MikesVikes Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 (edited) Manning came off a huge record setting season, where he lit up the league with 4500 yards and 49 tds. He was good enough last season to remain the 2nd best FF QB for the year. In the last six years he's been the 4th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 2nd, and 2nd best in producing FF QB points. Culpepper set a record of his own last season. His 4700 passing yards and 400 rushing yards added together set a league record for most combined yards by a QB. In the five seasons that he has started, Culpepper has ranked #1 in FF production by a QB in four of those years. So which do you take in your draft if given the choice? Will Manning have an even better season this year? He will need to if Culpepper keeps his pace without Moss. Edited July 4, 2005 by MikesVikes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 (edited) I don't see Manning duplicating that year, although I think he will have the most TD passes and yards again. Culpepper's running is the bonus that normally puts him over the top for me. Without Moss though, he stands to slip a little. Given the weapons at WR, I have to go with Manning. Edit: I won't get either of them as I usually find my QB in the middle rounds. Hello Carson Palmer Edited July 4, 2005 by Puddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keys Myaths Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Ugh, you take Manning. It's not even close, homer. Culpepper with Moss last year: 2.72 TD/game Culpepper without Moss: 1.8 TD/game Peyton all year: 3.03 TD/game And yards follow the same spread. I feel like this post is needed in about 5 different places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Ugh, you take Manning. It's not even close, homer. Culpepper with Moss last year: 2.72 TD/game Culpepper without Moss: 1.8 TD/game Peyton all year: 3.03 TD/game And yards follow the same spread. I feel like this post is needed in about 5 different places. 864227[/snapback] If fantasy football was only about passing TD's you'd be right. However C'Pep had 485 yards rushing and 3 rushing TD's to Manning's 46 yards and 1 TD. In one of my run-of-the-mill performance leagues Manning scored 548.8 points while Culpepper scored 515.1. It is a lot closer than you let on. 2 points a game different and that with Manning throwing more touchdowns than anyone in the history of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Toss up though Manning is a consistent great score at QB. Culpepper is a keeper for me in one league and I actually think he will do as well without Moss as with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keys Myaths Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 (edited) If fantasy football was only about passing TD's you'd be right. However C'Pep had 485 yards rushing and 3 rushing TD's to Manning's 46 yards and 1 TD. In one of my run-of-the-mill performance leagues Manning scored 548.8 points while Culpepper scored 515.1. It is a lot closer than you let on. 2 points a game different and that with Manning throwing more touchdowns than anyone in the history of the game. 864232[/snapback] That wasn't the point of the post. It was the difference with Moss and without. Manning beat Culpepper with Moss...now with a touchdown a game less...it's not going to be close. Edited July 4, 2005 by Keys Myaths Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 That wasn't the point of the post. It was the difference with Moss and without. Manning beat Culpepper with Moss...now with a touchdown a game less...it's not going to be cloase. 864240[/snapback] You are right. If your stats are correct and hold true, it shouldn't be that close. Big question is will someone step-up to fill the void left by Moss (or close to it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Manning is the safer choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keys Myaths Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 You are right. If your stats are correct and hold true, it shouldn't be that close. Big question is will someone step-up to fill the void left by Moss (or close to it). 864242[/snapback] After all that... I think Burleson will make up half the difference. To me, part of the problem was the offense relied on Moss, and now that they can't, they'll adjust. But I don't think it will make up all of the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffian Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 C Pep may use his legs more this year, so he may get a few more touchdowns on his own. Manning is still the best--period--but I think Culpepper will be better than everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 I won't be given the choice because I won't draft either in the 1st or 2nd round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikesVikes Posted July 4, 2005 Author Share Posted July 4, 2005 (edited) On the With Moss and Without Moss stats, does that include the games he played (?) while he was injured? He wasn't himself for much of the year, yet Culpepper had his best season. It's not being a homer if one player has consistently the top scorer in all but one season. Yes Manning will be at the top each and every season, including this one. I don't see Culpepper not being there, however. In one of my leagues, Manning would've outscored Culpepper had he played the final week. So you could say that Manning had the opportunity to outscore CPep on his finest hour. It's a matter of Manning duplicating last year's performance or Culpepper doing it without Moss. Obviously both players will be at the top at the end of the season unless injured. CPep has been the top producer in 4 of 5 years and Manning has been 2nd - 4th in most of his years. With Edge going as the 3rd or 4th best back in the league, it seems like people are expecting carries from him as well. The Colts will have to score 65 Tds to keep both Edge and Manning as the top at their positions. I think that it is closer than you think. Edited July 4, 2005 by MikesVikes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgcoach Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Even if Burly steps up, Manning is still my choice if I had it to make. Manning will not repeat last year; who could? I would still wager Manning comes out on top of CPep. Too many weapons in Indy for him to succeed, and me to bet against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABearWithFurniture Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Another factor to consider...who's missed more time due to injuries over the past 4-5 years...that one's not close at all... With Moss gone, I have to believe that Culp will take matters into his own hands more and run the ball/or stay in the pocket longer...thus increasing his injury chances... