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Funny, if anything I got the opposite impression ie there are big IPA fans who act like if you don't like it, your tastes aren't sophisticated enough or something :wacko: Kind of along the same lines as people with a similar attitude towards those who don't like dark beer or red wine etc etc. That said I've been lucky enough to run into extremely few either way, so I think/hope it's an extreme minority.

I created a chight storm on Beer Advocate about this, but I think beer snobbery has left wine snobbery in the dust in terms of how insufferable they can be.

 

Having two restaurants, one with a wine-focused bev program and the other with a beer-focused one. Both certainly catering the the respective "geeks" of the beer and wine worlds, I can say we endure far more annoying crap from the beer guys than the wine drinkers.

 

And it's effing inane. From guys who stupidly bash the larger craft brewers like Sierra Nevada and Sam Adams because they're too mainstream. Um, the beer is good. Why do you have a problem with someone who makes a lot of really good beer? Isn't a lot of something good a good thing?

 

To guys who get their panties in a twist because their server can't recite the hops used in every IPA we have.

 

That's the funniest. I have an extended list. If you ask for the list, it typically means you know your beer. If you bother to ask what hops are used in this beer or that, it means you really know your beer. So well, in fact, that I'm rather certain that you actually know the answer to your question and are just hoping that the cute waitress has a thing for fat dudes with beards who know the difference between Amarillo and Centennial hops.

 

Like wine guy who thinks white wine is for newbs, these guys are just dicks who happen to choose beer as their thing. They could just as easily be a dooosch about cars or home entertainment systems (and quite possibly are).

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Reminds me of this post last year.

 

 

I sometimes think beer snobs and music snobs can be similar. I remember in the early 90's when only the 'alternative' music stations were playing bands like Nirvana, etc. and their listeners loved those bands. Once the music became mainstream the same music fans bashed the bands. They only disliked thier music because now 'everyone' liked it. It wasn't cool anymore. Strange how just because more and more people decided to enjoy that sound it turned off the original fans of the music. Makes no sense to me.

 

Good beer drinkers have some of the same tendencies. I see it in posts on Beer Advocate. Sort of funny.

 

 

Edit to add: I find myself guilty of this sometimes as well. I haven't purchased Sam Adams regularly from the store in quite a while even though I know I still like some of their beers. I buy more and more microbrews which I love but I wonder if I'm shying away from SA because I don't look like the beer dork I'm trying to be. :wacko:

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I created a chight storm on Beer Advocate about this, but I think beer snobbery has left wine snobbery in the dust in terms of how insufferable they can be.

 

Having two restaurants, one with a wine-focused bev program and the other with a beer-focused one. Both certainly catering the the respective "geeks" of the beer and wine worlds, I can say we endure far more annoying crap from the beer guys than the wine drinkers.

 

And it's effing inane. From guys who stupidly bash the larger craft brewers like Sierra Nevada and Sam Adams because they're too mainstream. Um, the beer is good. Why do you have a problem with someone who makes a lot of really good beer? Isn't a lot of something good a good thing?

 

To guys who get their panties in a twist because their server can't recite the hops used in every IPA we have.

 

That's the funniest. I have an extended list. If you ask for the list, it typically means you know your beer. If you bother to ask what hops are used in this beer or that, it means you really know your beer. So well, in fact, that I'm rather certain that you actually know the answer to your question and are just hoping that the cute waitress has a thing for fat dudes with beards who know the difference between Amarillo and Centennial hops.

 

Like wine guy who thinks white wine is for newbs, these guys are just dicks who happen to choose beer as their thing. They could just as easily be a dooosch about cars or home entertainment systems (and quite possibly are).

 

This for sure, especially on beer advocate. Some of those folks are plain preposterous. I tell them all the time, have been called more names by these self important noodles than I can remember. Yet I've forgotten more about the biz, than they actually know. I usually tell them they can call me any name they want, as long as Cicerone is included. Shuts most of the numb nuts up. Also find more beer snobs from the bigger "craft" regions for sure. Like their chit don't stink, yet their breath always does. Portlanders and New Englanders are especially full of themselves, it seems.

Edited by Hugh B Tool

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I created a chight storm on Beer Advocate about this, but I think beer snobbery has left wine snobbery in the dust in terms of how insufferable they can be.

 

Like wine guy who thinks white wine is for newbs, these guys are just dicks who happen to choose beer as their thing. They could just as easily be a dooosch about cars or home entertainment systems (and quite possibly are).

Yeah - we discussed this at length in earlier posts. Whatever our diff's may otherwise be, I will :wacko: to you here. Gawd I hate pretentious/pompous aholes. Nobody is impressed dbag and PS yer making an arse of yourself; get a life and shut tf up.

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The Uinta Hop Notch has been one of our most popular tap offerings of late.

