realize the gain, my point was that the financial system bailout has turned out (so far) far better for the tax payers than many expected it would.

Now, the auto bailout and the stimulus spending is a whole other ball of wax.

As I noted above, until the UST sells, nothing is certain.  Also, see the bolded in your post.

[keggerz]

Brentastic, on 15 June 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

I understand but the bottom line is that they can't sell that many shares at today's price.  What we also don't know is if there was a reverse split in the stock price to where the current value is mis-leading.  All I know is that until the UST actually sells and makes a profit, the taxpayers are not off the hook.  This whole experiment also sets a very bad precedent.

That I agree 10000000000000% with....if it does indeed workout you can bet your bottom dollar that it will be a tactic used again in the future....but there are no guarantees that it will work out at that point....bad, bad, bad precedent, imo.....and someone also enlighten me as to why they had to create Maiden Lane I, II etc, more ways to screw with stuff?

[Yukon Cornelius]

muck, on 14 June 2012 - 05:47 PM, said:

http://www.bloomberg...lly-repaid.html

And, the Fed still owns 61% of AIG.  If they sell their stock at an average price between $27-28 bucks, they'll break even.  It closed today at a shade over $31.

I wish I could find the link to my post where I told everyone that I was pretty sure the taxpayers would make a profit on the AIG bailout...but, I couldn't find it...  alas ...

Anyhow, I thought you all would like to see the good news.

Who did they swindle the money out of to pay it back?