Drywall / Basement question

[chiefjay]

Ok, here's the situation. I have an older Colonial with what they call a Michigan Basement, not really built to finish but I am going to do my best to make it at least half way finished and look as best as possible. (Trying to sell this spring)

 

The walls on 3 sides of the soon to be finished portion will be the old concrete which had the old paint, etc...that I chipped / scraped off yesterday (nasty) but still have some to do. The other wall will be the wall we build to separate the two sides of the basement, obviously it will be drywall with two doors to access the other side.

 

Anyways, the concrete walls are not in terrible shape but not in great shape either.

 

I can prime and paint (with or without spackle) and I think it will look ok maybe but as I was doing the scrapeing (sp?) and clearing of old garbage, wood, etc... I thought about drywalling over the concrete walls. Obviously I couldn't screw into the concrete, at least not easily so I was thinking about using Caulk and caulking the crap out of it to stick to the concrete and then taping and mudding of course.

 

Is that an option? Will the caulk adhere well to the concrete?

 

Thanks, Jay

[NSab]

I don't think so. You have to put ferring strips up first. then attach the drywall to them.

 

 

 

At least.

Edited January 16, 2006 by NSab

[Hugh 0ne]

If you want to drywall, you'll have to frame out the entire basement, and then attach the drywall to the frame. That's the right way to do it. This will also offer you the opportunity to do some insullation if you so chose. This will also give you the chance to put in lighting and other hookups as well. Since you're just doing the walls, it shouldn't be that big of a job.

Edited January 16, 2006 by Hugh 0ne

[NSab]

If you want to drywall, you'll have to frame out the entire basement, and then attach the drywall to the frame. That's the right way to do it. This will also offer you the opportunity to do some insullation if you so chose.

 

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That's why I said at least

[darin3]

If you want to drywall, you'll have to frame out the entire basement, and then attach the drywall to the frame. That's the right way to do it. This will also offer you the opportunity to do some insullation if you so chose. This will also give you the chance to put in lighting and other hookups as well. Since you're just doing the walls, it shouldn't be that big of a job.

 

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Good info here. Might as well do it up right!

[yo mama]

First off, caulk isn't nearly adhesive enough to use for that purpose. Second, you'd never ever want to "glue" drywall to a concrete wall. NSab is correct: you'll want to use concrete anchors to effective bolt/nail some 2x4s to the concrete wall first. You can measure and space them at least four feet apart (measuring from the center of the 2x4), but every 24 inches is the "right" way to do it. Then you can hang the dry wall using drywall screws directly onto the 2x4s. Texture and paint to your heart's content.

 

The main reason you'd want to do it this way is that now you can get the sheetrock off whenever you want to. If any of the sheetrock got damaged, it'd be a lot easier to access and replace. Glue it to the wall, and damaged sheet rock would be miserable to deal with.

 

This will also give you an opportunity to run some electrical wire behind the sheet rock for outlets, light switches, or if you want to get fancy, plumbing. If you space the 2x4s purposefully, you could also build some cabinets, shelving, etc to be attached to the wall if you wanted to.

Edited January 16, 2006 by yo mama

[Brewer]

If you want to drywall, you'll have to frame out the entire basement, and then attach the drywall to the frame. That's the right way to do it. This will also offer you the opportunity to do some insullation if you so chose. This will also give you the chance to put in lighting and other hookups as well. Since you're just doing the walls, it shouldn't be that big of a job.

 

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Good info. I assume that the walls are below grade. Are they damp? Check your local building code to see if a vapor barrier is required. Mine does. Not hard to do, just place the poly against the wall before you frame. Good luck.

[ChuckB]

Typically when you frame a wall you put the 2 x 4s 16in on center but you could do 24in on center. You can probably use a Hilti gun to attach the 2 x 4s directly to the wall. This gun uses 22 caliber charges (I think) to shoot nails into concrete, and If you can use this you could save some time and wood by laying the 2 x 4s flat agains the wall every 24in and shoot them that way. Just be careful you measure properly from the corners or the edges of your drywall won't line up correctly, two pieces should meet on one 2 x 4. You could rent a Hilti gun at any rental center. I'm no pro but I have done it this way once and it worked out nicely. Good luck on finishing it and on selling it cause if it's anything like around here selling a house is very difficult right now.

[NSab]

Typically when you frame a wall you put the 2 x 4s 16in on center but you could do 24in on center. You can probably use a Hilti gun to attach the 2 x 4s directly to the wall. This gun uses 22 caliber charges (I think) to shoot nails into concrete, and If you can use this you could save some time and wood by laying the 2 x 4s flat agains the wall every 24in and shoot them that way. Just be careful you measure properly from the corners or the edges of your drywall won't line up correctly, two pieces should meet on one 2 x 4. You could rent a Hilti gun at any rental center. I'm no pro but I have done it this way once and it worked out nicely. Good luck on finishing it and on selling it cause if it's anything like around here selling a house is very difficult right now.

 

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I don't know what shape the wall is in, but make sure everything is level!

[yo mama]

I don't know what shape the wall is in, but make sure everything is level!

 

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Good point.

[NSab]

You still with us here Chief?

[Hat Trick]

Second, you'd never ever want to "glue" drywall to a concrete wall. 

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Can you tell me why, other than the obvious reasons. I pretty much HAD to do this for one whole wall in my basement. If I didn't, I couldn't put the other walls where I needed to, to be able to move furniture down into the room. I know using ferring strips is recommended, but I didn't use them. It turned out great and nobody has a clue.

[rajncajn]

Speaking of which, Bunz, I need to talk to you on AIM ASAP.

[NSab]

Bunz is the expert, listen to her!

