stevegrab Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 For the record, they're ranked 19th in yards and 20th in scoring. Can I get an official definition of "potent"? Ok so maybe "potent" wasn't the right word. I just thought that BB's analysis of what Tebow's running does for the whole offense was accurate and fair. Even at that ranking they are in the top 2/3 of the league, and I suspect those numbers would be better since Tebow took over. While not great its hardly anemic like my Browns or some other teams (Rams, etc.) that I've seen play recently. I certainly didn't mean to step into the BB-detlef pissing contest. I'm no Tebow supporter, more on the detractor side as the last part of that post stated. As you pointed out they pull things out of their ass, get lucky mistakes by the other team and generally luck out at the end (when they win). I certainly hate the media hype over him as the next great player, it makes me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Fan Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Ok so maybe "potent" wasn't the right word. I just thought that BB's analysis of what Tebow's running does for the whole offense was accurate and fair. Even at that ranking they are in the top 2/3 of the league, and I suspect those numbers would be better since Tebow took over. While not great its hardly anemic like my Browns or some other teams (Rams, etc.) that I've seen play recently. I certainly didn't mean to step into the BB-detlef pissing contest. I'm no Tebow supporter, more on the detractor side as the last part of that post stated. As you pointed out they pull things out of their ass, get lucky mistakes by the other team and generally luck out at the end (when they win). I certainly hate the media hype over him as the next great player, it makes me Heeeeey, why drag us in to this? Not cool, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Heeeeey, why drag us in to this? Not cool, bro. Sorry man, I was just trying to think of another team who was bad on offense, and the last couple of times I saw the Rams they looked pretty bad. But you still have SJax and I think Bradford is a lot more polished than McCoy. Maybe if we combined our two offense (we've got some good OL) we could be potent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Fan Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Sorry man, I was just trying to think of another team who was bad on offense, and the last couple of times I saw the Rams they looked pretty bad. But you still have SJax and I think Bradford is a lot more polished than McCoy. Maybe if we combined our two offense (we've got some good OL) we could be potent. It's all good. If you've read my posts lately, you'd see that I have been talking about the Rams' historic ineptitude for a long time. I was just reading an article about the records for futility that group of sucks is about to set for this season. Amazing. Didn't mean to high-jack. Back to your regularly scheduled pissing match about whether Tebow is a bad QB or just a sorta-bad QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Favre4ever Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Only thing Teblow is gonna be doing on Sundays in a year or two is preaching at the local church....He's a gimmick QB and it's just a matter of time before the blueprint to stop him is laid out and his 4th quarter luck runs out...If Denver's Def. is average he loses all 9 games... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Only thing Teblow is gonna be doing on Sundays in a year or two is preaching at the local church....He's a gimmick QB and it's just a matter of time before the blueprint to stop him is laid out and his 4th quarter luck runs out...If Denver's Def. is average he loses all 9 games... They really bailed him out in that Oakland game. If you only drop 38 pts, and rack up 300 yds or rushing, you really shouldn't expect to win many games at the pro level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) So here's something more about the Denver offense: They're 27th in Time of Possession. That's not good. Mind you, I've often felt that TOP was about as useful a metric for an offense as W/L is for a pitcher. Accurate, except when it's not. After all, TOP not only depends on an offense's ability to eat up the clock, but also the defense's ability to prevent the opponent from doing the same. To make this a truly offensive stat, we should look at Time Per Possession. Specifically, how effective the offense is at doing their part in the TOP equation. Still not a perfect indication of offensive effectiveness, but better than simply looking at TOP. Oddly enough, this not something I could find on the interwebs. So I figured it out. Apparently, the average number of possessions per team per game in the NFL is 12. Over the last 9 games, Denver has had 13 per game. Houston, the #1 team in TOP has averaged 12 and Indy, last in TOP, has averaged 11.7. I didn't bother to look each and every team up. So, actually, in terms of what the offense brings to the table with regard to TOP, Denver's is not even as “good” as their 27th ranking would suggest. In fact, if you figure their Time Per Possession over this stretch, it's about 1 second better than that of Indy's. Something must be missing. Denver obviously isn't as ineffective offensively as Indy. They must gain more yards per play, so they're getting more for their money, so to speak. And you'd be right. Indy ranks 26th in yards per play at 4.9 and Denver ranks 23rd with 5.1. Racking up a full .2 yards more per play. That's about 7 inches. What makes all this TPP look even worse still, is the fact that Denver is a run-heavy team. Which means, they employ a style of offense that is inclined to make you eat up the clock. After all, three ineffective running plays and then a punt is still good for about 1:30. Probably about a full minute more than 3 incompletes and a punt. So to a degree, there’s another way their TOP or TTP isn’t even as “good” as it appears. Were I bolder than I am, I might suggest that the Broncos are basically Indy with a better D and less likely to turn it over. Edited December 22, 2011 by detlef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditkaless Wonders Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 So here's something more about the Denver offense: They're 27th in Time of Possession. That's not good. Mind you, I've often felt that TOP was about as useful a metric for an offense as W/L is for a pitcher. Accurate, except when it's not. After all, TOP not only depends on an offense's ability to eat up the clock, but also the defense's ability to prevent the opponent from doing the same. To make this a truly offensive stat, we