Wings fans............

[Bier Meister]

I don't think you need to tell us all how great your team is. In fact, anything less than the cup would be a major disappointment. Imagine how much of an impact Hull, Chelios, Robitaille, and Hasek would make on any team, let alone a team that is considered a contender every year. I would be embarrassed to talk crap about how good they are- it's redundant. You guys realize that the wings are the yankees of hockey, right? The only thing that I can think of to stop them is perhapse a hot goalie, tieing them up physically, and the players to keep up offensively- maybe.

[Foosball God]

Bier Meister:

You guys realize that the wings are the yankees of hockey, right?

On what basis do you spew this crap out? The Wings have made exactly two big FA moves, getting Hull and Robitaille this year. All other significant moves were made via trades or drafting.

[Bier Meister]

I understand that this is just one article, but I think it shows that Hasek (as with many elite players these days) had a say in were he went and was primarily looking at Det and Stl. It's an article from fox around july of last year. It seems that elite teams are more able to attract(makes sense) and sign elite players. If someone wants a ring are they going to want to go to TB? I don't think so. They get in line to go to Det, Col, Stl, etc. Who said that these were solely FA acqusitions?

 

In negotiations that went to the wire and a tad beyond, the Sabres traded their six-time Vezina-winning goalie to the Wings because Hasek wanted to go there instead of St. Louis say sources. He pushed for that unaware the Blues had a deal in the hopper to get star center Doug Weight from Edmonton, a transaction that might well impact the balance of power in a tight four-way race in the West that likely will involve Colorado, St. Louis, Detroit and Dallas. And not necessarily in that order.

 

(Of course that all changes if the Los Angeles Kings land either Eric Lindros or Jaromir Jagr.)

 

According to several sources, the Blues offered goalie Fred Brathwaite and forward Cory Stillman (draft picks were also involved) for Hasek and the Sabres liked that deal better than the one that sent them Slava Kozlov and his $2-plus million salary. But Hasek, unaware that the Blues were about to get Weight, pushed for the Detroit deal and under terms of an agreement before his being traded, the Sabres complied.

 

Those terms, according to sources, were that if the deals were similar, the Sabres would send Hasek where he wanted to go. The deals were close and Hasek pushed for Detroit.

 

Money was also an issue for St. Louis. According to these same sources, Hasek wanted in excess of $8 million per season from the Blues and more if the Blues won the Stanley Cup during his term there. According to several sources, Hasek wanted to be paid along the lines of Chris Pronger, a near $10 million-per man if the Blues won the Cup. The Blues wanted to pay Hasek about $7.5 million, same as he was making with Buffalo. The quality of the draft pick was also an issue for Buffalo. Detroit dangled a No.1 in 2002. The Blues had already traded their No.1 that year to Phoenix in the deal that netted them Keith Tkachuk.

 

Detroit didn't balk at Hasek's salary requests, management and ownership were said to be in agreement that he was the best netminder in the NHL and that he would be paid accordingly.

 

edit: I found another one

http://foxsports.lycos.com/content/view?co...ontentId=143683

[Foosball God]

Bier Meister:

The quality of the draft pick was also an issue for Buffalo. Detroit dangled a No.1 in 2002. The Blues had already traded their No.1 that year to Phoenix in the deal that netted them Keith Tkachuk.

So the Wings got Hasek because they were able to offer a better deal than St. Louis, because St. Louis had already traded their 1st rounder away.

[Hugh 0ne]

Foosball God:

 

Bier Meister:

You guys realize that the wings are the yankees of hockey, right?

On what basis do you spew this crap out? The Wings have made exactly two big FA moves, getting Hull and Robitaille this year. All other significant moves were made via trades or drafting.Here we go again. I think we've been here before.

[Foosball God]

Bier Meister:

In fact, anything less than the cup would be a major disappointment.

As it would be for Colorado, as it was for St. Louis, as it was for New Jersey, and as it was for Philly.

[Foosball God]

HUGH ONE:

Here we go again. I think we've been here before.

Exactly. It's a rediculous arguement that doesn't have any substance backing it. There are lots of teams out there that went after and got premium FA's and got the better end of some trades because a Star player wanted out and gave a specific list of teams. Jagr, Lindros, Roenick, and Blake are just a couple of examples.

 

The whole arguement is a load of horse sh*t.

[Bier Meister]

HUGH ONE:

 

Foosball God:

 

Bier Meister:

You guys realize that the wings are the yankees of hockey, right?

On what basis do you spew this crap out? The Wings have made exactly two big FA moves, getting Hull and Robitaille this year. All other significant moves were made via trades or drafting.