[yo mama]

Can you tell me why, other than the obvious reasons.

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Mainly because if you ever have to get back there again it would be a huge pain to deal with. Water damage to the sheet rock would be a mess to deal with. And, God forbid, if you ever had to get back there to check out the concrete itself (foundation problems, cracks, leaks, etc.) you'd have zero access.

 

And even if the corners of the sheet rock didn't exactly meet, you could still float and tape the intersection. No one would ever know that one of the pieces of sheet rock extended another inch or two.

[NSab]

Glueing is about the worst idea, I have ever heard.

[yo mama]

Glueing is about the worst idea, I have ever heard.

 

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It's a fast, effective, cheap, low-tech way of finishing off the wall. But I'd never do it.

[ChuckB]

I don't know what shape the wall is in, but make sure everything is level!

 

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Tru

[rajncajn]

Bunz will be delivering her dissertation soon.

[NSab]

It'll be long, but good!

Edited January 16, 2006 by NSab

[Jimmy Neutron]

I don't think so. You have to put ferring strips up first. then attach the drywall to them.

At least.

 

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Yup - that's what I did on one wall - found it easier to just build a traditional frame and lose a couple of inches on the others.

[chiefjay]

You still with us here Chief?

 

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Yes, I'm here. Waiting on Bunz's reply but everyone makes a lot of sense. I guess I was trying to go the easy way out.

 

By the way Chuck I live in the same city as you do.

 

Level huh? Never heard of the word.

[ChuckB]

Yes, I'm here.   Waiting on Bunz's reply but everyone makes a lot of sense.  I guess I was trying to go the easy way out.  

 

By the way Chuck I live in the same city as you do.  

 

Level huh?   Never heard of the word.  

 

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So I've heard through the family grapevine

Edited January 16, 2006 by ChuckB

[SteelBunz]

Quite honestly.....I'd go with a less invasive method than shooting concrete screws into your walls. I'm going to assume your ceiling is open or it can be opened up in the basement.

 

What is wrong with building the framed walls then tilting them into place? It will take a little banging home to snug them into place....then use your charges to secure the bottom plate to the floor. Then use a metal strap system from the top plate and connect to the ceiling joists. You could even use decking joist hangers turned over....be creative here. Then...drywall it and finish the ceiling.

 

True......you are essentially losing about 4 inches of "floor space" all the way around the perimeter of the room using this method.....but any method used, you will lose floor space.

 

I can honestly say, in this case, I'm not sure of codes in your area..but I think people court disasterous water damage and possibly eventual foundation damage shooting holes into their basement walls. And all for the sake of a "finished basement" that they cannot advertise as a finished basement for the purposes of resale. No egress window....then you can't add the basement square footage as living space for the purposes of selling the house.

 

With this method.....use the 16"OC....instead of 24"OC. Stiffer "freestanding" wall structure. 2x4's are the most likely source....perfect for R-13 insulation if you need it. But you could explore other dimensions of wood to cut down on the loss of floor space if you wanted to....2X2's IF you can find some very straight ones.

 

 

Just my $.02 worth....maybe a structural engineer or architech will be along to help more.

 

Also.....by "caulk"....I think you really meant construction adhesive. Here's a good rule to live by for anyone trying to make their house more presentable to a buyer's market: If you wanted to change something about the house....how difficult have the previous owners made it to change? ie...wallpaper....vinyl adhesive on concrete.....texturing a wall alfresco style....drywall glued on concrete. If I were a buyer.....those things would break a deal faster than a paint color I didn't like.

[ChuckB]

Quite honestly.....I'd go with a less invasive method than shooting concrete screws into your walls.  I'm going to assume your ceiling is open or it can be opened up in the basement.

 

What is wrong with building the framed walls then tilting them into place?  It will take a little banging home to snug them into place....then use your charges to secure the bottom plate to the floor.  Then use a metal strap system from the top plate and connect to the ceiling joists.  You could even use decking joist hangers turned over....be creative here.  Then...drywall it and finish the ceiling.

 

True......you are essentially losing about 4 inches of "floor space" all the way around the perimeter of the room using this method.....but any method used, you will lose floor space.

 

I can honestly say, in this case, I'm not sure of codes in your area..but I think people court disasterous water damage and possibly eventual foundation damage shooting holes into their basement walls.   And all for the sake of a "finished basement" that they cannot advertise as a finished basement for the purposes of resale.  No egress window....then you can't add the basement square footage as living space for the purposes of selling the house.

 

With this method.....use the 16"OC....instead of 24"OC.  Stiffer "freestanding" wall structure.  2x4's are the most likely source....perfect for R-13 insulation if you need it.  But you could explore other dimensions of wood to cut down on the loss of floor space if you wanted to....2X2's IF you can find some very straight ones.

Just my $.02 worth....maybe a structural engineer or architech will be along to help more.

 

Also.....by "caulk"....I think you really meant construction adhesive.  Here's a good rule to live by for anyone trying to make their house more presentable to a buyer's market:  If you wanted to change something about the house....how difficult have the previous owners made it to change?  ie...wallpaper....vinyl adhesive on concrete.....texturing a wall alfresco style....drywall glued on concrete.  If I were a buyer.....those things would break a deal faster than a paint color I didn't like.

 

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Definitely the traditional way to do it, and I agree, but in the interest of saving wood and floor space in a half basement I thought the other may be a way to go, as far as damaging the walls I don't believe a nail driven into the concrete an inch or so would do much damage but I could be wrong, like I said I am not a pro, and the one time I did it this way it was above ground in an office. The three basements I've helped frame were all done traditionaly. Good info Bunz