 

And, while not advertised as an IPA, the Victory Headwaters Pale Ale, made with Citra hops, is so effing delicious, it makes my head spin. And it certainly does what an IPA should do.

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Gonna add Lagunitas Maximus to the list. Malty-hoppy goodness.

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This years SN Celebration is top notch. Certainly an IPA of a different sort, yet still a yummy example. Cheers!

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This years SN Celebration is top notch. Certainly an IPA of a different sort, yet still a yummy example. Cheers!

had two yesterday. Very good batch

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Just picked up a sixtel of Port Brewing Wipe Out IPA and tapped the first glass last night ... mighty tasty stuff!!!

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Um, Sam Adams is NOT good....

 

Cant believe no ona has mentioned Boulevard yet...the Double wide IPA is amazing...

 

And I love the single wide too, a little sweeter than most IPA's

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Um, Sam Adams is NOT good....

 

Cant believe no ona has mentioned Boulevard yet...the Double wide IPA is amazing...

 

And I love the single wide too, a little sweeter than most IPA's

 

As far as lagers go, which IMO are generally light and often lack character, SA is still pretty good. SA light is the best light on the market. Some of the seasonals are very good. Sure, they often tone their beers down to satisfy the larger market and attract people who may not have the aquired pallette of micro brew officianados, but it's still good beer.

 

Having said that, in that price class, I opt for more adventurous brews. But to say SA os NOT good... I have to disagree.

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As far as lagers go, which IMO are generally light and often lack character, SA is still pretty good. SA light is the best light on the market. Some of the seasonals are very good. Sure, they often tone their beers down to satisfy the larger market and attract people who may not have the aquired pallette of micro brew officianados, but it's still good beer.

 

Having said that, in that price class, I opt for more adventurous brews. But to say SA os NOT good... I have to disagree.

maybe thats what it is...but I really think its a bland boring beer

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As far as lagers go, which IMO are generally light and often lack character, SA is still pretty good. SA light is the best light on the market. Some of the seasonals are very good. Sure, they often tone their beers down to satisfy the larger market and attract people who may not have the aquired pallette of micro brew officianados, but it's still good beer.

 

Having said that, in that price class, I opt for more adventurous brews. But to say SA os NOT good... I have to disagree.

Agree. SA does a fine job in general and I think nails it every now and then. I think their Noble Pils was outstanding the last time I had it. Given the choice between them and SN (which I guess I sort of link because I buy them from the same company, they're both on the less expensive side in the category, and they're both in the big and old department when it comes to craft beers), I'll almost always take SN, but I completely respect Sam Adams.

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maybe thats what it is...but I really think its a bland boring beer

 

Their Octoberfest is great and far from what I consider bland and boring.

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Speaking of IPAs, I'm getting pretty effing sick of the herd mentality. We only have four taps and at least one of them always has some sort of one-off or unique deal, so I need to be careful about being redundant with the other three handles and try to cover as many bases as possible. Of course, given the popularity, I'll always have some sort of IPA-ish beer on tap (and, typically, it's not just IPA-ish, but actually a beer labeled as an IPA). Seems that's not enough for some. Right now, for instance, we have the Victory Headwaters Pale. Which, besides being about as delicious as it gets, may as well be an IPA. In fact, I'm rather certain that it's hoppier than almost any traditional English IPA.

 

At any rate, when people ask what our IPA on tap is, the servers are instructed to say we have the Victory Headwaters Pale which is pretty hoppy.

"Is it an IPA?"

"Technically it's labeled a Pale Ale, but like I said, it's pretty hoppy for a Pale Ale, so if you like IPAs, you'll probably like this. It uses 100% Citra hops and is really bright."

"I drink IPAs. You don't have an IPA on tap?"

"The closest thing we have is the Headwaters, but if you like IPAs, I bet you'll love it. It's actually hoppier than some IPAs"

"You should have an IPA on tap. I guess I'll just get a bottle."

 

Effing idiots. So, basically, you don't give two craps about what the beer tastes like, you just want it to say IPA, because that's what all the cool kids are drinking.

 

So, I have two choices if I don't want to continue to endure this crap.

1) Never serve anything that resembles an American IPA unless it actually says "IPA" in the name.

2) Waste two of my three tap handles on two beers that are really similar at the expense of actually offering some distinct choices so I can feature a delicious beer like Headwaters and still keep a precious-freaking "IPA" on tap.

 

It's like Pinot Noir all over again. Everyone wants to order Pinot, but the Pinots that sell best for us are the ones that taste like Syrah. People just want to think they're drinking Pinot because that's what the cool people apparently drink.

