Is there anyone out there better than Tom Brady?

[JoJoTheWebToedBoy]

I give credit, where credit is due. And IMO, Brady is one of the best QBs in the game.

 

He has led his team to 3 Superbowls, and won each of those Superbowls. He's been down and with the clock ticking, and he's led them to victory in the regular season, the Playoffs, and the Superbowl.

 

What more do you want. Everytime I see a thread like this, you always here "But if he didn't have good players around him, he wouldn't be that great". Ya think, Duh.

 

No one person in football is the team, it takes good players to get to the Superbowl. You could have the best QB or RB (anyone remember Barry Sanders), etc... but if you don't have anything else, you lose.

 

He plays the position very well, he utilizes the personnel he has, and he's a damm good field general. The guy is good, HOF good.

[Gators]

I am so sick and tired of hearing Peyton Mannings name come up,when speaking of the greatest players in the league. He is not even close. When it is crunch time,Peyton crumbles like a 3 week old cookie. What has he done to warrant those lofty accolades. I could throw for 4,000 yds and 50 tds. with that Colts offense. Manning , next to McNabb is the most over-rated, over-hyped player in the NFL. Keep in mind while Donavon and Peyton are filming all those cute commercials, Brady is winning SUPERBOWLS!

Edited June 3, 2005 by Gators

[CaptainHook]

I am so sick and tired of hearing Peyton Mannings name come up,when speaking of the greatest players in the league. He is not even close. When it is crunch time,Peyton crumbles like a 3 week old cookie. What has he done to warrant those lofty accolades. I could throw for 4,000 yds and 50 tds. with that Colts offense. Manning , next to McNabb is the most over-rated, over-hyped player in the NFL. Keep in mind while Donavon and Peyton are filming all those cute commercials, Brady is winning SUPERBOWLS!

 

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Petyon Manning's better. If he'd been with the Pats, they would have four straight Super Bowl wins.

[Bill Swerski]

I could throw for 4,000 yds and 50 tds. with that Colts offense.

 

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And I could win three Super Bowls with Bill Belichick and his defense.

[Bill Swerski]

To say that he is a slightly better than average QB is ridiculous, as it is to say that Ty Law or Corey Dillon is just as important.

 

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Um, Ty Law equaled Brady's TD output in SB 36. You think they would've won that game if Law hadn't picked off Warner and ran it back all the way?

[Furd]

Um, Ty Law equaled Brady's TD output in SB 36.  You think they would've won that game if Law hadn't picked off Warner and ran it back all the way?

 

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That would be one game homes.

[Clubfoothead]

I could throw for 4,000 yds and 50 tds. with that Colts offense.

 

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I'll bet you a million dollars you couldn't.

[Swashbucklers]

Based on what I have read in this thread, you are telling me that Trent Dilfer is a better QB than Marino because he has won more Superbowls. Brady cannot be considered one of the best QBs of all time until he has proven himself for many years, with many different teammates around him. All of the QBs mentioned have had good years and bad years, mostly based on the talent around them. Brady has had the same core players around him his entire career. If he can do what he is doing now (which is winning games) with far less talent surrounding him, then he may be considered one of the best of all time. His COACHES and his teammates are putting him in a great position to win games at this point in his career.

 

And I hardly believe that anyone of us could throw for 4,000 yards and 50 touchdowns in a season.

[Bill Swerski]

That would be one game homes.

 

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Super Bowls are pretty important games, no?

 

OK, so how about the AFC Championship game where Law picked off Manning THREE times? NE's defense forced FIVE turnovers that game. You don't think Ty Law (or Rodney Harrison, who forced the other two turnovers) are important? You don't think that Brady benefitted from their presence?

Edited June 3, 2005 by Bill Swerski

[Vet]

I think Brady is great..Hes extremely cool and under control and he has those intangibles that are so important..We had this discussion last year though..We debated his rings over Mannings abilities..There is a grey area there..Sure the team concept is a big factor (Def,running game,Coaching staff etc) But the bottom line is that Brady is a winner. Do you think the Pats wouldve won all these superbowls without him? Before Bledsoe went down were they a contender that year? (Im really not sure of the answer to that question) Brady has the goods..Best ever remains to be seen but he is for real.

 

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The thing I like about Brady is he doesn't try to do too much. He plays within himself and doesn't try to win the game on his own.

