DMD Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 From Lions Twitter feed: #Lions release official statement that Jahvid Best will not be permitted to return to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 any idea what is next for him? have him pining in a dynasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Too bad that a young talented guy should have everything end so early in his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKIDKOKID Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Probably for the good (so wanted to say best),,,maybe he will be able to remember his kids names this way. KO'd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolverines Fan Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 It's a shame, but I think we can all agree it's for the best. If he's still having problems a year after his last concussion, he needs to hang it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 He is probably already eligible for the class action suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geo33 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 So are we definitely dropping him? Or is there a chance he can show up towards the end of the year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennykravitz2004 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 If he ever sees a football field again, somebody needs to have their soul checked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonsoxandy Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 time to cut ties completely. damn shame that football hit him so hard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thews40 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Not sure why the NFL doesn't put a layer of rubber on the helmets? Having a background in shock and vibe, the harder the material, the higher the peak acceleration. When I see players leading with their helmets and seeing the snapping result, it boggles my mind why this is happening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMD Posted October 17, 2012 Author Share Posted October 17, 2012 Not sure why the NFL doesn't put a layer of rubber on the helmets? Having a background in shock and vibe, the harder the material, the higher the peak acceleration. When I see players leading with their helmets and seeing the snapping result, it boggles my mind why this is happening? I wondered exactly this as well. You may be trying to protect the melon inside, but making the outside unbreakable hard plastic is what the problem often is. They use it as a battering ram. Think of the difference between wearing a boxing glove or a set of brass knuckles. When you decrease the concussion on the outside, you do not have nearly as much energy to dissipate on the inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Not sure why the NFL doesn't put a layer of rubber on the helmets? Having a background in shock and vibe, the harder the material, the higher the peak acceleration. When I see players leading with their helmets and seeing the snapping result, it boggles my mind why this is happening? agree that they need something to help absorb the blow...fwiw I attended a concussion seminar earlier this summer and it is something that they have/are looking at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpinalTapp Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 agree that they need something to help absorb the blow...fwiw I attended a concussion seminar earlier this summer and it is something that they have/are looking at. Or take the helmets off the players and no player will lead with his head again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Or take the helmets off the players and no player will lead with his head again. not all injuries occur from players leading with their heads...some are due to "incidental" contact and other times when their heads hit the ground...maybe while we are at it we should just do away with airbags, seat belts and even stop lights and stop signs...then everyone will be much more careful so that no one gets hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Couch Potatoe Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Whatever happened to the ole Mark Kelso extendo helmet that made him like the Great Gazoo... They were on the right track (although dated technology now) with repeat concussions in players just expand that technology to everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 not all injuries occur from players leading with their heads...some are due to "incidental" contact and other times when their heads hit the ground...maybe while we are at it we should just do away with airbags, seat belts and even stop lights and stop signs...then everyone will be much more careful so that no one gets hurt. First to spinaltapp's statement, Joe Montana suggested removing the face mask from helmets to avoid players leading with their heads, not a bad idea. As to your sarcastic suggestion to remove other safety features in cars, I believe that people drive more carelessly because they have all these things. I ride motorcycles (sport bikes) and there have been many rider aids moving from racing into bikes, ABS, traction control, wheelie control etc. Since people have a basic level of risk they can accept, when there is more protection you are less careful. I'm at far more risk on my motorcycle than in a car, and operate in a way that reflects that. Just as the driver of that big 3 ton SUV is less careful than the driver of the small econo box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilthorp Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The Lions should offer this kid a high paying job in their organization and allow him to not just fall off the face of the earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 (edited) Back with this discussion? Okay, first create a mouthguard rule and enforce it rigorously - like high school football. I still for the life of me cannot figure out why players refuse to utilize them. Mouthguards serve the same purpose as rigid dampers like hard rubber washers in steel construction in that they are elastic enough to spread and dissapate kinetic energy but rigid enough to protect teeth during impact. Then look at the helmet design. This is an engineering problem - how to provide rigid protection to the head while simultaneously spreading the point load from an impact to uniform loading. This is why doing something like placing a rubber surface outside of the helmet will have very limited effect. Dense fluids tend to be very good energy dissapators (these are called viscous dampers). Remember the egg drop contest in high school science class? The easiest and cheapest way to succeed was to use a thick incompressible fluid like honey inside the box to spread the impact while absorbing the kinetic energy of the impact by coverting it to heat, and then use something like glued paper strips to utlize a tension system to hold the egg in the center of the box. Obviously we can't surround the human head with dense fluids without other serious consequences. So create a shell-within-a-shell helmet design where the shells are separated uniformly by the use of rigid springs, and then pump thick fluid between the shells. It would only need to increase the helmet diameter by maybe 1.5 inches to create enough space between the rigid layers to provide a sufficient fluid layer, and then you'd have two methods of energy dissapation - one by absorption through the fluid and the other by the outer shell sliding over the fluids relatively independent of the inner shell (shear damping). This would also spread