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Brentastic
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So now people who want to grow their own vegetables are nutjobs? Are you sure you got the right nutjob?

 

But to answer your question - different people who make them now. I mean, are you really happy with the politicians and lawmakers who are guiding this ship now? If your answer is yes, well, I don't know what to say to that.

 

I'd rather pay no taxes, but those laws were put into place by our forefathers (not by those in charge now).

I'd rather not be limited by speed on the roads, but I understand why those laws were put into place (not by those in charge now)

I'd like to be able to punch stoopid people in the mouth, but there are laws against assault. (not put in place by those in charge now)

I's like to be able to kick the woman who plants a garden in her front yard next to my beautifully manicured lawn.

 

It ain't the people guiding the ship now, Brent....laws have been in place for 200+ years for all different reasons, many of them each of us could have a gripe with. You picking on this one as an example of why we need to replace out current lawmakers or policies is laughable.

Edited by i_am_the_swammi
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What an incredibly stupid thing to say.

 

I absolutely would care if my neighbor put a garden in his front lawn or never mowed it or the like. If you do these things, I don't want you as my neighbor 'cause it makes the whole neighborhood look like crap and you're selfish and have no respect for your neighbors or their investments which makes you trash in my book. If that makes me a "big fat hair p*ssy" in your book, I'm perfectly ok with that, 'cause you would be stupid a-s white trash in mine.

Ahhh yes, because money is far more important that living well, in tune with nature and the land. Got it.

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What an incredibly stupid thing to say.

 

I absolutely would care if my neighbor put a garden in his front lawn or never mowed it or the like. If you do these things, I don't want you as my neighbor 'cause it makes the whole neighborhood look like crap and you're selfish and have no respect for your neighbors or their investments which makes you trash in my book. If that makes me a "big fat hair p*ssy" in your book, I'm perfectly ok with that, 'cause you would be stupid a-s white trash in mine.

 

He's proven himself a bs hippie dippie child with his 'everyone can do and behave as they want even if it's boorish, that's YOUR problem' and his Internet tough guy statements. But what do you expect from a self proclaimed expert on something he is consistently wrong about. :wacko:

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If I may:

 

As an avid gardener who does actually use edible landscaping in my front yard and who has arguably among the nicest yards in the neighborhood (if you would judge that by how often the old ladies walking by say so to me or my wife), I do find drawing the line at veggie gardens somewhat random. Heck, to me, nothing looks worse than those horrid "rock-scapes" that were so popular when I was a kid. But, again, that's just me.

 

Secondly, what the eff is up with people and freaking lawns? What a waste? They eat water, result in tons of chemical usage and, are almost never enjoyed. Most of the people in my neighborhood don't have kids, yet nearly everyone has a lawn. And they just sit there being green. But, again, that's just me. My opinion. We've been slowly converting our lawn to landscaping bit by bit each year. But, again, that's sort of our thing. We're not the ones messing with anyone's property value.

 

So, because of the fact that I don't think lawns or traditional suburban mono-culture is attractive, I would be among those who would campaign against what I find to be a random place to draw the line in terms of what you could grow in your yard. And, if there was a city ordinance against unsightly yards, I would think that you should be allowed to grow veggies provided you deal with them. The same way I'm guessing these cities would require you to make sure your yard looks good otherwise. I mean, that is the basis of the law, correct? That your yard doesn't look like crap and annoy your neighbors?

 

Frankly, if it were up to me, I'd as soon as have this sort of thing handled on an HOA level rather than a city level, but even a city level is a far cry from some national mandate. Hell, when I first read the article (gotta look into Avernus' link), I assumed it was likely a particularly old law because I actually see urban farming on the rise. It certainly is around here. There are all kinds of people with veggie gardens in their front yards in Durham. Hell, it's been within the last year or so that people have been allowed to keep chickens in city limits. So, I'm actually seeing this trend in the opposite direction. And I think that's effing great. I think a veggie garden is beautiful. Doesn't mean I want to make a law that says you have to have one, but I'm the last guy alive who is going to fight someone growing veggies in their front yard.

 

None the less, if the city you live in is not down with this, then sucks for you. Find another place to live or change the law. You can decide what laws you do and don't want to follow, but you can't complain when that bites you in the ass. You may think that, if booze is legal, than so should pot. Hell, I do. And, because of that, you can go ahead and smoke pot because you know in your heart that there's really nothing all that wrong with doing it. But tell that to the judge when you get popped for it. It's the chance you take. That is, until enough other people agree with you to change the law. It's the tyranny of the majority and it's something we've been living with for a long, long time.