Here we go again. I think we've been here before.Didn't know this was covered already. I'll let it go.

 

Parting shots- I don't think Stl (closest of the bunch-imo), NJ, or Philly is the same cliber of team as Det or Col.

 

And I didn't read a reply to this-

It seems that elite teams are more able to attract(makes sense) and sign elite players. If someone wants a ring are they going to want to go to TB? I don't think so. They get in line to go to Det, Col, Stl, etc.

[Bier Meister]

Foosball God

 

The whole arguement is a load of horse sh*t.[/QB]

Untrue- elite players go to elite teams as norm rather than the exception.

[Foosball God]

Bier Meister:

Untrue- elite players go to elite teams as norm rather than the exception.

And so this makes the Wings and no one else the Yankees of hockey???

 

If you wanted to start a thread about how elite players can sometimes play a part in where they get traded, and that the elite teams in the league have a better shot of landing those FA's or soon to be FA's, you would not of had an arguement.

 

But to label the Wings the Yankees of hockey like they are the only team out there able to attract high profile FA's is a load of horse sh*t. thumbs_d

[Bier Meister]

Foos,

 

I really see it that way (and I don't think I'm alone on this). I see Det and CO in that light. More so Det, because we have seen more player movement in their direction over the past several years. IMO this more of a recent thing for them (unlike the Yankees who have been doing this for a long ass time).

 

BTW- I used to be a big wing fan until we got the Sharks, and still pulled for them when SJ didn't play them. Recently it just seems like they are buying their championship. I am a huge 49er fan and was'nt so happy with the last ring in 94 because of the same thing. Yes, I really was not supportive of Primetime in a 49er jersey. It seems tainted..............

[Foosball God]

Bier Meister:

Foos,

 

I really see it that way (and I don't think I'm alone on this).  I see Det and CO in that light.  More so Det, because we have seen more player movement in their direction over the past several years.  IMO this more of a recent thing for them (unlike the Yankees who have been doing this for a long ass time).

 

BTW- I used to be a big wing fan until we got the Sharks, and still pulled for them when SJ didn't play them.  Recently it just seems like they are buying their championship. I am a huge 49er fan and was'nt so happy with the last ring in 94 because of the same thing.  Yes, I really was not supportive of Primetime in a 49er jersey.  It seems tainted..............

Why don't you tell me a team that has won a recent championship in hockey that did not make a big offseason FA aquistion or trade then Bier? Colorado last year had Bourque, New Jersey had Mogilny, Dallas had Hull, etc. etc.

 

Is the reason you feel Colorado and Detroit are like the Yankees is because they are sucessful? The Rangers, Flyers, Devils, Maple Leafs, and Capitals have all made significant FA pickups and trades yet they aren't on your "list" because they didn't do anything with the players they got.

[Bier Meister]

Of coarse teams are going to make moves. Often success leads players to want more and get other offers. Some leave, some stay. I see Det and Col as powerhouses. A lot of the other teams mentioned seemed to have their season of destiny, or only have moderate talent making it hard for 1 single "super-star" to make a tremendous impact. There is really only so much 1 player can do. The highest chance a player has of taking his team furthest is if he is a goalie. Players inevitably want to go to a successful organization, hence perpetuating the organization's success. Because there have been so many big names signed by the wings over the past few seasons (more than just a Blake replacing a Borque- which is also frustrating) it resembles a Yankee Championship.

[Hugh 0ne]

Foosball God

[/qb]

The Rangers, Flyers, Devils, Maple Leafs, and Capitals have all made significant FA pickups and trades yet they aren't on your "list" because they didn't do anything with the players they got.[/QB]

 

With the Rangers being the worst of the fact. I think you can make an argument either way, but the bottom line is that teams, when they do it succesfully, will get scrutinized as buying a championship. If the Rangers won the cup this year every one would say the same thing. But since they really suck monkey arse, no one is talking about them. The Wings have a high payroll with money players, some traded for, some not, but since they're succesful, they draw attention.

[policyvote]

