Scorcher Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I would say that my knowledge of football is pretty limited compared to others on this board. I am posing this discussion because I would like to hear from others more knowledgeable. One thing I don't understand is why it seems that the same teams continue to have the same problems year after year while other teams seem to have the same strengths and continue to progress and finish at the top of their divisions. I understand that teams periodically go through rebuilding phases; what I don't understand is teams that continuously have the same issues season after season. A case in point is the Cardinals with their QB issue. It is exactly the same as last year when it was a big problem, not to mention their o-line. Once again Chiefs are a mess, San Diego same old up and down "not going to make the playoffs" team. Other teams like Atlanta, San Francisco, and Houston are making great additions and are truly rebuilding teams. Indiana is another team that comes to mind that is rebuilding rapidly. What is the difference? Why do some teams have the same problems year after year? One thought that came to my mind is that Football teams unlike any other business will make a profit no matter how crappy the product. Also most products are not supported by a fan base. I am seriously asking this and would really like some input and a healthy discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White lightning Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 F**k if I know. As a Bears fan, we've gone through 45 QBs (give or take) since Jim McMahon. It took us 15 years to land a decent QB and he was another team's draft pick. Bear's fans either blamed the McKaskey's for being cheap, our coaches for being morons, or the almighty taking pity on God forsaken cities like Green Bay and Detroit. Me? I'm religous man so I blame God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 F**k if I know. As a Bears fan, we've gone through 45 QBs (give or take) since Jim McMahon. It took us 15 years to land a decent QB and he was another team's draft pick. Bear's fans either blamed the McKaskey's for being cheap, our coaches for being morons, or the almighty taking pity on God forsaken cities like Green Bay and Detroit. Me? I'm religous man so I blame God. Good example. Any legitimate business would not continue year after year with the same problem. The Jets seem to have QB issues, but no change. Adding Tebow seems the same to me as MCDonald's saying to a customer "We messed up the french fries so to make it up to you we are going to give you a larger order." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Pimp Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Good example. Any legitimate business would not continue year after year with the same problem. The Jets seem to have QB issues, but no change. Adding Tebow seems the same to me as MCDonald's saying to a customer "We messed up the french fries so to make it up to you we are going to give you a larger order." The thing with the Jets is that they went to two straight AFC Championships with Sanchez and it seems that they think there's no reason why he can't do it again. They missed the playoffs last year and they'll miss them again this year so 2 great (yet overachieving) years and then two very disappointing years. Maybe they try to make a change in 2014. I think in some cases it's flat out the ownership of the team. Some are in it to win it and some are just there to make money and run a business. Panthers paid a bunch of money to 2 RB's because they were too low in the cap so instead of trying to go get better players and build they just paid what they had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 front office/gm/coaching/philosophy all play into it...also a certain steadfastness/rigidity in not adjusting if/when something goes wrong. az took a gamble on kolb. let boldin and breaston go. never had a running threat. jets took a run first/strong defensive approach and though sanchez had enough to manage the offense. he had thomas jones/lt/s. green earlier...also holmes/plastico/keller/edwards. more wieght is on his shoulders and he is not that type of qb. san diego has let go of lt/turner/sproles/vjax lately.. their rb's have gotten hurt and gates is aging chiefs refuse to put the ball in the hands of their biggest playmakers..also gambled on cassell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 The thing with the Jets is that they went to two straight AFC Championships with Sanchez and it seems that they think there's no reason why he can't do it again. They missed the playoffs last year and they'll miss them again this year so 2 great (yet overachieving) years and then two very disappointing years. Maybe they try to make a change in 2014. I think in some cases it's flat out the ownership of the team. Some are in it to win it and some are just there to make money and run a business. Panthers paid a bunch of money to 2 RB's because they were too low in the cap so instead of trying to go get better players and build they just paid what they had. The only reason they got into playoffs one year was because Colt's laid down and kept their best players on the bench. Otherwise it would have only been once. As far as Panthers go the money they laid out for their RB's compared to usage is to me one of the all time ineffective business decisions ever made. