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yet you believe in the death penalty...hmmm

 

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:D Spain actually isnt a fan of the death penalty

 

:D s remember an old thread from puddy that said read first page of a thread and last page and the topic is night and day

Edited by whomper

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we are talking about what they do with another human being.  Dont you liberals get it?  The unborn baby is not just another part of mother like a spleen or a wisdom tooth.  It is a seperate and distinct human being who simply has a parasitic relationship to its mother.  So, quit acting like murdering the baby is simply the mother doing something with her own body.

 

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you're stating your conclusion as argument, and just passing right over complex ethical distinctions in the process.

 

to illustrate this, i would like to ask you, spain, when EXACTLY does life begin? is it the moment the egg is fertilized?

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are we talking about eunichs now?

 

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i'm never going down that path again!

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:D Spain actually isnt a fan of the death penalty

 

 

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thanks for the data big jo.... oh, sorry ... whomp.

 

i think spain favors a lifetime of torture vs. the death penalty ...

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you're stating your conclusion as argument, and just passing right over complex ethical distinctions in the process. 

 

to illustrate this, i would like to ask you, spain, when EXACTLY does life begin?  is it the moment the egg is fertilized?

 

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I would argue its when the bar tab gets paid...

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:D s remember an old thread from puddy that said read first page of a thread and last page and the topic is night and day

 

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:D

 

I thought about that after I posted my one half-way legimate post here.

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you're stating your conclusion as argument, and just passing right over complex ethical distinctions in the process. 

 

to illustrate this, i would like to ask you, spain, when EXACTLY does life begin?  is it the moment the egg is fertilized?

 

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That I am not sure. But its certainly not at birth. And the child is certainly "alive" during the first tri-mester as any parent who has had an ultra sound done can tell you.

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Why?  Who decided that the life of the mother is worth more than the life of the fetus?

 

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Why exactly does the mothers life "trump" that of the baby?

 

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Our Founding Fathers, government, legislatures, citizens, courts and society?

 

What country do you live in? If you think I am wrong, why dont you explain some of the rights of the fetus in America to all of us, please.

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So, if you believe its wrong to legalize the murder of unborn children, you are retarded?  More elitest stupidity from the left ladies and gentlemen...

 

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You mean, elitist, right?

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That I am not sure. 

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oh so you're not really sure. just sure enough to want politicians and judges to decide exactly where that line is and to call people who decide for themselves murderers?

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Our Founding Fathers, government, legislatures, citizens, courts and society?

 

What country do you live in? If you think I am wrong, why dont you explain some of the rights of the fetus in America to all of us, please.

 

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So are you saying that if the government suddenly says feti have rights then you will change your stance to agreeing with society that abortion should be banned?

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For the record, when my wife gave birth a few months ago there were a few sketchy moments and I have no doubt that if it had come down to the doctors giving me a decision to save my wife versus saving the baby, I would have chosen for them to save my wife.

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So are you saying that if the government suddenly says feti have rights then you will change your stance to agreeing with society that abortion should be banned?

 

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no because according to skins, the founding fathers intended to grant an inalienable right to abortion. which, frankly, is even dumber than spain's argument.

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oh so you're not really sure.  just sure enough to want politicians and judges to decide exactly where that line is and to call people who decide for themselves murderers?

 

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it is reasonable for politicians and judges to decide that since it cannot be determined for sure, as a society, we will choose to err on the side that it is and then act to protect that life, especially as the pregnancy gets further and further along.

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For the record, when my wife gave birth a few months ago there were a few sketchy moments and I have no doubt that if it had come down to the doctors giving me a decision to save my wife versus saving the baby, I would have chosen for them to save my wife.

 

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completely different discussion.

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Our Founding Fathers, government, legislatures, citizens, courts and society?

 

What country do you live in? If you think I am wrong, why dont you explain some of the rights of the fetus in America to all of us, please.

 

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Well, the founding fathers never addressed abortion and if they had, you would not have liked their stance. No unfortunately, we have had liberal asspipes like skins in gobment who think killing innocent children is somehow a mothers right. The same sort of jack asses who now think fetuses had no legal rights, used to think blacks had no rights.

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So are you saying that if the government suddenly says feti have rights then you will change your stance to agreeing with society that abortion should be banned?

 

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In that scenario, I would not personally agree that it was proper under the Constitution and the freedoms our country was founded under, and I would think it an incredibly invasive governmental position, but of course I would abide by the law.

 

Again, that would make our government like that of totalitarian China. It will never happen because too many Americans understand the proper limitations on government intrusion into the private lives of US citizens.

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completely different discussion.

 

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no it isn't considering that we were just debating whether the mother or the child had a greater "rights". Taken to the extreme this easily forces the question of who has the "right" to live if a choice must be made.

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In that scenario, I would not personally agree that it was proper under the Constitution and the freedoms our country was founded under, and I would think it an incredibly invasive governmental position, but of course I would abide by the law.

 

Again, that would make our government like that of totalitarian China. It will never happen because too many Americans understand the proper limitations on government intrusion into the private lives of US citizens.

 

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How much more intrusive can they get than allowing slaughter of innocent unborn children?

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no because according to skins, the founding fathers intended to grant an inalienable right to abortion.  which, frankly, is even dumber than spain's argument.

 

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That is idiotic and beneath even you. But the Founding Fathers did define who were citizens and who had rights in this country, and those definitions have been expanded over the years. Someone please point me to where they were expanded to include the fetus.

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no it isn't considering that we were just debating whether the mother or the child had a greater "rights".  Taken to the extreme this easily forces the question of who has the "right" to live if a choice must be made.

 

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it does not force that question. in an abortion, the mother's life is not in danger.

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In that scenario, I would not personally agree that it was proper under the Constitution and the freedoms our country was founded under, and I would think it an incredibly invasive governmental position, but of course I would abide by the law.

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Assuming that you would continue to voice your opinion abortion should be legal, this position seems to pretty similar to the anti-abortion people today (excluding the nutjob abortion-clinic bombers). The exception being that the anti-abortion people today claim that allowing abortion is a terrible allowance by the government to let some people kill other people.

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That is idiotic and beneath even you. But the Founding Fathers did define who were citizens and who had rights in this country, and those definitions have been expanded over the years. Someone please point me to where they were expanded to include the fetus.

 

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Wow! You make the same arguements southerners made when abolitionists wanted to free the negros and give them full citizenship!

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That is idiotic and beneath even you. But the Founding Fathers did define who were citizens and who had rights in this country, and those definitions have been expanded over the years. Someone please point me to where they were expanded to include the fetus.

 

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For the 1 billionth time, CITIZENSHIP HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. An American citizen is not allowed to murder wife just because she isn't a citizen. We have been over this numerous times before and you always admit that I am right, but yet for some reason you keep using the same argument.

Edited by wiegie

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oh so you're not really sure.  just sure enough to want politicians and judges to decide exactly where that line is and to call people who decide for themselves murderers?

 

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No, I told you, I disagree with Roe v Wade. Judges made the call on that one. Lets make abortion illegal and that question wont ever have to be answered.

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