Pedophile at Penn State?

[millerx]

I'm not just talking about being technically "covered" legally. Again knowing the guy for as long as he did and THINKING he knew him very well, he probably figured it was a false accusation. They do happen yknow, esp towards high profile people. If someone accused someone you have known for a long time and feel highly about and trust about something like this and the accuser you didn't know at all and had no evidence, how much stock would you put into it? Like most people I'm betting probably none. Again it's easy to point fingers now. How many people thought OJ was the kind of guy who would go all psycho like he did? Basically nobody, he was considered a model guy and class act all the way. To try and rip to shreds anyone within the periphery like some witch hunt just sounds like overreaction to me due to the highly sensitive topic.

ummmm... there was an eyewitness from a guy he coached and was working with, not some random joe schmo.

 

So in your scenario, even if it was someone I had known for a long time and felt highly about and trust... ya, I'd at least follow up on it. Especially if that someone came to me and said " hey, you know your 50 year old buddy, ya, I just saw him in the shower with a 10 year old boy".

 

Your argument just doesn't fly.

Edited November 9, 2011 by millerx

[wildcat2334]

ummmm... there was an eyewitness from a guy you coached and are working with, not some random joe schmo.

 

So in your scenario, even if it was someone I had known for a long time and felt highly about and trust... ya, I'd at least follow up on it. Especially is someone came to me and said " hey, you know your 50 year old buddy, ya, I just saw him in the shower with a 10 year old boy".

 

Your argument just doesn't fly.

 

don't even bother - dude is a moran.

 

he prefaces his post with " I haven't read much about this....."

[bigrocks]

As fans, I think we all agree that college football has taken another huge hit this week… one that makes all other bad behavior over the past couple of years pale in comparison. What is happening at PSU is hard to fathom. We are witnessing the real time implosion of the one program everyone agreed was the model to live by. At least that’s what we all thought.

 

I have never been a fan of State, though I did respect the program and the team. My ex-wife was an alum and absolutely LOVED the school, the town, the football team, and most of all JoePa. I visited Happy Valley a couple of times with her and it struck me as the ideal college town and a great place to be a student. I can’t image what she and all fans, students, alum are going through as all this comes crashing down.

 

That said, everyone involved in this saga should be fired immediately.... McQueary, the AD, the school President, and yes Paterno. We are not talking about a couple of baseless accusations or some nameless assistant coach fooling around with one of the secretaries behind his wife's back, or a booster paying for a recruit’s lap dance. As someone mentioned, these are felony charges dating back a number of years involving a Grand Jury. Heinous crimes against multiple children. There is no defense. No place to hide. Sandusky was Paterno's right hand guy for years and was tapped to be JoePa's heir... wonder why that went south? I think we know now. Instead of immediately calling the police or any state law enforcement, they “handled” it internally… tried to keep a lid on it so as to not tarnish the Penn State image. Well its been tainted irrevocably now.

 

I read in one column that the remainder of PSU’s season should be cancelled and initially thought that was excessive, but after thinking it through perhaps that isn’t such a bad way for the university to bring some rationality to this situation..

[lions suck]

As fans, I think we all agree that college football has taken another huge hit this week… one that makes all other bad behavior over the past couple of years pale in comparison. What is happening at PSU is hard to fathom. We are witnessing the real time implosion of the one program everyone agreed was the model to live by. At least that’s what we all thought.

 

I have never been a fan of State, though I did respect the program and the team. My ex-wife was an alum and absolutely LOVED the school, the town, the football team, and most of all JoePa. I visited Happy Valley a couple of times with her and it struck me as the ideal college town and a great place to be a student. I can’t image what she and all fans, students, alum are going through as all this comes crashing down.

 

That said, everyone involved in this saga should be fired immediately.... McQueary, the AD, the school President, and yes Paterno. We are not talking about a couple of baseless accusations or some nameless assistant coach fooling around with one of the secretaries behind his wife's back, or a booster paying for a recruit’s lap dance. As someone mentioned, these are felony charges dating back a number of years involving a Grand Jury. Heinous crimes against multiple children. There is no defense. No place to hide. Sandusky was Paterno's right hand guy for years and was tapped to be JoePa's heir... wonder why that went south? I think we know now. Instead of immediately calling the police or any state law enforcement, they “handled” it internally… tried to keep a lid on it so as to not tarnish the Penn State image. Well its been tainted irrevocably now.