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Arizona is just too streaky for their own good. I think they felt good going into this year with the o-line and the two QB's they had, well at least as good as they did last year. If memory servers me correct they won there last 8 home games until losing to the Bills in OT, that's nothing to feel bad about. They had already taken there chance on Kolb, so I doubt they were even interested in Flynn and Peyton Manning wasn't going to happen. So to saying that they didn't at least try to upgrade there QB position doesn't fly. It just didn't pan out. Next year they'll probably be drafting a QB in the early rounds. Weather that works out for them again is quite like catching lightning in a bottle. Just look at the post about the Bears QB woes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Arizona is just too streaky for their own good. I think they felt good going into this year with the o-line and the two QB's they had, well at least as good as they did last year. If memory servers me correct they won there last 8 home games until losing to the Bills in OT, that's nothing to feel bad about. They had already taken there chance on Kolb, so I doubt they were even interested in Flynn and Peyton Manning wasn't going to happen. So to saying that they didn't at least try to upgrade there QB position doesn't fly. It just didn't pan out. Next year they'll probably be drafting a QB in the early rounds. Weather that works out for them again is quite like catching lightning in a bottle. Just look at the post about the Bears QB woes. As far as their victories go how much of that was Cardinals D? Also with millions of dollars at hand couldn't any team hire people that know how to judge upcoming talent? Last year Kolb was a bust and yet they picked up the option on him and gave him a huge payday. They could have gone after Flynn and gotten much more for less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 (edited) I Don't agree about Flynn. There was an even less sample size of Flynn then there was of Kolb. They already took a shot so I think they were hesitant to do it again one year late after the Kolb fiasco. I do on the other hand agree with you that they had the option to let Kolb go and not pay him the money and draft this year which would have netted them Wilson, Weeden or Nick Foles instead of Malcolm Floyd. In this regard it's as if they didn't know what they were doing "hey lets draft a WR we've got no one good to throw him the ball, that doesn't matter". Some times teams seem to look purely at talent rather then needs, Arizona strikes me as such. EDIT: Also remember Flynn was a free agent so if he was to have gone to Arizona it would have been of his own accord. That also probably would have meant and similar contract as Kolb's as why would Flynn aspect anything less from Arizona. At least that's what I think, I could be wrong. I'm not sure Flynn would be the answer to there needs, anyways. Russell Wilson beat him out for the starting gig and Ryan Tannahill was drafted over him in Miami by the Packers offensive coordinator of all people. I'm not sure what that says about Flynn, just saying. Edited November 2, 2012 by Seahawk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Seahawk with all due respect I know you meant Michael Floyd, and good point about "no one to throw it to him." Here is my one thought on your comment about Flynn. If I were a savvy football recruiter I would realize after seeing Rodgers that Green Bay has a good record of bringing up back up QB's ( Hasselbeck, Rodgers). Strictly as a businessman looking to improve my product I would go with the Packers system as opposed to Philly system even after I had made the Philly mistake. I often wonder if NFL teams don't have some kind of P&L for an end of the year summation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chargerz Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 The Chargers will not improve until the organization can replace the players that A.J. signed with considerably better players and then replace Norv with a head coach that really knows what he's doing. Until then it will be the same old sh*t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 (edited) The Chargers will not improve until the organization can replace the players that A.J. signed with considerably better players and then replace Norv with a head coach that really knows what he's doing. Until then it will be the same old sh*t. This might be a case where you shouldn't leave your anus alone! lol! Edited November 3, 2012 by Scorcher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 (edited) I'm not so sure Flynn success wasn't more system related. You think Ken Whisenhunt is going to change his system to fit Flynn. Not only that, but Mike Holmgren was The Coach of the Packers and took Hasselbeck and that system to Seattle, Rodgers is a product of that system behind what Mike McCarthy