giantsfan Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 Giantsfan, do you own Stafford or Calvin? I do own Calvin in one of my three leagues, but honestly I am talking football here. It is pretty clear, to me at least, that the way the Lions are playing isn't how they played last season. And most importantly is clearly not working. That has zero to do with owning any of the Lions. To me it is just common sense. But I could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Give it a rest. I cant. I am not a quitter 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giantsfan Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) Yeah, I'm wondering what the his personal interest is. He isn't a fan, yet watches their games and for 2 (or is it 3) weeks now starts a thread ranting about how terrible they are, how they need to stop running (but it isn't all the running games fauit when called on it). My personal interest is two fold. One I had Calvin and Stafford last season. Which leads to two, I started to like the Lions because I watched them so much last season. I guess you can add three...I hate when teams try to re-invent the wheel and change what works. And AGAIN, I am not saying it is the running games fault. They do need to run some. They just need to be smarter with how/when they run, and how they run their O. No one is saying they should never run or the running game is awful, but the way they are running their O is what I have an issue with. It is ridiculous given the results from last season AND the results so far from this season. Makes no sense to me at least. Edited October 1, 2012 by giantsfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I cant. I am not a quitter http://bleacherreport.com/articles/757769-detroit-lions-top-7-biggest-misconceptions-in-lions-history#/articles/757769-detroit-lions-top-7-biggest-misconceptions-in-lions-history/page/3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 http://bleacherrepor...-history/page/3 Walter Payton was on some pretty bad football teams himself. I never saw him "Honorably leave " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Walter Payton was on some pretty bad football teams himself. I never saw him "Honorably leave " I forgot that Payton played the game until he died. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I forgot that Payton played the game until he died. Payton didnt walk from the team because "They didnt have a commitment to win" . Barry left them in the lurch, there is no denying it no matter how you try and paint it. Legend on the field but tarnished . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Payton didnt walk from the team because "They didnt have a commitment to win" . Barry left them in the lurch, there is no denying it no matter how you try and paint it. Legend on the field but tarnished . Sanders quit because he didn't want to play the game anymore. If you think that he should have reached what was probably the most difficult decision in his life sooner, you're unreasonable. If you think that he should have risked his health by working at a dangerous job for another year just for the benefit of his boss or his co-workers, you're an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Sanders quit because he didn't want to play the game anymore. If you think that he should have reached what was probably the most difficult decision in his life sooner, you're unreasonable. If you think that he should have risked his health by working at a dangerous job for another year just for the benefit of his boss or his co-workers, you're an idiot. He also quit because management sold tickets because of him and throughout his entire career never tried to improve the product and actually build a team around one of the best RB's in the game. They were losing but selling tickets because of Sanders. No Sanders, no ticket sales. Never once did they make an effort to make the Lions into a winning team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Sanders quit because he didn't want to play the game anymore. If you think that he should have reached what was probably the most difficult decision in his life sooner, you're unreasonable. If you think that he should have risked his health by working at a dangerous job for another year just for the benefit of his boss or his co-workers, you're an idiot. Im surprised our distinguished litigator has been reduced to name calling. Sorry I struck a nerve . I am also burdened with guilt now after learning of Barrys "plight" of being paid millions of dollars by the evil bossman. The Lions organization is the first I have ever heard of that marketed one of the best players in the game. How foollish of them . Did Barry leave contract years on the table and did he make this decision after the draft ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkirc Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Barry left because Bobby Ross treated him like a rookie who had to earn his job. Ross was trying to run the Lions like a college program and Barry was already frustrated with the losing and Ross was the straw that broke the camel's back. I don't think you will hear too many true Lions fans blaming Barry one bit for retiring. The timing of it was poor, but he struggled with the decision. Why do Cowboy fans care to bash Barry? And, yes, the Lions coaching staff needs to be firmly placed on the hot seat. The Lions brought in players during the offseason just to improve special teams. Nice job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 He also quit because management sold tickets because of him and throughout his entire career never tried to improve the product and actually build a team around one of the best RB's in the game. They were losing but selling tickets because of Sanders. No Sanders, no ticket sales. Never once did they make an effort to make the Lions into a winning team. Having tickets sold on your heels is the trade off for being paid millions of dollars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Having tickets sold on your heels is the trade off for being paid millions of dollars. Not trying to improve your franchise under any circumstance is a disservice to every player that goes on the field every week. Which is magnified when you have the piece of the puzzle in place with a guy like Barry, and make no effort to win for 10 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkirc Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 The Lions ran the ball 20 times versus 51 passes. Complaining about running the ball too much is silly. If the Lions special teams didn't give up 14 ponts and the WRs could catch a tough ball they would have won that game going away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 The Lions ran the ball 20 times versus 51 passes. Complaining about running the ball too much is silly. If the Lions special teams didn't give up 14 ponts and the WRs