should look at Time Per Possession. Specifically, how effective the offense is at doing their part in the TOP equation. Still not a perfect indication of offensive effectiveness, but better than simply looking at TOP. Oddly enough, this not something I could find on the interwebs. So I figured it out. Apparently, the average number of possessions per team per game in the NFL is 12. Over the last 9 games, Denver has had 13 per game. Houston, the #1 team in TOP has averaged 12 and Indy, last in TOP, has averaged 11.7. I didn't bother to look each and every team up. So, actually, in terms of what the offense brings to the table with regard to TOP, Denver's is not even as “good” as their 27th ranking would suggest. In fact, if you figure their Time Per Possession over this stretch, it's about 1 second better than that of Indy's. Something must be missing. Denver obviously isn't as ineffective offensively as Indy. They must gain more yards per play, so they're getting more for their money, so to speak. And you'd be right. Indy ranks 26th in yards per play at 4.9 and Denver ranks 23rd with 5.1. Racking up a full .2 yards more per play. That's about 7 inches. What makes all this TPP look even worse still, is the fact that Denver is a run-heavy team. Which means, they employ a style of offense that is inclined to make you eat up the clock. After all, three ineffective running plays and then a punt is still good for about 1:30. Probably about a full minute more than 3 incompletes and a punt. So to a degree, there’s another way their TOP or TTP isn’t even as “good” as it appears. Were I bolder than I am, I might suggest that the Broncos are basically Indy with a better D and less likely to turn it over. Be a Grizzly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelsosi Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 If Denver's Def. is average he loses all 9 games... Probably not. Because after losing the first 4 or 5 he would have been benched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Glad to see this thread got back to normal. Kill......the.....power........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Tell me what first atrracted you to Tebow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Dude, like I said before, I'm prepared to suspend the will he or won't he be good until there's more evidence on either side. I fully agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) If Denver's Def. is average he loses all 9 games... By the exact same logic, DEN loses 6 of those 7 wins over that span if Tebow doesn't move the team down the field with his running and passing for scores to put the team ahead, since those are the number of his come-from-behind victories. The guy is nails in the clutch and his 4th quarter passing stats are outstanding. I think the guy can play if they'd just take the training wheels off the first 3 quarters. But because it's been successful for the larger part so far, and it's pretty obvious there is a trust issue between the coaches and Tebow, we aren't likely to see that until the playoffs - if DEN makes it in - at the earliest and more probably next year. Edited December 24, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) Un-f'n-believable. Playoff berth on the line, and DEN again gets its head handed to it in the 2nd Quarter again. They simply refuse to throw the football in the 1st half, as is typical since Tebow has been starting. Tebow is 3 of 4, 2 passes in the 1st Q, 2 passes in the 2nd Q. Yeah - that play calling sure isn't a detriment to the offense moving the f'n ball and scoring at all, guys. What was I thinking? ETA - and they throw on the first play of the 3rd quarter and gain 32 yds on the f'n play. McCoy needs to move on and we have to get another OC. ETAA - and now Tebow throws for 3 of 4, 58 passing yds (more than twice as many passing yds as the entire 1st half), and a TD on the first drive of the 3rd Quarter. Edited December 24, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelsosi Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I like how you're setting things up so you can blame a possible loss on the coaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbpfan1231 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 His passes look horrible today - the passes he is completing the guys are wide wide open and he is still under throwing and floating ducks. He looks bad today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I like how you're setting things up so you can blame a possible loss on the coaching. How can that kind of coaching not be a significant factor in DEN's lack of offensive production until the 4th quarter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 His passes look horrible today - the passes he is completing the guys are wide wide open and he is still under throwing and floating ducks. He looks bad today. He must be on the naughty list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) I like how you're setting things up so you can blame a possible loss on the coaching. Any knowledgeable NFL fan can clearly see that the OC does not trust Tebow in the first half. 6 passing plays in the first half???? Then he comes out in the 2nd half and starts hitting WR's because they are playing from behind? Cmon man...don't let the BB Nuthugging get into your line of thinking. BTW BB...ya really need to put the Nuthugger status in your sig. It's pretty much a given you're THE Tim Tebow :Nuthugger: of the Huddle. ETA Part II: Didn't register the sarcasm. Edited December 24, 2011 by tazinib1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelsosi Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Relax. I said it in jest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Relax. I said it in jest. Yeah I know...didn't register the Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Relax. I said it in jest. I figured. I'm just really frustrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbpfan1231 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I figured. I'm just really frustrated. He looked good last week but this week looks absolutely terrible. He can't even throw a spiral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNOWBOUND33 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 He must be on the naughty list. Absolutely on the naughty list. Santa > Jesus?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwacked Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 If the coaching staff would have opened it up sooner, Tebow wouldn't be throwing so horribly when his line is giving him 10 Mississippi's in the 2nd half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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