 

I read in one column that the remainder of PSU’s season should be cancelled and initially thought that was excessive, but after thinking it through perhaps that isn’t such a bad way for the university to bring some rationality to this situation..

 

 

 

Great post Big Rock! I couldn't agree more except with the part about cancelling the season. The ball players are innocent and deserve their shot at the Big Ten title...they had nothing to do with this fiasco! I'm a Michigan fan but I still feel for those players on the Ummm...Lions. LOL! EDITED TO MEAN WITH DIFFERENT COACHES.

 

I'm truly surprised that no deviant Huddler has made the crude joke about "hung"...When it comes to the horsing around quote. WOW. Looks like the huddle forums are finally getting some class!

 

OK, in all seriousness heads MUST roll...starting with the prez and working its way down to Mc Rib or whatever. Golden Rule...DO NOT FARK WITH CHILDREN, NO MATTER WHAT!!!!

Edited November 9, 2011 by lions suck

[MojoMan]

PSU to create a special committee to investigate Friday.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/09/justice/penn....html?hpt=hp_c1

 

Why wait until Friday? It might be for appearance sake only (presumably the PA AG and Grand Jury have already investigated), but I would have burned the midnlight oil, put something together on Monday, when the SHTF, and launched my own internal investigation first thing Tuesday.

[BeeR]

was a Grand Jury investigation. So why don't you read a little more about what was presented to the Grand Jury (as in the investigation has pretty much already happened). So there is a great amount of corroborated information from police interviewed witnesses.

 

There is a link on this page to a .pdf of the attoorney general's presentation.

Had not read the GJ thing (as I basically implied initially) - have read now, thx.

 

 

even if it was someone I had known for a long time and felt highly about and trust... ya, I'd at least follow up on it.

He did. He reported it to the guy he was supposed to report it to, who he assumed would handle it properly. Not saying he's faultless and agree he should have been more aggressive about following it up, just don't think he should be burned at the stake. Sandusky should, as should the AD and VP.

 

 

don't even bother - dude is a moran.

 

he prefaces his post with " I haven't read much about this....."

Yes I admitted I hadn't read a lot about it in my initial post. Congrats on being able to read. Your abilities to present a valid counter-argument - not to mention your spelling abilities - need a bit of work though Einstein.

 

Anyway, sad and horrible regardless of where the ax falls. I do think Paterno should be allowed to finish out the season for various reasons but no more. And I will say I think PSU should get the "death penalty" after that.

 

bigrocks great post btw.

Edited November 9, 2011 by BeeR

[detlef]

Had not read the GJ thing (as I basically implied initially) - have read now, thx.

 

 

 

He did. He reported it to the guy he was supposed to report it to, who he assumed would handle it properly. Not saying he's faultless and agree he should have been more aggressive about following it up, just don't think he should be burned at the stake. Sandusky should, as should the AD and VP.

 

 

 

Yes I admitted I hadn't read a lot about it in my initial post. Congrats on being able to read. Your abilities to present a valid counter-argument - not to mention your spelling abilities - need a bit of work though Einstein.

 

Anyway, sad and horrible regardless of where the ax falls. I do think Paterno should be allowed to finish out the season for various reasons but no more. And I will say I think PSU should get the "death penalty" after that.

 

bigrocks great post btw.

He reported it, but didn't follow up on it. That's the issue. Well, that and anyone who pretends that the AD is "his boss". Sure, Paterno satisfied his legal obligation to report the offense to "his boss". It's jut that none of us are buying that he should be even remotely off the hook here. He is Penn State football. If he truly cared, he would have done more than simply say, "Oh, by the way, one of my main assistants was apparently fondling a little boy in the shower. Could you make sure we take care of this?" And then just move on? What about the next time he saw him on campus? Would that warrant a follow up with the AD? "Hey, btw, I noticed Sandusky is still around. What ever happened to that whole fondling of kids thing?"

[Rockerbraves]

If I were a betting man...my money would go on Paterno losing his job. This can not be allowed

[Square]

He did. He reported it to the guy he was supposed to report it to, who he assumed would handle it properly. Not saying he's faultless and agree he should have been more aggressive about following it up, just don't think he should be burned at the stake.