could catch a tough ball they would have won that game going away. If my aunt had a peeener she'd be my uncle. If the Vikes didn't score 2 special teams TD's Ponder would have lit them up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkirc Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I wasn't pissing on the vikings and their play. They did what they had to do to win. I am pointing out the reason why the Lions lost was not an over realiance on the runniing game. They lost because they can't catch the ball and tackle kick returners. I would be very excited if I was a Vikings fan. They appear to be an improving young squad and may have found a frnachise QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) Not trying to improve your franchise under any circumstance is a disservice to every player that goes on the field every week. Which is magnified when you have the piece of the puzzle in place with a guy like Barry, and make no effort to win for 10 years. He is the greatest Lion of all time. That alone will make Lions fans look the other way on how he betrayed the franchise with his final acts. Furdnudo will defend him to the death even though, deepdown, he and every Lions fan knows that the timing of Barrys abandonment of the franchise is a capital offense. They will prefer to tell you how he simply handed the ball to the official after tds instead of acknowledging the fact that he handed them a classless finale . Edited October 1, 2012 by whomper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giantsfan Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 Can I ask this question. How often did the Lions go hurry up O and spread it out? Not often early. I called out one drive mid game. First play 15 yard pass for a 1st down. Then they slowed it down, huddled up, and ran for 1 on the next play. To me that is what I am talking about. Not the actual # of runs. The style they are playing. I also want to add, this is not the only issue. Don't want to sound like I am saying "fix" this and all is great. Their special teams are still a joke. Their D has been a huge question mark. Their receivers have been dropping passes, Calvin even dropped a few yesterday. The coaching staff is a joke. So there are MANY issues here. I just don't think they are being true to themselves. But again, maybe I am missing it on the Lions. I could be way off. Certainly possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkirc Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 The Lions played hurry up last year because they were constantly trying to come back from 21 point deficits. It is one thing to be successful throwing the ball all over the place when the defense is playing soft with a big lead. It is quite another when you are playing in close games. Teams will play 2 deep safeties on the Lions all year until they prove they can beat it. Good offenses take what the other teams give them. Look at what the Pats did to the Bills yesterday. The Lions are not a very good team right now in any aspect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giantsfan Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 The Lions played hurry up last year because they were constantly trying to come back from 21 point deficits. It is one thing to be successful throwing the ball all over the place when the defense is playing soft with a big lead. It is quite another when you are playing in close games. Teams will play 2 deep safeties on the Lions all year until they prove they can beat it. Good offenses take what the other teams give them. Look at what the Pats did to the Bills yesterday. The Lions are not a very good team right now in any aspect. I guess it is a chicken or the egg thing. When they spread and play hurry up they have been much better. But flip side one could say it is because they are behind. Who knows the answer. I am just not sure the Lions are built to play any other way. Spreading out and playing quickly worked last season. I think that is how they are built. I think that gives them their best shot to win most weeks. Most weeks the Packers, Pats, Broncos, and Ravens are playing that style. Now some of those teams can play more than one way (Ravens and Pats for sure), but that is how they play more often than not. I think that is what the Lions are built for. Not sure they are built to play any other way. And I think the coahces lack creativity. Who knows at this point though. I agree with your last point for sure though. They are a mess in EVERY aspect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stethant Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 The major issues to me are 1) special teams play, 2) Stafford being "off" since week 1, and 3) defense. I'd put the 3 problems in that order. The special teams issues really kill a team. I'm not convinced the tempo of the game is the problem. Whether you're racing to the line or plodding down field, if you're QB can't hit the receivers you're not going anywhere. Agree that Leshoure's YPC is not helping, but Detroit's ground game wasn't great last year either and they did OK. If they cleaned up special teams and had more accuracy from Stafford, they could probably tolerate a questionable defense and an underperforming running attack. Full disclosure I have KSmith in my main league - I don't think he meaningfully impacts this discussion one way or the other, though. Totally agree that the coaches - Schwartz in particular - inspires zero confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhalDodo Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 They dont handle pressure well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaPackers Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I'm surprised at just how bad Lions have been this season, I expected alot more from them. I expected them to come 2nd in their division and take a wildcard spot once again for the playoffs but going by their form so far not a chance of that happening. Although I think they will come good and soon, they pretty much lost last night because of special teams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giantsfan Posted October 1, 2012 Author Share Posted October 1, 2012 (edited) Seems like we all agree on one thing. VERY poorly coached team. And Schwartz leaves a lot to be desired. Everyone has their opinions on why they are here. ST's. Play calling/style of play. D. Stafford off. But the thing we pretty much all agree on is the coaches are not strong. That says a lot to me. Edited October 1, 2012 by giantsfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furdnudo Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 I cant. I am not a quitter Blasphemy. Barry Sanders and Jerome Bettis were the best two RB's in the History of the NFL, and the two classiest guys ever. I love them both just so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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