the point loading of the impact over a much greater surface, lessening the severity of the blow to the skull substantially. Leaks in the outer shell could easily be monitored and patched, and then fluid replaced in very short order in the event that the outer shell were damaged. Needless to say the cost of the helmet would increase, I'd guess maybe threefold or so, and the weight would increase by maybe 8 pounds - which is significant, but the protection would be greatly improved. Edited October 17, 2012 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peepinmofo Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Whatever happened to the ole Mark Kelso extendo helmet that made him like the Great Gazoo... They were on the right track (although dated technology now) with repeat concussions in players just expand that technology to everyone Actually just read today that Daniel Thomas is going to be wearing an oversized helmet after his recent concussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 (edited) Needless to say the cost of the helmet would increase, I'd guess maybe threefold or so, and the weight would increase by maybe 8 pounds - which is significant, but the protection would be greatly improved. I agree with most of what you are saying, but added weight could be just as, if not more problematic. You increase the weight too much & you increase the risk of neck injury. An NFL helmet already weighs over 4 lbs. Tripling the weight would put undo strain on the neck to keep the head in a prone position during impact. At any rate, the cost of such helmets should be of no concern whatsoever, not if they are truly serious about protecting the players from head injuries. Edited October 17, 2012 by rajncajn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 I agree with most of what you are saying, but added weight could be just as, if not more problematic. You increase the weight too much & you increase the risk of neck injury. An NFL helmet already weighs over 4 lbs. Tripling the weight would put undo strain on the neck to keep the head in a prone position during impact. That's a very valid concern, and I agree. There would have to be some real in-depth research in optimizing the design for both function and usage simultaneously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Back with this discussion? Okay, first create a mouthguard rule and enforce it rigorously - like high school football. I still for the life of me cannot figure out why players refuse to utilize them. Mouthguards serve the same purpose as rigid dampers like hard rubber washers in steel construction in that they are elastic enough to spread and dissapate kinetic energy but rigid enough to protect teeth during impact. Then look at the helmet design. This is an engineering problem - how to provide rigid protection to the head while simultaneously spreading the point load from an impact to uniform loading. This is why doing something like placing a rubber surface outside of the helmet will have very limited effect. Dense fluids tend to be very good energy dissapators (these are called viscous dampers). Remember the egg drop contest in high school science class? The easiest and cheapest way to succeed was to use a thick incompressible fluid like honey inside the box to spread the impact while absorbing the kinetic energy of the impact by coverting it to heat, and then use something like glued paper strips to utlize a tension system to hold the egg in the center of the box. Obviously we can't surround the human head with dense fluids without other serious consequences. So create a shell-within-a-shell helmet design where the shells are separated uniformly by the use of rigid springs, and then pump thick fluid between the shells. It would only need to increase the helmet diameter by maybe 1.5 inches to create enough space between the rigid layers to provide a sufficient fluid layer, and then you'd have two methods of energy dissapation - one by absorption through the fluid and the other by the outer shell sliding over the fluids relatively independent of the inner shell (shear damping). This would also spread the point loading of the impact over a much greater surface, lessening the severity of the blow to the skull substantially. Leaks in the outer shell could easily be monitored and patched, and then fluid replaced in very short order in the event that the outer shell were damaged. Needless to say the cost of the helmet would increase, I'd guess maybe threefold or so, and the weight would increase by maybe 8 pounds - which is significant, but the protection would be greatly improved. So honey-filled helmets or do we just inject the honey into their skulls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 BB, Don't the helmets already contain fluid absorbing layers (between inside of helmet and the head)? Are you suggesting more of that, or a change in liquids. I compare these in a way to safety helmets used in racing (or motorcycle riding, bicycles, etc.) In these cases the helmet shell is constructed to dissipate the energy. The inner layer will also deform and absorb energy as the head presses against it. But then these are usually meant to be used once, and after a crash or significant impact they are replaced. Hard to do that in football, since players could need a new helmet every few plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpinalTapp Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 not all injuries occur from players leading with their heads...some are due to "incidental" contact and other times when their heads hit the ground...maybe while we are at it we should just do away with airbags, seat belts and even stop lights and stop signs...then everyone will be much more careful so that no one gets hurt. Obviously, I would never advocate the removal of helmets. I think the problem is that, for years, players have felt falsely secure in their helmets...more like stunt ment in "death proof" cars rather than soccer moms in mini-vans. Players have played under the assumption that they can effectively drive full speed into brick walls (helmet to helmet) and walk away from the crash without any damage. No soccer mom would ever drive her mini-van into a wall simply because she has an airbag and a seat belt. The league's focus on concussions is evidence that players helmets are the equivalent of mini-vans with air bags and seat belts...not death proof crash vehicles. The problem is that the damage caused by these collisions was not immediately visible - so it has gone unnoticed/unreported for years. These guys need to be more careful with their noggins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Obviously, I would never advocate the removal of helmets. I think the problem is that, for years, players have felt falsely secure in their helmets...more like stunt ment in "death proof" cars rather than soccer moms in mini-vans. Players have played under the assumption that they can effectively drive full speed into brick walls (helmet to helmet) and walk away from the crash without any damage. No soccer mom would ever drive her mini-van into a wall simply because she has an airbag and a seat belt. The league's focus on concussions is evidence that players helmets are the equivalent of mini-vans with air bags and seat belts...not death proof crash vehicles. The problem is that the damage caused by these collisions was not immediately visible - so it has gone unmentioned/ignored/hidden/denied for years. These guys need to be more careful with their noggins. ftfy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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