I tell you what, I'm going to hate any individual that walks in on a 60 year old performing sexual acts on a 10 year old boy and doesn't immediately stop what was going on. A 20 something x-football player should have kicked his ass first and asked questions later. I'm fine with him reporting it up the chain, but I damn sure wouldn't have just walked out the door and not said chit until the next day. I live in a self report state where it is illegal to not contact the cops if you see something like this going on. To me it's stupid they have to even make a law about it, but apparently there are some chicken chit mofos out there that are too worried about their careers or programs to do what's right in a very black and white scenario. There is no gray area in old dudes messing with boys. Mcqueary should have stopped it and called the cops. Anything less is unacceptable and if I ran Penn State they would all be on leave until this chit gets sorted out and criminal charges are held against all people that tried to cover this up.

[detlef]

I tell you what, I'm going to hate any individual that walks in on a 60 year old performing sexual acts on a 10 year old boy and doesn't immediately stop what was going on. A 20 something x-football player should have kicked his ass first and asked questions later. I'm fine with him reporting it up the chain, but I damn sure wouldn't have just walked out the door and not said chit until the next day. I live in a self report state where it is illegal to not contact the cops if you see something like this going on. To me it's stupid they have to even make a law about it, but apparently there are some chicken chit mofos out there that are too worried about their careers or programs to do what's right in a very black and white scenario. There is no gray area in old dudes messing with boys. Mcqueary should have stopped it and called the cops. Anything less is unacceptable and if I ran Penn State they would all be on leave until this chit gets sorted out and criminal charges are held against all people that tried to cover this up.

That's the thing. This isn't catching some guy, oh, I don't know, selling his jersey for a tattoo. That's the sort of thing you "run up the chain" because you're supposed to. You hope nothing comes of it because it means a valuable player gets suspended, but it's not like the end of the freaking world if nothing ever comes of it. I mean, everyone is doing it, right?

 

But this molesting children! So, yeah BeeR, some of us are really letting the severity of the crime get to us. BECAUSE WE DAMNED WELL SHOULD BE! It's molesting children! About as horrible a crime as one can commit. It's the crime that gets you ass-raped in prison because even hardened criminals think you're trash.

 

So, anyone who didn't drop everything and do everything in their power to make sure that this case was priority #1 failed in their obligation as a human to protect the young. It's really that simple.

 

What this also points to is the oft-referred lack of institutional control. Not letting the guy who saw this off the hook, because I agree 100% with Square, kick the perv's ass first, ask questions later. But the very fact that he apparently thought it best to handle this discretely, coupled with the fact that apparently his instincts were "correct" in this case, because that's exactly how his superiors handled it once they got the news, says far too much about the priorities in place. Or, rather, lack thereof.

Edited November 9, 2011 by detlef

[i_am_the_swammi]

He reported it, but didn't follow up on it. That's the issue. Well, that and anyone who pretends that the AD is "his boss". Sure, Paterno satisfied his legal obligation to report the offense to "his boss". It's jut that none of us are buying that he should be even remotely off the hook here. He is Penn State football. If he truly cared, he would have done more than simply say, "Oh, by the way, one of my main assistants was apparently fondling a little boy in the shower. Could you make sure we take care of this?" And then just move on? What about the next time he saw him on campus? Would that warrant a follow up with the AD? "Hey, btw, I noticed Sandusky is still around. What ever happened to that whole fondling of kids thing?"

 

Agree with a lot of this.

 

The more disgusting thing to me is that, after Paterno did the legally correct thing, and nothing came of it, its been widely reported now that there were instances in subsequent years where Sandusky continued to bring children to the practices. I mean really...you are McQueary or Paterno, you're holding practices, and Sandusky shows up on the dielines with another child? Further, you have full knowledge that Sandusky is continuing to hold his camps at PSU stellite campuses, even after he has been banned from main campus?

 

Some other nuggets that have come out via the Grand Jury report: McQueary, when he first witnessed the act, immediately called his father (rather than rush to help the boy). His father's initial reaction: "Get the hell out of there and come to the house". Are you freakin kidding me? Not "Go help that little boy", or "Call 911"...just leave and come to the house? BTW, the older McQueary is very good friends with Sandusky. Sickening.

 

The question posed on the local talk shows here in PA (you can imagine its been non-stop, 24 hours here in Philly): If McQueary, Paterno, the admins...anyone who had knowledge of this sicko's action....if this wasn't a random 10-year old, but a son/grandson of yours that was being violated and reported to you....would your actions have been different? if the answer is yes, then the whole bunch should be suspended or fired immediately. Because its painfully obvious that your inaction was due to the concern of factoring in the reputation of the university...which should have been the last thing on the minds of those involved.

