Bronco Billy Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Has Mannin ever thrown 3 ints in the first 10 minutes of a game before? BB, you're right shoulda kept Tebow. I wouldn't go that far... Manning has no consistently threatening deep capability any longer. That's what I've been trying to emphasize this season from what I've seen. His long passes float and his deep accuracy is awful. We saw that again tonight. He still knows the game and how to move D players pre-snap and during the play better than any QB in the game, and his short to midrange passes are solid as long as he avoids deeper midrange outs, so he still brings a lot to the table. But this isn't the Manning we used to know, and he likely never will be again. Opposing DCs are going to start changing their scheming against Manning - I know I would. Play hard corners (especially against Thomas) and play Ss in a float in the intermediate zone, and force Manning to beat them deep. Then we'll see some real issues with the DEN O as you start getting more players closer to the LoS and McGahee starts getting affected. Just going to take some cajones by the DCs to get the perception out of their heads that you can't press the LoS against Manning successfully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 I know Peyton threw quite a few picks in the 1st quarter but down by 3 TDs in the 4th quarter and running the ball, just didn't understand. Those 2 scoring drives took about 10 minutes off the clock. Maybe something is wrong with Manning's arm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 They still had time to score again and went 3-and-out at least once in the 4th Qtr. I think they were running because it was working with the defense trying to focus on the pass. It seemed to me that in all 3 interceptions Manning was missing something the defense was doing. The balls were also not thrown that well, but that wasn't the primary purpse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted September 18, 2012 Author Share Posted September 18, 2012 They still had time to score again and went 3-and-out at least once in the 4th Qtr. I think they were running because it was working with the defense trying to focus on the pass. It seemed to me that in all 3 interceptions Manning was missing something the defense was doing. The balls were also not thrown that well, but that wasn't the primary purpse. Exactly, not that Manning didn't have issues of his own, but I've never seen anything like that the way they were all moving around confusing him. This isn't Mike Smith's first rodeo with Peyton either, as he used to coach for Jacksonville. They definitely decided to not let Peyton dictate the game like he always does, and did a tremendous job. Also it's coming to fruition that Smith wanted to be able to run a no-huddle of his own after coaching against Manning. I don't recall the no-huddle being the difference for the Falcons last night, but Ryan was absolutely on point, getting the ball out quicker than I've ever seen him (you couldn't even really notice that the protection was good because it didn't matter). He's really coming into his own, and I don't know that it's too early anymore to start the "Peyton Jr." talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTSuper7 Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 He's really coming into his own, and I don't know that it's too early anymore to start the "Peyton Jr." talk. Well, Ryan's career playoff record to date reflects that he's off to a good start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Well, Ryan's career playoff record to date reflects that he's off to a good start. An identical one at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 They still had time to score again and went 3-and-out at least once in the 4th Qtr. I think they were running because it was working with the defense trying to focus on the pass. It seemed to me that in all 3 interceptions Manning was missing something the defense was doing. The balls were also not thrown that well, but that wasn't the primary purpse. What am I missing? You admit that the passes were poorly thrown (unquestionably they weren't catchable by his receiver given the locations and the D positioning) but that Smith dreamed up something Manning hasn't encountered in a decade and a half of pro football and couldnKt adjust for as the play developed? IMO he just doesn't have the ability to throw those passes any longer. That seems more plausible than your theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted September 18, 2012 Author Share Posted September 18, 2012 What am I missing? You admit that the passes were poorly thrown (unquestionably they weren't catchable by his receiver given the locations and the D positioning) but that Smith dreamed up something Manning hasn't encountered in a decade and a half of pro football and couldnKt adjust for as the play developed? IMO he just doesn't have the ability to throw those passes any longer. That seems more plausible than your theory. Or it might just be a combination of the 2. It's not like Manning's brain is any more infallible than his arm is, or he would have never lost a game before now. Unless you blame it completely on his arm why the first and second games looked completely different in Manning's ability to read and pick apart the defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boltnlava Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Scheme can beat Manning. Ask the Chargers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Or it might just be a combination of the 2. It's not like Manning's brain is any more infallible than his arm is, or he would have never lost a game before now. Unless you blame it completely on his arm why the first and second games looked completely different in Manning's ability to read and pick apart the defense. Exactly. And it wasn't like Manning was playing against a terrible defenes in that opening game. He looked pretty good picking apart the Falcons in the second half scoring drives as well. I'm suggesting that maybe Peyton is a little rusty still, and was pressing some and not recognizing some of what the defense was doing. All that standing around with 9 or more guys at the line of scrimmage seemed to cause trouble. BB, You can believe whatever you want, and I know nobody here can change your mind, so I won't even bother trying. I don't believe that Peyton cannot complete those kind of passes anymore. It may be true, but I'm going to need to see more than one game against a good defense on the road to prove it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Unless you blame it completely on his arm why the first and second games looked completely different in Manning's ability to read and pick apart the defense. It appeared to me that the Denver WRs were often w-i-d-e open againt the Steelers and Manning did a fine job of hitting those receivers. I didn't see that as much against Atlanta. Manning tried to shoehorn the ball into a couple of spots with poor results. Manning doesn't have the arm strength, which gives the DB a chance to break on the ball. The old Manning is gone and until yesterday no team had played the new Manning with the benefit of film. Manning will adjust and so will the teams that play against him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boltnlava Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Well, that sucked. Losing with Manning has to be at least as good as winning with Tebow and knowing your not going anywhere. At least with Manning you feel it can get better. Maybe even great. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 One more thing. I see to recall that back in the day the Ravens defense did something similar to what the Falcons did last night and Manning seemed to carve them up pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted September 18, 2012 Author Share Posted September 18, 2012 One more thing. I see to recall that back in the day the Ravens defense did something similar to what the Falcons did last night and Manning seemed to carve them up pretty good. That's where you obviously can't deny that arm-strength is an issue, but he should know he's not 100%. I would guess that in the past, if a defense actually confused him, then his arm was good enough to bail him out on ill-advised throws. So either he just wasn't being smart last night (not very characteristic of him), or what Crumpler said in the Falcons pregame show, that if you can confuse Manning, you've got a shot at beating him. So yes, I think it was a combo of Manning not having the arm strength, and Nolan setting him up to throw it where he shouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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