was doing with Farve. That's a very small sample size with a very precise offensive style from Coach to QB to Coach to QB. One that I don't think Arizona runs. What's really telling is what I said before his own offensive coach Joe Philbin didn't want him and that Russell Wilson and rookie quarterback beat him out of the starting job. Maybe just maybe Arizona avoided another disaster, but on the other hand maybe not. I would also like to add that I like Flynn and I like the contract we signed with him in Seattle. Sorry I did mean Michael Floyd. Edited November 3, 2012 by Seahawk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 I'm not so sure Flynn success wasn't more system related. You think Ken Whisenhunt is going to change his system to fit Flynn. Not only that, but Mike Holmgren was The Coach of the Packers and took Hasselbeck and that system to Seattle, Rodgers is a product of that system behind what Mike McCarthy was doing with Farve. That's a very small sample size with a very precise offensive style from Coach to QB to Coach to QB. One that I don't think Arizona runs. What's really telling is what I said before his own offensive coach Joe Philbin didn't want him and that Russell Wilson and rookie quarterback beat him out of the starting job. Maybe just maybe Arizona avoided another disaster, but on the other hand maybe not. I would also like to add that I like Flynn and I like the contract we signed with him in Seattle. Sorry I did mean Michael Floyd. Point taken, and an example of why I sought others opinions, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorcher Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 The Chargers will not improve until the organization can replace the players that A.J. signed with considerably better players and then replace Norv with a head coach that really knows what he's doing. Until then it will be the same old sh*t. I guess my attempt at levity missed the mark. I sometimes think the Chargers fans must be the most frustrated because it seem that there is so much hope every year that seems to never come to fruition. As an outsider the fact that Turner remains the coach is one of the most beguiling things to me because he is always highly criticized and yet he remains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loaf Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 I always expect disappointment. I can't be let down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 A.J. is the biggest problem more so then Turner, in my opinion. How much talent has he let leave San Diego since and including Brees. Don't get me wrong Norv has had time to make something of it in SD, but it's never been quite there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chargerz Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 A.J. is the biggest problem more so then Turner, in my opinion. How much talent has he let leave San Diego since and including Brees. Don't get me wrong Norv has had time to make something of it in SD, but it's never been quite there. I see the Chargers finishing at 8-8 this year (at best) followed by the firing of both A.J. and Norv (hopefully). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Depending on the the Bronco. 8-8 might be good enough for the playoffs. At that point it would seem or look like another year of Norv and A.J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted November 4, 2012 Share Posted November 4, 2012 By far, the biggest factor is the QB. The best QB's make the playoffs more often than not for the duration of their careers, regardless of everything else that happens around them. That leaves only a couple other slots every year for everybody else. Elite QB's are hard to find. If you don't have one, you have to get really lucky and draft the right one. It is incredibly difficult to find any consistency without one, and incredibly difficult to burrito it up if you have one. The other 20% is front office/coaching, see Dallas and San Diego. As an example, the Seahawks have needed to get an elite QB for at least five years now. Every year they know they need to get one. Every year that guy just doesn't exist, therefore the Hawks are mediocre at best, even though their other 21 players are just about as strong as any other team out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildTurkey Posted November 4, 2012 Share Posted November 4, 2012 the Seahawks to me, need a different OC. Darrell Bevell caught lightning in a bottle with Favre one year but his time with the Seahawks mirror the crap years of the Vikings during his tenure. They rode an awesome back but without one premier WR they never made it very far. Get rid of that loser, get a premier WR or at least an OC able to make use of the WR's and the Seahawks are dominant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckDuckGoose Posted November 4, 2012 Share Posted November 4, 2012 The Chargers have an elite quarterback when he wants to be. But I do find it odd that the Chargers suck with Phillip Rivers and Matthews and not really any legit WR's, however the 49ers are successful with Alex Smith, Gore and no legit WR's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.