Ben Wallace to the Bulls

[Goopster24]

Well done Goopster Well done!

I hope you are able to enjoy watching Thomas play up there for years to come. He WILL be fun to watch. We here in LSU country miss him already. I'm from Chicago and was able to watch all the great championship runs and I really believe you are on the verge of seeing another such run!

 

 

At first I was sorta low on him but I am starting to get excited for him. I trust Paxson's eye because he has had some excellent drafts. I'm also glad that Tyrus can be brought up slowly now. It should be a fun few years ahead of us.

[Sgt. Ryan]

Hey, don't take it from me. Take it from the scouting reports:

 

Link

 

 

 

Amare Stoudemire was CollegeBasketballNews.com top senior and he decided to enter the draft straight out of high school. He is a powerful inside player who uses his strength well. Stoudemire needs to expand his offensive game, but he is a likely late lottery or mid first round pick.

 

 

 

 

 

Im sorry but expanding an offensive game, powerful inside player, is hardly limited offensive skills.

 

Dirk Nowitski expanded his offensive game this past season, but few would call him a limited offensive player. Tyrus is 6-8, 217, Stoudamire is 6'10, 245 lbs. And Tyrus is no Stoudamire on the court either. Not even close. Completely rediculous statement, and basically ruined whatever credability you have about the subject. And since when is 6'10, 245 and undersized 4.

Edited July 6, 2006 by Sgt. Ryan

[Sgt. Ryan]

At first I was sorta low on him but I am starting to get excited for him. I trust Paxson's eye because he has had some excellent drafts. I'm also glad that Tyrus can be brought up slowly now. It should be a fun few years ahead of us.

 

 

 

How hard is it to draft well when you pick so high every year. In the past 6 yrs the Bulls have drafted in the top 10 - 7 times, and 5 of those were in the top 5.

 

Im sorry, but I dont see the great drafting eye you are speaking of. First off the best player on the board at 1.4 was Brandon Roy, and you needed a scorer who is comparable to Ray Allen, not a project who plays the same position as Ben Wallace or Tyson Chandler before that.

 

2006 - 1.4 Tyrus Thomas - via trade for 1.2 Alderidge

2005 - no picks

2004 - Ben Gordon at 1.3, Deng at 1.7

2003 - Kik Hinrich at 1.7 over Josh Howard, oops

2002 - Jay Williams at 1.2 who is out of the league, and couldnt play when he wasnt hurt, over Amare Soudamire, big oops

2001 - Tyson Chandler at 1.2, Eddy Curry at 1.4 for Elton Brand, lmao

[wildcat2334]

Major upgrade for da Bulls- period, their D will only get better, they have probably the best perimeter D in the L. Kirk plays GREAT perimeter D, so does Duhon, Noccioni- underrated, and improving each year throw in Ty Thomas?? this team is alot better than Cle.-period. as of now- east looks like............

 

1- Miami

2a- Det- aging & falling

2b- Chi

4- Cle/Wash

 

Thomas will be a STUD- with the uptempo, drive & kick game- Ben will be just fine. Paxson is filling out a nice roster- which will be even better after next years draft.

 

They are missing a 6'6 type scorer- although Gordon is becoming instant O, and they now will be able to play even smaller with Big Ben. Great signing- only 4 years? perfek.

[tbimm]

Major upgrade for da Bulls- period, their D will only get better, they have probably the best perimeter D in the L. Kirk plays GREAT perimeter D, so does Duhon, Noccioni- underrated, and improving each year throw in Ty Thomas?? this team is alot better than Cle.-period. as of now- east looks like............

 

1- Miami

2a- Det- aging & falling

2b- Chi

4- Cle/Wash

 

Thomas will be a STUD- with the uptempo, drive & kick game- Ben will be just fine. Paxson is filling out a nice roster- which will be even better after next years draft.

 

They are missing a 6'6 type scorer- although Gordon is becoming instant O, and they now will be able to play even smaller with Big Ben. Great signing- only 4 years? perfek.

 

Sarge?

[Sgt. Ryan]

Sarge?

 

 

Who is aging on Detoit? it was the 2 Wallace, and one is no longer there.

 

We can argue until we are blue in the face, but this time next yr Chicago will be talking about the hype of the Knicks pick they will own, instead of baskeball accomplishments.

[Goopster24]

Amare Stoudemire was CollegeBasketballNews.com top senior and he decided to enter the draft straight out of high school. He is a powerful inside player who uses his strength well. Stoudemire needs to expand his offensive game, but he is a likely late lottery or mid first round pick.

Im sorry but expanding an offensive game, powerful inside player, is hardly limited offensive skills.