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS Miscreant Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 I won't be given the choice because I won't draft either in the 1st or 2nd round. 864256[/snapback] Tru dat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 I wouldn't draft either because they come to high, IMO. That said, if I were to take one of them it would be Manning. Lower injury risk, more steady performance, kept his #1 WR - just less risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keys Myaths Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 On the With Moss and Without Moss stats, does that include the games he played (?) while he was injured? He wasn't himself for much of the year, yet Culpepper had his best season. 864261[/snapback] No, they don't include those games. The reason is because Moss was still on the field, which always changes the dynamic of the game (remember, he still caught TD passes in most of those games). As for the Edge comment, I'm not a fan. I think Manning takes away too many touchdowns from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sox Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 Manning is an easy choice, for me at least. Yes Culpepper is a much better runner. He is also a much better fumbler.He has double the amount of fumbles Manning has,in two less years as a starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major-tom Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 No, they don't include those games. The reason is because Moss was still on the field, which always changes the dynamic of the game (remember, he still caught TD passes in most of those games). 864354[/snapback] Correct me if I'm wrong, but Moss only played 12 of 16 games last year, and really didn't do much in a few of those 12 that he did play. He was only in a total of 92 plays which ranks #45 for WRs. http://www.thehuddle.com/stats/2004/std-playswr03.php It's amazing that he was still able to score 13 TDs in the plays he was in and you're right about how he changes the game when he is on the field. Almost as impressive though is the year that Culpepper had only having Moss on the field for 92 of his 638 plays. That's only 14.4% of Culpeppers total plays. http://www.thehuddle.com/stats/2004/std-playsqb03.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chargerz Posted July 4, 2005 Share Posted July 4, 2005 I can't see going against Manning as the better pick. Indy will put up alot of points again this year, and Manning will, of course, be a HUGE part of that!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedroz13 Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 As much as I would like to take Culpepper, if they are both available to me I would take Manning. I think Culpepper will have a great year sans Moss, but its definitely a question mark. Manning didn't lose much in the off-season at all (still has Edge, Marvin, Wayne), so he is the safer choice. Maybe you could draft Manning and trade him off for Culpepper and a 3rd WR or something like that, but you can't take Culpepper ahead of Manning I don't think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Furley Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Another factor to consider...who's missed more time due to injuries over the past 4-5 years...that one's not close at all... With Moss gone, I have to believe that Culp will take matters into his own hands more and run the ball/or stay in the pocket longer...thus increasing his injury chances... 864282[/snapback] You raised a good point. I didn't really think about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Manning. Do I even need to explain? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keys Myaths Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Correct me if I'm wrong, but Moss only played 12 of 16 games last year, and really didn't do much in a few of those 12 that he did play. He was only in a total of 92 plays which ranks #45 for WRs. http://www.thehuddle.com/stats/2004/std-playswr03.phpIt's amazing that he was still able to score 13 TDs in the plays he was in and you're right about how he changes the game when he is on the field. Almost as impressive though is the year that Culpepper had only having Moss on the field for 92 of his 638 plays. That's only 14.4% of Culpeppers total plays. http://www.thehuddle.com/stats/2004/std-playsqb03.php 864388[/snapback] That's not the point. The threat of Moss was more helpful to Culpepper than Moss himself was. The defenses felt like they had to double/triple team him...which left everyone else open. That's where Culpepper shined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikesVikes Posted July 5, 2005 Author Share Posted July 5, 2005 As much as I would like to take Culpepper, if they are both available to me I would take Manning. I think Culpepper will have a great year sans Moss, but its definitely a question mark. Manning didn't lose much in the off-season at all (still has Edge, Marvin, Wayne), so he is the safer choice. Maybe you could draft Manning and trade him off for Culpepper and a 3rd WR or something like that, but you can't take Culpepper ahead of Manning I don't think. 864568[/snapback] That's exactly what I see happening. I'd be very happy to trade Manning for Culpepper plus an upgrade at either RB or WR. Drafting Manning as early as 1.04 makes that impossible IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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