 

Watching the Patriots under Bledsoe, I always felt like he was trying to justify his first round selection. He was always viewed as the Patriots "savior", and he ha d an awful lot of pressure on him. Maybe the fact that Parcells preferred Rick Mirer over Bledsoe in the draft gave Bledsoe an inferiority complex, I don't know. But, I always felt like Bledsoe was always trying to make the "perfect" pass. That resulted in alot of sacks and alot of interceptions. It's tough for a first round pick QB - a crown jewell of an organization - to succeed. The expectations bury him. There have obviously been exceptions, but the majority of high-first round QB's aren't great in the NFL. The Patriots never would have won three Superbowls with Bledsoe - never.

 

As a sixth round pick, Brady was never expected to make the team - let alone win 3 Superbowls. His brilliance lies in the fact that he accepts his own shortcomings, he knows what he can and cannot do and he doesn't screw up. He takes advantage of opportunities as they arise, but doesn't try to win the game on his own. That's what I've always admired about Brady.

 

 

As a Jets fan, I wish Chad Pennington would do the same thing. It's tough playing in New York, because if you take too long taking a shucks one night, the press splashes it all over the front page (actually, the back page - but you get my drift). That puts extra pressure on a QB. Sometimes Chad tries to do too much and it ends up hurting him.

[Furd]

Super Bowls are pretty important games, no? 

 

OK, so how about the AFC Championship game where Law picked off Manning THREE times?  NE's defense forced FIVE turnovers that game.  You don't think Ty Law (or Rodney Harrison, who forced the other two turnovers) are important?  You don't think that Brady benefitted from their presence?

 

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I didn't say that at all.

 

I believe that Brady has been more important to NE's success that Law or Dillon. Certainly other players, particularly Law, have contributed to that success.

 

And the ALL CAPS and really emphasize your points well, sparky. Too bad you can't use your crayons, eh?

[Bill Swerski]

I didn't say that at all.

 

I believe that Brady has been more important to NE's success that Law or Dillon.  Certainly other players, particularly Law, have contributed to that success.

 

And the ALL CAPS and  really emphasize your points well, sparky.  Too bad you can't use your crayons, eh?

 

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Nice personal attack. Does a hell of a lot to strengthen your argument, momo.

 

Brady has been very important to NE's success, but to say that he's more important than some of NE's core defensive players over the years (Law, Harrison, Vrabel, Bruschi) is a stretch. At the very least, the defense as a whole has been significantly more important to that team's success than Brady.

[Clubfoothead]

I like the Brady/Aikman comparison, but I put Brady above Aikman because they both benefitted from great coaching and defense, but while Aikman had Irvin, Smith, Novachek, Johnston, and the most dominant OL ever, Brady has had Brown/Givens/Branch, Smith/Dillon, and a patchwork of roleplayers blocking for him.

Policy, you summed this whole thread up with one short paragraph. You really do drop knowledge! 

 

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Except he's wrong. Brady couldn't carry Danny White's jock much less Troy Aikman's. I agree with the comparison to Aikman but the conclusion that Brady is better than Troy is lunacy.

[Vet]

I didn't say that at all.

 

I believe that Brady has been more important to NE's success that Law or Dillon.  Certainly other players, particularly Law, have contributed to that success.

 

And the ALL CAPS and  really emphasize your points well, sparky.  Too bad you can't use your crayons, eh?

 

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Furd -

 

My advice is don't reply to Swerski's idiotic posts. He knows very little, but he seems to have alot of free time on his hands. I guess other than flossing his tooth, he has very little to do each day. He's an inbred slow and an ignoramus. Other than that, he's not a bad guy,

[charty]

Super Bowls are pretty important games, no?  

 

OK, so how about the AFC Championship game where Law picked off Manning THREE times?  NE's defense forced FIVE turnovers that game.  You don't think Ty Law (or Rodney Harrison, who forced the other two turnovers) are important?  You don't think that Brady benefitted from their presence?

 

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You'd have to be a moron to not realize that the SB against the Rams was all about keeping the Rams Offense off the field and not turning the ball over. Once the Pats got the lead, that game plan really took over.

The MVP went to Brady because 1. he is a QB, 2. because of the last drive, and because 3. other than the INT (which was early in the game) Law didn't really stand out.

The A. Harris strip on Proehl to set up Brady's TD and Otis Smith's 3rd quarter pick to set up the field goal to go up 17-3 were just as big as Law's play. If Law was involved in either of those turnovers, he probably would have won the MVP.