 

Dirk Nowitski expanded his offensive game this past season, but few would call him a limited offensive player. Tyrus is 6-8, 217, Stoudamire is 6'10, 245 lbs. And Tyrus is no Stoudamire on the court either. Not even close. Completely rediculous statement, and basically ruined whatever credability you have about the subject. And since when is 6'10, 245 and undersized 4.

 

 

Amare isn't 6'10''. The scouting reports are very similar. Obviously the strength isn't there for Tyrus but they both are explosive finishers with good inside game. And Tyrus has more of a long-range shot than Amare.

[Goopster24]

How hard is it to draft well when you pick so high every year. In the past 6 yrs the Bulls have drafted in the top 10 - 7 times, and 5 of those were in the top 5.

 

Im sorry, but I dont see the great drafting eye you are speaking of. First off the best player on the board at 1.4 was Brandon Roy, and you needed a scorer who is comparable to Ray Allen, not a project who plays the same position as Ben Wallace or Tyson Chandler before that.

 

2006 - 1.4 Tyrus Thomas - via trade for 1.2 Alderidge

2005 - no picks

2004 - Ben Gordon at 1.3, Deng at 1.7

2003 - Kik Hinrich at 1.7 over Josh Howard, oops

2002 - Jay Williams at 1.2 who is out of the league, and couldnt play when he wasnt hurt, over Amare Soudamire, big oops

2001 - Tyson Chandler at 1.2, Eddy Curry at 1.4 for Elton Brand, lmao

 

 

 

First of all, 2001 and 2002 were not Paxson so throw those out. Then 2003, they needed to draft a point guard because of Jay's injury and Hinrich has turned out to be an awesome player, one of the best young point guards in the league. Josh Howard was picked at the bottom of the draft so everyone passed up on him. No one can criticize Paxson for that. 2004, Ben Gordon is a great scorer with obvious limited defensive skills. He will hopefully learn to become more consistent. Deng is again someone who has the most potential of the returning Bulls to explode. The guy is awesome and has a great all around game.

 

I definitely wanted Brandon Roy more so than Tyrus but I can see what Paxson drafted him. The guy is a freak athletically and Paxson wants to build a defensive oriented team that is athletic. Paxson knew he needed another big man and Tyrus was arguably the best one available. Brandon Roy is awesome and I think he will be awesome but I think Paxson has done an excellent job drafting. You can say all you want that they have had high draft picks, but what have teams like Toronto or Atlanta done with them? Exactly.

[Sgt. Ryan]

Amare isn't 6'10''. The scouting reports are very similar. Obviously the strength isn't there for Tyrus but they both are explosive finishers with good inside game. And Tyrus has more of a long-range shot than Amare.

 

 

 

I guess every source on teh web is wrong.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3607

 

 

I had to save this post, as its as idiotic as anything I have read in the 7 yrs Ive been here. Tyrus couldnt carry Amare's jock, and will never be half the player he is.

[Goopster24]

I guess every source on teh web is wrong.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3607

I had to save this post, as its as idiotic as anything I have read in the 7 yrs Ive been here. Tyrus couldnt carry Amare's jock, and will never be half the player he is.

 

 

What is the link for? His height? NBA teams list up for the most part...And I never said Tyrus is gonna be Amare. All I'm saying is their scouting reports look very similar. It happens a lot (players being compared to others in the league) and sometimes it pans out and is correct. People are already comparing Randy Foye to Wade's scouting report. Who knows what will happen; that's the fun of sports.

[Sgt. Ryan]

First of all, 2001 and 2002 were not Paxson so throw those out. Then 2003, they needed to draft a point guard because of Jay's injury and Hinrich has turned out to be an awesome player, one of the best young point guards in the league. Josh Howard was picked at the bottom of the draft so everyone passed up on him. No one can criticize Paxson for that. 2004, Ben Gordon is a great scorer with obvious limited defensive skills. He will hopefully learn to become more consistent. Deng is again someone who has the most potential of the returning Bulls to explode. The guy is awesome and has a great all around game.

 

I definitely wanted Brandon Roy more so than Tyrus but I can see what Paxson drafted him. The guy is a freak athletically and Paxson wants to build a defensive oriented team that is athletic. Paxson knew he needed another big man and Tyrus was arguably the best one available. Brandon Roy is awesome and I think he will be awesome but I think Paxson has done an excellent job drafting. You can say all you want that they have had high draft picks, but what have teams like Toronto or Atlanta done with them? Exactly.

 

 

Id take Chris Bosh over any player the Bulls have right now. Any of them. Toronto drafted Vince Carter but he wanted out fo Canada, and Id take him as well over any Bulls player right now. ID say Toronto has done a nice job, where Chicago is consistently getting 2nd tier talent year after yr, outside of Elton Brand in the last decade, and he wasnt a paxson pick. Hinirch isnt even close to one of the top PGs in the league. He isnt in the same breath as Nash, Billups, Kidd, Bibby, Parker, B Davis, or AI, In fact Id take Devin Harris over him right now for the rest of their careers. Roy was the best player in this draft and should have been the Bulls pick at 1.2 and never looked back.