Edited by detlef

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Speaking of IPAs, I'm getting pretty effing sick of the herd mentality. We only have four taps and at least one of them always has some sort of one-off or unique deal, so I need to be careful about being redundant with the other three handles and try to cover as many bases as possible. Of course, given the popularity, I'll always have some sort of IPA-ish beer on tap (and, typically, it's not just IPA-ish, but actually a beer labeled as an IPA). Seems that's not enough for some. Right now, for instance, we have the Victory Headwaters Pale. Which, besides being about as delicious as it gets, may as well be an IPA. In fact, I'm rather certain that it's hoppier than almost any traditional English IPA.

 

At any rate, when people ask what our IPA on tap is, the servers are instructed to say we have the Victory Headwaters Pale which is pretty hoppy.

"Is it an IPA?"

"Technically it's labeled a Pale Ale, but like I said, it's pretty hoppy for a Pale Ale, so if you like IPAs, you'll probably like this. It uses 100% Citra hops and is really bright."

"I drink IPAs. You don't have an IPA on tap?"

"The closest thing we have is the Headwaters, but if you like IPAs, I bet you'll love it. It's actually hoppier than some IPAs"

"You should have an IPA on tap. I guess I'll just get a bottle."

 

Effing idiots. So, basically, you don't give two craps about what the beer tastes like, you just want it to say IPA, because that's what all the cool kids are drinking.

 

So, I have two choices if I don't want to continue to endure this crap.

1) Never serve anything that resembles an American IPA unless it actually says "IPA" in the name.

2) Waste two of my three tap handles on two beers that are really similar at the expense of actually offering some distinct choices so I can feature a delicious beer like Headwaters and still keep a precious-freaking "IPA" on tap.

 

It's like Pinot Noir all over again. Everyone wants to order Pinot, but the Pinots that sell best for us are the ones that taste like Syrah. People just want to think they're drinking Pinot because that's what the cool people apparently drink.

 

Sounds like your servers need a better script... "Tell you what, I'd be happy to pour you a free sample and if you don't like it, I'll get you that bottle."

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Sounds like your servers need a better script... "Tell you what, I'd be happy to pour you a free sample and if you don't like it, I'll get you that bottle."

I make as much money selling them bottles as I do beer on tap. That's actually one of the biggest myths about beer is that it's so much cheaper on tap. It's a better deal for the customer, but rarely for the restaurant or bar. That is, unless you're talking crap beer, then apparently the margins are great (though I wouldn't know for sure). But they're about the same for craft beer, and borderline once you take waste into account (which includes samples), of which there is none in bottles.

 

And that's for 1/2 barrels. 1/6 barrels are a freaking rip-off for me and I only buy them in two instances. Close-outs or when it's something super tricky that I can build my street cred with the geeks. Buying a 1/6 barrel of anything "normal" kills you. It's 1/3 the beer at 1/2 the price, but it's not like you can charge even an extra $1 a pint (which wouldn't even cover the margin) because every beer has its price and the consumer doesn't (and shouldn't) care that you're paying more for it because you don't have room for big kegs.

 

So, from a businessman's standpoint, I ultimately don't care what they order. In fact, if it's not the bartender, that free sample requires the waiter to go the bar, get a sample, bring it back, drop it off, come back and see what they like... All of this after they went through the "it tastes just like an IPA" deal that I described. After all, even if we go the route you suggest, it would still need to be preceded by some version of the discussion I laid out. We can skip that whole bit by just letting the customer have his IPA.

 

At any rate, I'm just venting as a beer geek here.

 

ETA: I get the value of turning someone on to something new and we do that often enough, if the customer meets us halfway on it. But the guy I described makes it pretty clear that he's too cool to drink anything else but a "real" IPA, so why fight it?

Edited by detlef

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Speaking of IPAs, I'm getting pretty effing sick of the herd mentality. We only have four taps and at least one of them always has some sort of one-off or unique deal, so I need to be careful about being redundant with the other three handles and try to cover as many bases as possible. Of course, given the popularity, I'll always have some sort of IPA-ish beer on tap (and, typically, it's not just IPA-ish, but actually a beer labeled as an IPA). Seems that's not enough for some. Right now, for instance, we have the Victory Headwaters Pale. Which, besides being about as delicious as it gets, may as well be an IPA. In fact, I'm rather certain that it's hoppier than almost any traditional English IPA.

 

At any rate, when people ask what our IPA on tap is, the servers are instructed to say we have the Victory Headwaters Pale which is pretty hoppy.

"Is it an IPA?"

"Technically it's labeled a Pale Ale, but like I said, it's pretty hoppy for a Pale Ale, so if you like IPAs, you'll probably like this. It uses 100% Citra hops and is really bright."

"I drink IPAs. You don't have an IPA on tap?"

"The closest thing we have is the Headwaters, but if you like IPAs, I bet you'll love it. It's actually hoppier than some IPAs"

"You should have an IPA on tap. I guess I'll just get a bottle."

 

Effing idiots. So, basically, you don't give two craps about what the beer tastes like, you just want it to say IPA, because that's what all the cool kids are drinking.