 

Look at the other 2 SB's and it is hard to argue Brady's place in the NFL, not necessarly in Fantasy Football.

New England...Att....Comp....Yds.....TD....Int

Brady..............48.......32.......354.....3......1

Brady..............23.......33.......236.....2......0

 

Then, take the fact that in the 5 years Manning has been in the postseason, he has had his worst statistical performance of the entire year in a post season game in 4 of those 5 years.

Let Manning keep chucking TDs during the season, because a different brand of football is played in the post season.

Edited June 3, 2005 by charty

[Bill Swerski]

Furd -

 

My advice is don't reply to Swerski's idiotic posts.  He knows very little, but he seems to have alot of free time on his hands.  I guess other than flossing his tooth, he has very little to do each day.  He's an inbred slow and an ignoramus.  Other than that, he's not a bad guy,

 

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Funny how an inbred knows how to spell and form a complete sentence.

[Furd]

Furd -

 

My advice is don't reply to Swerski's idiotic posts.  He knows very little, but he seems to have alot of free time on his hands.  I guess other than flossing his tooth, he has very little to do each day.  He's an inbred slow and an ignoramus.  Other than that, he's not a bad guy,

 

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Actually, he made some good points. I just didn't like the way he made them.

[Bill Swerski]

You'd have to be a moron to not realize that the SB against the Rams was all about keeping the Rams Offense off the field and not turning the ball over.

 

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Yes, and one way of keeping the Rams off the field was by dropping 7 defenders back into coverage and picking off Warner, which they did twice. Great defensive play won the game, not Brady.

 

The MVP went to Brady because 1. he is a QB, 2. because of the last drive, and because 3. other than the INT (which was early in the game) Law didn't really stand out.

 

 

Point (1) isn't a valid excuse. Defensive players get SB MVPs all of the time. Point (3) is ridiculous. How could Law NOT stand out in the game? He completely shut down Isaac Bruce and scored half of his team's TDs.

[Clubfoothead]

I like Swerski, he's got moxy.

 

The crayons line was excellent; however. Furd makes me laugh.

[Vet]

Funny how an inbred knows how to spell and form a complete sentence. 

 

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The Huddle automatically replaces the word r-e-t-a-r-d with "slow". Insert r-e-t-a-r-d in place of s-l-o-w, and you'll see that it's not only a complete sentence, but an accurate one.

[Clubfoothead]

The Huddle automatically replaces the word r-e-t-a-r-d with "slow".  Insert r-e-t-a-r-d in place of s-l-o-w, and you'll see that it's not only a complete sentence, but an accurate one.

 

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Carl strikes again. I hate that f*cker.

[charty]

Yes, and one way of keeping the Rams off the field was by dropping 7 defenders back into coverage and picking off Warner, which they did twice.  Great defensive play won the game, not Brady.

Point (1) isn't a valid excuse.  Defensive players get SB MVPs all of the time.  Point (3) is ridiculous.  How could Law NOT stand out in the game?  He completely shut down Isaac Bruce and scored half of his team's TDs.

 

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Let me clarify, I will speak a little slower for you.

 

Law.....

- When the other 2 turnovers which resulted in points were just as big as the Law turnover, which you can credit to Vrabel for smacking Warner while he was throwing it.

- The good football fan would notice that he shut down Bruce, but would voters?

- Rams receivers - Hakim, Bruce, and Holt all caught exactly 5 passes, and Law didn't shut down everyone, right? The defensive effort was noticed, not Laws, so votes might have been spread around the Defense.

 

How can Palmiro be voted the Gold Glove (by players and coaches no less) when he played 90% of his games as the DH?

If you are going to be pissed about the voting system, then ignore it.

Just look at the fact that Brady is 3-0 in the Superbowl, and 9-0 overall in the playoffs.

[Bill Swerski]

The Huddle automatically replaces the word r-e-t-a-r-d with "slow".  Insert r-e-t-a-r-d in place of s-l-o-w, and you'll see that it's not only a complete sentence, but an accurate one.

 

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So, you don't proofread and are unaware that "a lot" is improperly spelled as one word? Yet, I'm the inbred slow? Got it.

Edited June 3, 2005 by Bill Swerski

[Bill Swerski]

Let me clarify, I will speak a little slower for you.

 

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Looks like uglytuna's little brother has joined.

[Vet]

Looks like uglytuna's little brother has joined. 

 

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Yes, it does.

 

And his name is Bill Swerski.