 

However, based on your "I don't cut the lawn and I don't care" bit, it seems like you're just a loser who doesn't take care of his chight and wants to feel good about it.

 

But here's a news flash, you likely don't own your house, or at least not much of it. The bank does. Would you feel better if the bank showed up and made you mow the lawn because you're messing with the property value of something they own the majority of? Or would that also be the man keeping you down? Because, maybe your neighbors can suck it for all you care, but what about the guy who fronted you a couple 100 grand to buy your house. If you default, it's his house. And if you've been treating it like crap, you're messing with his investment, quite measurably.

Edited by detlef
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If I may:

 

As an avid gardener who does actually use edible landscaping in my front yard and who has arguably among the nicest yards in the neighborhood (if you would judge that by how often the old ladies walking by say so to me or my wife), I do find drawing the line at veggie gardens somewhat random. That is, unless you're going to make sure people keep their non-edible landscaping up as well. Heck, to me, nothing looks worse than those horrid "rock-scapes" that were so popular when I was a kid. But, again, that's just me.

 

Secondly, what the eff is up with people and freaking lawns? What a waste? They eat water, result in tons of chemical usage and, are almost never enjoyed. Most of the people in my neighborhood don't have kids, yet nearly everyone has a lawn. And they just sit there being green. But, again, that's just me. My opinion. We've been slowly converting our lawn to landscaping bit by bit each year. But, again, that's sort of our thing. We're not the ones messing with anyone's property value.

 

So, because of the fact that I don't think lawns or traditional suburban mono-culture is attractive, I would be among those who would campaign against what I find to be a random place to draw the line in terms of what you could grow in your yard. And, if there was a city ordinance against unsightly yards, I would think that you should be allowed to grow veggies provided you deal with them. The same way I'm guessing these cities would require you to make sure your yard looks good otherwise. I mean, that is the basis of the law, correct? That your yard doesn't look like crap and annoy your neighbors?

 

Frankly, if it were up to me, I'd as soon as have this sort of thing handled on an HOA level rather than a city level, but even a city level is a far cry from some national mandate. Hell, when I first read the article (gotta look into Avernus' link), I assumed it was likely a particularly old law because I actually see urban farming on the rise. It certainly is around here. There are all kinds of people with veggie gardens in their front yards in Durham. Hell, it's been within the last year or so that people have been allowed to keep chickens in city limits. So, I'm actually seeing this trend in the opposite direction. And I think that's effing great. I think a veggie garden is beautiful. Doesn't mean I want to make a law that says you have to have one, but I'm the last guy alive who is going to fight someone growing veggies in their front yard.

 

None the less, if the city you live in is not down with this, then sucks for you. Find another place to live or change the law. You can decide what laws you do and don't want to follow, but you can't complain when that bites you in the ass. You may think that, if booze is legal, than so should pot. Hell, I do. And, because of that, you can go ahead and smoke pot because you know in your heart that there's really nothing all that wrong with doing it. But tell that to the judge when you get popped for it. It's the chance you take. That is, until enough other people agree with you to change the law. It's the tyranny of the majority and it's something we've been living with for a long, long time.

 

However, based on your "I don't cut the lawn and I don't care" bit, it seems like you're just a loser who doesn't take care of his chight and wants to feel good about it.

 

But here's a news flash, you likely don't own your house, or at least not much of it. The bank does. Would you feel better if the bank showed up and made you mow the lawn because you're messing with the property value of something they own the majority of? Or would that also be the man keeping you down? Because, maybe your neighbors can suck it for all you care, but what about the guy who fronted you a couple 100 grand to buy your house. If you default, it's his house. And if you've been treating it like crap, you're messing with his investment, quite measurably.

 

Viva la Revolucion!!!

 

I really didn't read all of your post, just wanted to type that. I'm not sure if it has any bearing on what you wrote what so ever. So, I apologize if it is tangential and lacking of any substance with regard to your post.

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I'd rather pay no taxes, but those laws were put into place by our forefathers (not by those in charge now).

I'd rather not be limited by speed on the roads, but I understand why those laws were put into place (not by those in charge now)

I'd like to be able to punch stoopid people in the mouth, but there are laws against assault. (not put in place by those in charge now)

I's like to be able to kick the woman who plants a garden in her front yard next to my beautifully manicured lawn.

 

It ain't the people guiding the ship now, Brent....laws have been in place for 200+ years for all different reasons, many of them each of us could have a gripe with. You picking on this one as an example of why we need to replace out current lawmakers or policies is laughable.

 

you're really going to compare a veggie garden on a front lawn to speeding laws and taxes? :wacko:

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You surely have to be kidding.