The Wings aren't the Yankees of hockey, because every year, the Yankees get several top-flite FAs, and drop the guys who've been on the team more than two years. It's completely irrelevant what names are sewn on the spamshirts--lose Wells, get Mussina; lose Justice, get Giambi, etc. etc. If you're a Yankees fan, Derek Jeter is pretty much the only guy whose jersey you can safely buy. OTOH, The Red Wings have been built around Yzerman, Fedorov, and Lidstrom for years, and the second tier is composed of Detroit fixtures like McCarty, Draper, Maltby, Larionov, and Holmstrom. There's also a very strong corps of young homegrown talent in Datsyuk, Fischer, Devereaux, Williams, Kuznetzov and Wallin. Shanahan and Chelios are more recent acquisitions, but Shanny's been here since the trade deadline in '96, and until this year, Chelios was the only major FA acquisiton since (not counting the Uwe Krupp fiasco). This year, yes, the Wings made multiple major acquisitions, getting Hully, Robitaille, and Hasek. However, this is not the Yankees going through their yearly purge-and-reload, it's a team adding to their nucleus of the last ten years, to make one last run at the Cup (or maybe TWO last runs at the cup, as Hully has hinted at). After this, Lidstrom can move back to Sweden (as he's wanted to do for years), and some combination of Yzerman, Hull, Hasek, Robitaille, Larionov, Shanahan, and Chelios can retire. The sick thing is that if a couple of those guys stay, them plus the young guys would keep the team pretty competitive.

 

Peace

policy

[Bier Meister]

Yes! GB the core/nucleus of that team (I consider Shanny part of that now too). It is the acquistion of Chelios, Hull, Robitaille, and to a lesser degree Hasek that to me ensures a cup. I also believe that is a more recent occurrance and if you guys only get one of these hall of famers, I don't even start this thread. That was what was so fun about their 1st cup- it was the wings, not a hall of fame team- Yankees.

[Foosball God]

Chelios has been with the Wings for over three seasons now, he's hardly a new aquisition.

[Bier Meister]

Hey foos, if you want to talk yourself into the legitimacy of the cup go right ahead. Bottom line is it's tainted by these guys trying to get their ring via detroit. I have worked with much more dilusional people than you. Sit back in your chair, smoke your stoggie, put aside any thought of the possibility of mecenaries and enjoy.

[policyvote]

Bier Meister:

Yes!  GB the core/nucleus of that team (I consider Shanny part of that now too).  It is the acquistion of Chelios, Hull, Robitaille, and to a lesser degree Hasek that to me ensures a cup.  I also believe that is a more recent occurrance and if you guys only get one of these hall of famers, I don't even start this thread.  That was what was so fun about their 1st cup-  it was the wings, not a hall of fame team- Yankees.

Chelios was picked up two years ago--and again, the only major addition before him was Shanny, and the only additions after him were Hull/Robitaille/Hasek, all of whom were this year. So I wouldn't lump Chelly in with the others, especially considering tha Chelly was supposed to be totally washed up at the time. Two years ago, nobody would have believed he'd lead the league in +/- and be a Norris finalist now.

 

Peace

policy

[redwings.cup]

chelly was picked up three years ago now for the post season run, Policy. he came along the same day as Wendell Clark, Ranford, and somebody else who escapes my memory at this moment. The Wings were going for a three peat and led 2 games to none versus CO when Ozzie went down, Ranford came in, and the Wings went away. To say Chelios is not a true wing at this point is simply not the case.

[Furd]

redwings.cup:

chelly was picked up three years ago now for the post season run, Policy.  he came along the same day as Wendell Clark, Ranford, and somebody else who escapes my memory at this moment. 

Who is . . . Ulfie

[Guest Azazello13]

Foosball God:

But to label the Wings the Yankees of hockey like they are the only team out there able to attract high profile FA's is a load of horse sh*t.    thumbs_d

the only difference between this year's wings and the yankees is that the yankees are smart enough to pick up elite players while they're still in their PRIMES.

[Foosball God]

Azazello13:

 

Foosball God:

But to label the Wings the Yankees of hockey like they are the only team out there able to attract high profile FA's is a load of horse sh*t.  thumbs_d 

the only difference between this year's wings and the yankees is that the yankees are smart enough to pick up elite players while they're still in their PRIMES.

[Lerxst]

redwings.cup:

chelly was picked up three years ago now for the post season run, Policy.  he came along the same day as Wendell Clark, Ranford, and somebody else who escapes my memory at this moment.  The Wings were going for a three peat and led 2 games to none versus CO when Ozzie went down, Ranford came in, and the Wings went away.    To say Chelios is not a true wing at this point is simply not the case.

I would think you would know your Red Wing history, but that is incorrect. Ranford played the first 4 games of that series against the Avs in 99. He DID NOT come in in game 3 after Osgood got hurt. Osgood returned in game 5, but by then, the Avs had grabbed the momentum and it was lights out for Detroit. Nice try though.

[Soulman]

Bier Meister:

I don't think you need to tell us all how great your team is. 

Hmmm....

 

If you're saying that everyone around the country knows how good we are, then a big thumbs up!. This is called Hockey Town. But, it's really sports town. The fans here know the full gambit. Unparallelled success and failure. Through it all we talk up our teams.

 

If you're implying that you want us to shut up, then do it yourself.