redman Posted October 1, 2005 Share Posted October 1, 2005 Swiss Cheezhead - here's my understanding. In Dungy's version of the Cover 2, the MLB has a traditional, stay at home, read and react role. The Sam has more than the average amount of responsibility for pass coverage. This leaves - intentionally - the Will, who is supposed to be the most athletic LB and the biggest playmaker, to flow to the ball and make plays as he sees fit. They therefore end up with a lot of tackles and assists, good passes defensed numbers, and probably also an above-average amount of forced fumbles and INT's for their position. They are not often used to pass rush, so they won't tend to generate a lot of sacks, especially when compared to Will's in other schemes. The best example of the "prototype" Will for this scheme is Derrick Brooks; another recent example is Lance Briggs in Chicago. (I'm not sure why NFL.com lists him as the Sam on the depth chart; Ourlads has them correctly listed as Will's.) This is also why so many people were skeptical about Cato June filling this role, because they doubted his ability to have good instincts to flow to the ball as a converted safety, and also because he might not be solid enough of a tackler and playmaker at that position. He seems to have improved enough to be at least adequate there. Other schemes have done this. Sorry for the homer example, but Marty and Kurt Schottenheimer "tipped the field" towards their lone defensive playmaker in 2001, Lavar Arrington, given the overall weakness in the defense, and Lavar had a career best season in terms of tackles, and INT's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 Swiss Cheezhead - here's my understanding. In Dungy's version of the Cover 2, the MLB has a traditional, stay at home, read and react role. The Sam has more than the average amount of responsibility for pass coverage. This leaves - intentionally - the Will, who is supposed to be the most athletic LB and the biggest playmaker, to flow to the ball and make plays as he sees fit. 1036012[/snapback] Unfortunately, the whole system still doesn't make sense to me. I can understand the Sam covering the TE and/or covering the intermediate zone almost all the time. That still doesn't explain the perceived difference in opportunities between the MLB and WLB in the Cover-2. If the MLB has a "traditional, stay-at-home, read-and-react" role, then he should be scoring like other MLBs in the league. Right? I mean, the word "traditional" pretty much answers that question. That's what a MLB is there to do -- read and react. So...I'm still confused about the "Super Cover-2-WLB" Theory. If the MLB is reading and reacting to plays and the WLB is "flowing" to the ball "as he sees fit", then we're talking about identical responsiblities. Both LBs are diagnosing the play and chasing the ball-carrier. Period. Why would the WLB end up with more tackles? Sarge -- Mr. Expert -- feel free to educate me on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 Crickets... Anyone have an answer for me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 Sorry, was out of town this weekend, and didn't check this forum. As I understand it, the weakside backer has less coverage responsibilities and is more free to find the ball carrier. A disadvantage of the the Cover 2 is the defensive line is asked to penetrate and get up field. They are not asked to occupy blockers, or keep the linemen off of the linebackers so that they can make plays. With that happening, you are going to see more offensive lineman and tight ends blocking the strong-side backer and MLB, especially on runs to the strong side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted October 6, 2005 Share Posted October 6, 2005 Sorry, was out of town this weekend, and didn't check this forum. As I understand it, the weakside backer has less coverage responsibilities and is more free to find the ball carrier. A disadvantage of the the Cover 2 is the defensive line is asked to penetrate and get up field. They are not asked to occupy blockers, or keep the linemen off of the linebackers so that they can make plays. With that happening, you are going to see more offensive lineman and tight ends blocking the strong-side backer and MLB, especially on runs to the strong side. 1040832[/snapback] The argument about the D-line's responsibilities is something I hadn't actually considered. That makes some sense. As for the coverage element, aren't all three LBs in the base Cover-2 just playing short-to-intermediate zones? I mean, I understand the SLB will have a TE in their zone more often, but I'm more concerned about the MLB and WLB. Do they each have different coverage responsibilities or are they both just playing zone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted October 6, 2005 Author Share Posted October 6, 2005 (edited) As for the coverage element, aren't all three LBs in the base Cover-2 just playing short-to-intermediate zones? I mean, I understand the SLB will have a TE in their zone more often, but I'm more concerned about the MLB and WLB. Do they each have different coverage responsibilities or are they both just playing zone? 1046477[/snapback] I honestly do not know their exact responsibilities. Of course, it would depend on the coverage they are playing. The WLB is usually the smaller and faster of the LB's, enabling him to make more plays. I also think he has less coverage reads. The SLB would be covering the the TE and also would have to be aware of the backs. The middle linebacker must read run first, and also would have coverage on backs coming up the middle and TE's coming from the strong side. The WLB would have to cover a back coming to his side. I'm guessing that less coverage responsibilites would free him up to get involved in more tackles as well. On a run, the responibility to take out the lead blocker falls to the MLB and the SLB, leaving plenty of tackles for the WLB and the SS, the tackling machines of the cover 2. A lot of times the LB makes no effort to actually tackle the ball carrier. His responsibility is to take out the blocker and trust that the next guy to the play gets the ball carrier. Edited October 6, 2005 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted October 6, 2005 Share Posted October 6, 2005 Thanks, Capt -- that's pretty good info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncosn05 Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 Cato June. 821458[/snapback] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I honestly do not know their exact responsibilities. Of course, it would depend on the coverage they are playing. The WLB is usually the smaller and faster of the LB's, enabling him to make more plays. I also think he has less coverage reads. The SLB would be covering the the TE and also would have to be aware of the backs. The middle linebacker must read run first, and also would have coverage on backs coming up the middle and TE's coming from the strong side. The WLB would have to cover a back coming to his side. I'm guessing that less coverage responsibilites would free him up to get involved in more tackles as well. On a run, the responibility to take out the lead blocker falls to the MLB and the SLB, leaving plenty of tackles for the WLB and the SS, the tackling machines of the cover 2. A lot of times the LB makes no effort to actually tackle the ball carrier. His responsibility is to take out the blocker and trust that the next guy to the play gets the ball carrier. 