Why not? If you want to make the argument that my veggie garden drags down your property value, you'd better live in my neighborhood. The more locally this sort of thing is handled the better.

 

The implications are much better. Say a bunch of people live in a neighborhood and are all pissed that someone put a veggie garden in their front lawn. They think this looks like crap. Now, they can either band together and make sure that nobody in their neighborhood can do this, or they can try to make it so that nobody in the entire city can. Well, what if there's another neighborhood in the same city where a bunch of people all love the idea of veggie gardens in their front yard. Now, you've got two sets of people, whose homes are barely near one another fighting over a law when each group could simply make rules that affect their neighborhood and each could be happy.

Edited by detlef
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Why not? If you want to make the argument that my veggie garden drags down your property value, you'd better live in my neighborhood. The more locally this sort of thing is handled the better.

Because HOAs suck donkey balls. At least city councils are elected.

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you're really going to compare a veggie garden on a front lawn to speeding laws and taxes? :wacko:

 

Your smarter than that.

 

The point is that to define "reasonable" is in the eyes of the person making the judgement. Everyone has a differing opinion as to what is reasonable and what isn't. I tried to make it very simple to understand in basic terms. Sorry if I failed.

 

I think its reasonable that we have guideines, as a society, as to what we can do with our properties. I don't want someone raising farm animals living next door to me in my neighborhood. I don't want what will likely become an unkept garden of vegetables next door either, especially if I am trying to sell my home. I don't want abandoned vehicles in my neighbors front yard as fixer-uppers. I chose to live in a neighborhood because I knew there would be minimum requirements in place to ensure the everyone can maintain a minimum level of consistency and value, based on appearance.

 

For some reason, Brent thinks thats wrong and unreasonable. Further, he thinks its wrong to monetarily fine those that disregard it.

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Viva la Revolucion!!!

 

I really didn't read all of your post, just wanted to type that. I'm not sure if it has any bearing on what you wrote what so ever. So, I apologize if it is tangential and lacking of any substance with regard to your post.

One should never apologize for typing that.

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Pick your battles Brent. This shouldn't be one of them.

 

If you lived next door to this old lady, you might be perfectly cool with her planting a garden in the front yard. But would you be just as cool if she filled the back yard with barking dogs whose waste she never removed? Would you be cool with sitting on your back porch sipping a brewski while the overpowering stench of dog poo hovers in the summer air? Wouldn't that be infringing on your right to be able to sink a beer without having to supress your gag reflex because the air is heavy with the smell of chit? Would you still be defending her rights?

 

I'm all about personal freedom, but I understand that part of freedom is not infringing on other people's quality of life. When you live in a city or a community with a HOA, you have to play by the rules that are in place.

 

If you want to talk about what an evil slimebag Monsanto is, I'm right there with ya. Can't roll with you on this one though.

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Why not? If you want to make the argument that my veggie garden drags down your property value, you'd better live in my neighborhood. The more locally this sort of thing is handled the better.

 

The implications are much better. Say a bunch of people live in a neighborhood and are all pissed that someone put a veggie garden in their front lawn. They think this looks like crap. Now, they can either band together and make sure that nobody in their neighborhood can do this, or they can try to make it so that nobody in the entire city can. Well, what if there's another neighborhood in the same city where a bunch of people all love the idea of veggie gardens in their front yard. Now, you've got two sets of people, whose homes are barely near one another fighting over a law when each group could simply make rules that affect their neighborhood and each could be happy.

It is better that a homeowner resents a law that the city enacts and enforces than battling with thier neighbors constantly. I would never live in a development that I would have to answer to an HOA. Never. Total joke.

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It is better that a homeowner resents a law that the city enacts and enforces than battling with thier neighbors constantly. I would never live in a development that I would have to answer to an HOA. Never. Total joke.

But a city ordinance that limits how you can landscape your front yard is just basically an HOA taken to an extreme. I mean, isn't that the primary gripe in HOAs? What people's front yards look like?

 

Mind you, I've never lived in a neighborhood with one and, like you, would prefer not to. Mind you, I would also not want to live in a city that basically extends the same thing on a city-wide level.

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Compared to most Michigan houses with dead bodies laying around everywhere...that actually looks pretty nice. Maybe she'll bring over some nice extra veggies and we can talk like neighbors used to instead of complaining about everything. Oh wait, I forgot...people suck.

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looks like crap. I'd burn her house down. The waste line cleanout at the front of the yard does add a little "something" to the setting, though.

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can someone tell me what is wrong with this picture because I see nothing wrong with this :wacko:

There's nothing wrong with it ... except that the City Council passed an ordinance forbidding it.

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