[Goopster24]

Id take Chris Bosh over any player the Bulls have right now. Any of them. Toronto drafted Vince Carter but he wanted out fo Canada, and Id take him as well over any Bulls player right now. ID say Toronto has done a nice job, where Chicago is consistently getting 2nd tier talent year after yr, outside of Elton Brand in the last decade, and he wasnt a paxson pick. Hinirch isnt even close to one of the top PGs in the league. He isnt in the same breath as Nash, Billups, Kidd, Bibby, Parker, B Davis, or AI, In fact Id take Devin Harris over him right now for the rest of their careers. Roy was the best player in this draft and should have been the Bulls pick at 1.2 and never looked back.

 

 

I can't argue with you about Roy; time will tell. And Bosh would have been nice but again, the Bulls NEEDED to draft a point guard with Williams gone. Most NBA coaches have praised how great of a player Hinrich is, especially defensively. He is up and coming. I said young point guards so I'm talking guys that have been drafted within the last couple of years or so. Ridnour, Harris, Nelson, Ford, etc. Harris is someone I like but the guy doesn't play half as great defense Hinrich does.

[wildcat2334]

Private Ryan knows better than to F with me-

 

I gotta chime in here- wow, you and Goop are going nuts in here. A couple points....

 

1- Amare is a legit 6'10- and not a good comparison to Thomas. Ty is a Marion, and will pattern his game after him- I am a big Thomas fan, he could be outstanding.

 

2- Roy?- I think Thomas was the pick. They didn't know they would get Ben, and Ty will give them some athleticism in the 3-4, which they really lack with Deng & Noccioni. Plus they were targeting the 6'6 Thela or whatever. Thomas was a great pick IMO.

 

3- Hinrich is sick- one of the BEST young point guards in the L- period. uh, you better mention him in the same breath as Kidd, Bibby, Parker, Billups and BDavis b/c he is right there. Guy does everything well, shoot, assist, rebound, play D. AHEAD of young Pt. guards like Harris,

 

4- The Brand trade one of the worst tades in NBA history

 

5- Bulls have a real nice club, and will be tough in the next few years, Paxson is killin GM's.

[Goopster24]

Private Ryan knows better than to F with me-

 

I gotta chime in here- wow, you and Goop are going nuts in here. A couple points....

 

1- Amare is a legit 6'10- and not a good comparison to Thomas. Ty is a Marion, and will pattern his game after him- I am a big Thomas fan, he could be outstanding.

 

2- Roy?- I think Thomas was the pick. They didn't know they would get Ben, and Ty will give them some athleticism in the 3-4, which they really lack with Deng & Noccioni. Plus they were targeting the 6'6 Thela or whatever. Thomas was a great pick IMO.

 

3- Hinrich is sick- one of the BEST young point guards in the L- period. uh, you better mention him in the same breath as Kidd, Bibby, Parker, Billups and BDavis b/c he is right there. Guy does everything well, shoot, assist, rebound, play D. AHEAD of young Pt. guards like Harris,

 

4- The Brand trade one of the worst tades in NBA history

 

5- Bulls have a real nice club, and will be tough in the next few years, Paxson is killin GM's.

 

 

I'm still not buying the 6'10''; what makes you say he is "legit"? No one is "legit". I also agree Tyrus probably will be more like Marion but again, all the scouting reports look awfully similar.

 

I love the draft Paxson had. I was there at the draft and at first I wasn't happy but looking back, getting Thabo was a great pick to couple the Tyrus pick with. Roy would have been nice but they still needed to address getting an athletic big. They didn't really need a dominant scorer. Roy is going to be great but Tyrus if brought up right could be special. Again, I trust Paxson's eyes.

 

And yes, Hinrich is sik.

[Sgt. Ryan]

Private Ryan knows better than to F with me-

 

 

 

 

 

I must have missed this memo from DMD. Unfortunately, some will tell you, I dont know when to stop Oprahing with people. You Id jack with at will, I just have nothing to thrash you on at the moment. But come college football season when OU kicks the snot out off Oregon, and you lose our lil bet, you can bet your ass Ill kick you in the nuts about it.

Edited July 7, 2006 by Sgt. Ryan

[Puddy]

Bill Simmons on the Ben signing and how well he thinks Chicago's wonderkid GM is doing.

 

And Ben Wallace (26) went from being wildly underpaid and underrated to wildly overpaid and overrated in the blink of an eye. Just check his regular-season and playoff stats, for God's sake. He peaked two or three years ago.