1046484[/snapback] At this point, this has to be revisited. Obviously, the WLB is dropping back into coverage A LOT. June has FIVE interceptions already? And it doesn't seem like a total anomaly -- Derrick Brooks got lots of INTs in Tampa, too. What gives? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 At this point, this has to be revisited. Obviously, the WLB is dropping back into coverage A LOT. June has FIVE interceptions already? And it doesn't seem like a total anomaly -- Derrick Brooks got lots of INTs in Tampa, too. What gives? 1079515[/snapback] I'm not sure how this is inconsistent with what has been said. Flowing to the ball doesn't just refer to tackling the runner. If the WLB reads pass he's free to drop into his short-to-intermediate zone to make a play. By the way, I'm still after picking June up off of waivers last preseason for a song. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted October 18, 2005 Author Share Posted October 18, 2005 (edited) At this point, this has to be revisited. Obviously, the WLB is dropping back into coverage A LOT. June has FIVE interceptions already? And it doesn't seem like a total anomaly -- Derrick Brooks got lots of INTs in Tampa, too. What gives? 1079515[/snapback] Why does this need revisited? Less coverage responsibilities means he isn't matched up one-on-one with a defender and is more free to "roam" in his zone. He is more free to get into the passing lanes, which is exactly where ALL five of his INT's have come from. He wasn't covering any of intended targets of those passes, but was instead dropping in passing lanes, which is what he would do on a passing play. This results in more tackles and more INT's. Edited October 18, 2005 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 Uh oh: Colts | June Injury UpdateThu, 20 Oct 2005 15:17:53 -0700 Indianapolis Colts LB Cato June (hernia) missed practice Thursday, Oct. 20 as he was scheduled to visit a specialist regarding his sports hernia to determine the severity of the injury. June is not expected to play in Week 7 and will likely be replaced by LB Gilbert Gardner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knicker Posted October 23, 2005 Share Posted October 23, 2005 just an update... Tony Dungy and team doctors have cleared Cato to play. Basically, it's up to him. I would expect him to start but if the game gets out of hand and the pain is too much I would expect him to come out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted October 24, 2005 Author Share Posted October 24, 2005 (edited) Cato June played today. I caught him once doubled over in pain reaching for his groin area. I know it's the hernia. You guys better grab up Gilbert Gardner while you still can. Bob Sanders also hurt his left wrist or hand in the first half. He did return to the game in the second half. Don't know the severity yet. Edited October 24, 2005 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted October 24, 2005 Author Share Posted October 24, 2005 According to the paper today, Sanders said he is fine. He was taken to the locker as a precaution. The Colts have two weeks to get healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The hernia is going to remain an issue all year for June unless he undergoes surgery. As difficult as it is for McNabb to play with one at QB, I have NO idea how you play with one at LB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 10, 2005 Author Share Posted November 10, 2005 Doss is listed as probable but did not practice on Wednesday due to a shoulder injury. It was in a sling. His back-up is Joseph Jefferson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 11, 2005 Author Share Posted November 11, 2005 Doss did not practice on Thursday. Dungy said his shoulder does not require surgery, but needs rest, and he will probably not start on Sunday. Joseph Jefferson will be the Colts SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 11, 2005 Author Share Posted November 11, 2005 Back-up defensivie end Jonathan Welsh tore his ACL in practice Wednesday and is out for the year. Back-up MLB Rob Morris has an inner ear problem and some "balancing issues". He plays special teams. DT Josh Williams and CB Von Hutchins have been begun practicing with the team after spending the start of the season on the PUP list. No decision has been made to whether or not they will be added to the roster yet. LB Tyjuan Hagler, who has also been on the PUP list after sports hernia surgery, practiced the last three weeks, but will not be activated, and will miss the rest of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coltsfan183288 Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 cato june has that job locked if he keeps it up...hes a stud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swiss Cheezhead Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 cato june has that job locked if he keeps it up...hes a stud 1142522[/snapback] Good point, bro. You know who else I think might keep his starting job? Peyton Manning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 14, 2005 Author Share Posted November 14, 2005 Bob Sanders tweaked his knee and did not return to the game. In the post-game interview, Dungy said he was cleared to return to the game, but they decided to hold him out as a precaution. He said he "slightly sprained his knee". Of course, I recall him saying Joseph Jeffson having a "mild case of turf toe" and JJ went on to miss 6 weeks. Who knows at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 14, 2005 Author Share Posted November 14, 2005 MRI shows no ligament damange in Bob Sanders' knee. His availability for Week 11 against the Bengals will be decided later in the week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt770 Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 (edited) What happened to Mathis? Did they rest him for the Bengals game? Edited November 16, 2005 by matt770 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 What happened to Mathis? Did they rest him for the Bengals game? 1154069[/snapback] He played. Texans played a lot of max protect. He had his streak of a sack in 8 straight games snapped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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