 

So, I have two choices if I don't want to continue to endure this crap.

1) Never serve anything that resembles an American IPA unless it actually says "IPA" in the name.

2) Waste two of my three tap handles on two beers that are really similar at the expense of actually offering some distinct choices so I can feature a delicious beer like Headwaters and still keep a precious-freaking "IPA" on tap.

 

It's like Pinot Noir all over again. Everyone wants to order Pinot, but the Pinots that sell best for us are the ones that taste like Syrah. People just want to think they're drinking Pinot because that's what the cool people apparently drink.

That's definitely true with those who want to do the "in" thing, but I think part of it is also that Pales tend to be so inconsistent compared to IPA's, especially with companies like Sweetwater toning them down even more for mass-marketing, while they leave their IPA for the hopheads. While Dales and Terrapin have great ones, but obviously you've tried disappointing ones like Left Hand Stranger, which was about as mediocre of a craft beer as you'll ever try.

 

I'd be open-minded to trust you or a knowledgeable server (and Headwaters is pretty delicious, BTW), but I can kind of understand not wanting to take a chance on one when you're paying $3+ a pop. I usually default to an IPA or stout for that reason, when I'm unsure about what beer I want to try.

Edited by delusions of granduer

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Speaking of IPAs, I'm getting pretty effing sick of the herd mentality. We only have four taps and at least one of them always has some sort of one-off or unique deal, so I need to be careful about being redundant with the other three handles and try to cover as many bases as possible. Of course, given the popularity, I'll always have some sort of IPA-ish beer on tap (and, typically, it's not just IPA-ish, but actually a beer labeled as an IPA). Seems that's not enough for some. Right now, for instance, we have the Victory Headwaters Pale. Which, besides being about as delicious as it gets, may as well be an IPA. In fact, I'm rather certain that it's hoppier than almost any traditional English IPA.

 

At any rate, when people ask what our IPA on tap is, the servers are instructed to say we have the Victory Headwaters Pale which is pretty hoppy.

"Is it an IPA?"

"Technically it's labeled a Pale Ale, but like I said, it's pretty hoppy for a Pale Ale, so if you like IPAs, you'll probably like this. It uses 100% Citra hops and is really bright."

"I drink IPAs. You don't have an IPA on tap?"

"The closest thing we have is the Headwaters, but if you like IPAs, I bet you'll love it. It's actually hoppier than some IPAs"

"You should have an IPA on tap. I guess I'll just get a bottle."

 

Effing idiots. So, basically, you don't give two craps about what the beer tastes like, you just want it to say IPA, because that's what all the cool kids are drinking.

 

So, I have two choices if I don't want to continue to endure this crap.

1) Never serve anything that resembles an American IPA unless it actually says "IPA" in the name.

2) Waste two of my three tap handles on two beers that are really similar at the expense of actually offering some distinct choices so I can feature a delicious beer like Headwaters and still keep a precious-freaking "IPA" on tap.

 

It's like Pinot Noir all over again. Everyone wants to order Pinot, but the Pinots that sell best for us are the ones that taste like Syrah. People just want to think they're drinking Pinot because that's what the cool people apparently drink.

...or the people who only drink "dark" beer.

...or the people who only drink red wine.

...or the people who only drink microbrews.

...or even the people who brag about loving food REALLY spicy or extra hot

 

etc etc etc. Yep. Morons. Sheeple. Trend whore losers. And I swear they're breeding like cockroaches. The funny part is IMO most likely know little to nothing about beer or wine but as you say are just trying to be "cool." I remember going to an IPA taste-test thing at the Flying Saucer down that way. Several people were bragging about how "it can't be too hoppy" or "this one is the best because it's the hoppiest" on and on. One waitress was amazed when she asked me if I wanted an IPA that was so hoppy it was ridiculous (I forget exactly how she put it) and I looked at her like she was crazy and went "no." :wacko: Oh well.

 

You should have just lied and said "yeah it's an IPA." The tard wouldn't have known the diff.

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Agree about the Megan Foxy dude, I see them at our homebrew club meetings. If you dedicate a tap to IPA's, you can always rotate in interesting/seasonal brews like Yellow Snow, Fresh Hop, Lagunitas Maximus, etc. there are a lot of good well balanced IPAs out that you could spend years before having to drink The same thing twice.

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Agree about the Megan Foxy dude, I see them at our homebrew club meetings. If you dedicate a tap to IPA's, you can always rotate in interesting/seasonal brews like Yellow Snow, Fresh Hop, Lagunitas Maximus, etc. there are a lot of good well balanced IPAs out that you could spend years before having to drink The same thing twice.

Certainly, it's just annoying that I basically have to ignore anything that's like an IPA but isn't actually called one or have two of my three "normal" handles dedicated to what amounts to two very similar beers.

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