 

(That reminds me, am I the only one who thought Chicago wasted much of its cap space for two extra rebounds per game, a mild defensive upgrade and the ongoing comedy of a Buckwheat-caliber afro? Congratulations, you get to play four-on-five for the next four years in a league where every rule adjustment favors teams that can score. Why not just keep Chandler for two-thirds the price? Instead, they overpaid for Wallace and gave away Chandler for a washed-up P.J. Brown and a draft bust that New Orleans was trying to dump? I don't get it. This is like Paramount Pictures signing William H. Macy to a four-picture, $60 million deal -- sure, he's a great actor, but that doesn't mean you pay him like a superstar. They will eventually regret this one almost as much as Wallace probably regrets filming that T-Mobile commercial that made him seem whipped.)

[tbimm]

Bill Simmons on the Ben signing and how well he thinks Chicago's wonderkid GM is doing.

 

As they say "Opinions are like . Everyone has one and they are all full of....."

[Goopster24]

As they say "Opinions are like . Everyone has one and they are all full of....."

 

 

Well said.

[wildcat2334]

Bill Simmons on the Ben signing and how well he thinks Chicago's wonderkid GM is doing.

 

 

 

I love Simmons as much as anyone- but he likes to stir it up a bit. Chi played 4 on 5 anyway with Chandler. 4 year deal is nothin- Ben is still a Def. factor & on O, he will be a nice garbage man, grabbing those long rebounds off missed 3 balls.

[Puddy]

I love Simmons as much as anyone- but he likes to stir it up a bit. Chi played 4 on 5 anyway with Chandler. 4 year deal is nothin- Ben is still a Def. factor & on O, he will be a nice garbage man, grabbing those long rebounds off missed 3 balls.

 

 

I agree with what you say, but that was quite a price for those qualities.

[Goopster24]

I agree with what you say, but that was quite a price for those qualities.

 

 

Sometimes you need to overpay a little. Jerry Krause didn't realize that. He thought he was gonna get McGrady by bringing a band, the Luvabulls, Benny the Bull, and fans to the airport when he came. Paxson just opened up the Bulls' wallet; you have to love his aggressiveness.

[Puddy]

To put into perspective why many think Ben is getting way too much money consider this.

 

Lebron James just signed a five-year contract that is expected to pay him $80 million. That's $16 mil/yr.

 

Ben signed a four-year contract for $60 million. That's $15 mil/yr.

 

 

So a fantastic one dimensional player who will be 32 when the season starts will make the same amount of money as arguably the best player of his generation who will be 22 when the season begins.

 

Mind boggling.

[chiefjay]

To put into perspective why many think Ben is getting way too much money consider this.

 

Lebron James just signed a five-year contract that is expected to pay him $80 million. That's $16 mil/yr.

 

Ben signed a four-year contract for $60 million. That's $15 mil/yr.

So a fantastic one dimensional player who will be 32 when the season starts will make the same amount of money as arguably the best player of his generation who will be 22 when the season begins.

 

Mind boggling.

 

 

I wonder who on the Bulls is coming up for extensions in the coming few years and how the Bulls will fit them in. I'm sure Kirk, Gordon, Nocioni, and a few others will want their pay days soon.

 

My two cents, good riddance to Ben. He disappointed greatly the past year or so. A moody M F'r to say the least. He'll have a nice year in Chicago this year but will fade quickly. Oh and look forward to the 30% FT shooting.

 

Thank you sir for your great contribution and the Championship runs up until you decided to mail it in because you weren't appreciated enough in the offensive scheme.

[Goopster24]

I wonder who on the Bulls is coming up for extensions in the coming few years and how the Bulls will fit them in. I'm sure Kirk, Gordon, Nocioni, and a few others will want their pay days soon.

 

My two cents, good riddance to Ben. He disappointed greatly the past year or so. A moody M F'r to say the least. He'll have a nice year in Chicago this year but will fade quickly. Oh and look forward to the 30% FT shooting.

 

Thank you sir for your great contribution and the Championship runs up until you decided to mail it in because you weren't appreciated enough in the offensive scheme.

 

 

So what would you have said if he had resigned with the Pistons?

[chiefjay]

So what would you have said if he had resigned with the Pistons?

 

 

Depends on the length and amount of the contract and definately not at the price the Bulls overpaid. I've been critical of Ben all year and even into last year. He's not the same player he was a few years back. That said it could have been due to his unhappiness with the coach, the fact his bro was not allowed back to the Palace (Palace Brawl), his lack of presense in the offensive schemes, etc... Maybe he'll be back and better then ever with the Bulls? I just think an undersized rebounder and shot blocker eventually hits a wall and I think he is close to that wall. Plus he has zero offensive game and is the worst FT shooter of all time or at least very close.

 

I agree there is no viable replacement for him at this point but I could just not see us paying him that kind of loot.