[MojoMan]

Paterno to retire at END OF SEASON

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefootball/s...ad-coach-110911

 

Any thoughts why he doesn't step down now?

Edited November 9, 2011 by MojoMan

[Square]

Agree with a lot of this.

 

The more disgusting thing to me is that, after Paterno did the legally correct thing, and nothing came of it, its been widely reported now that there were instances in subsequent years where Sandusky continued to bring children to the practices. I mean really...you are McQueary or Paterno, you're holding practices, and Sandusky shows up on the dielines with another child? Further, you have full knowledge that Sandusky is continuing to hold his camps at PSU stellite campuses, even after he has been banned from main campus?

I think the really weird/troubling/damning thing is that they had some kind of ban on him bringing children to the PSU campus (apparently not satellite spots though). I mean, isn't it pretty telling that you have to even make that kind of a ban? If the powers that be would have turned this sicko over immediately and kicked him off the campus this wouldn't be a black eye for the university or the sports program (at least not a lasting one). I mean, they didn't make him a sick fracker, but you have to have your chit all screwed up to even think that this is something worth covering up. Heck, on some level I understand trying to protect a player getting a discount on tattoos because it's basically a victimless crime but this chit is so beyond the pale it's mindboggling that an AD, Pres, and a historical icon of a coach could get together and decide that it is better to try to protect the university's honor than throw some sick fracker to the wolves.

[Rockerbraves]

Paterno to retire at END OF SEASON

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefootball/s...ad-coach-110911

 

Any thoughts why he doesn't step down now?

Not making excuses for the old man, however old guys like Paterno grew up in an age where this kind of crap was swept under the table. I remember teasing one of my Old Uncles about Patero's age when he told me they could not afford bathing suits and would swim naked at the YMCA. To me that likely means there was some pervert in charge.

[otis29]

I heard someone on the radio make a very simple comment - that Penn State officials were more concerned with protecting the school than protecting the potential victims of a pedophile. I think that sums it up perfectly.

 

There are very few stories I can recall that anger me as completely as this one. Anyone who hasn't read the grand jury testimony should do so. This is a level of evil that defies belief.

 

Paterno and McQueary should be gone TODAY. Replace Spanier (who made perhaps the dumbest comment ever when he offered his support to Schultz and Curley), and have the new President investigate as deeply as necessary and fire any person who had any knowledge of this. Zero tolerance, you have to clean house. Any person, even on the fringes of knowledge of the case, could have contacted the authorities and prevented the abuse of further victims a long time ago - GONE. Those people are lucky not to be facing prosecution, so they are getting off easily by just being fired IMO.

 

I can't imagine how pissed off I'd be today if I had a child that dealt with Sandusky in any manner after 2002. And if you knew your child had been victimized? I'd sue every SOB involved for every penny they have, including the university itself.

[Trojanmojo]

That Paterno should be allowed to coach out the rest of the season is inexusable. Ped State's level of utter incompetence in handling this affair is astounding. Time to dish out the death penalty to that program. If EVER that was a legit reason to do so, this is it.

[Chief Dick]

Man, the more I hear about this story the more it makes me sick. Those effing people.....God when I think about how many kids could have been saved from going through these horrible experiences if these damn adults would have just acted like human beings and put a stop to it when they had the chance.

 

Edited November 9, 2011 by Chief Dick

[rajncajn]

Man, the more I hear about this story the more it makes me sick. Those effing people.....God when I think about how many kids could have been saved from going through these horrible experiences if these damn adults would have just acted like human beings and put a stop to it when they had the chance.

 

Agree with this 100%

[Ursa Majoris]

If ever there was an example of how extended existence in a cloistered and rarefied environment can change one's outlook, this is it. College is one of those environments where after several years it can take on the characteristics of a living, breathing thing and the long-time resident / employee will do just about anything to defend it.

 

Long-time politicians and lifer military people sometimes exhibit something similar - the institution becomes everything.

[otis29]

Man, the more I hear about this story the more it makes me sick. Those effing people.....God when I think about how many kids could have been saved from going through these horrible experiences if these damn adults would have just acted like human beings and put a stop to it when they had the chance.

 

"Saved" is so much the correct word here. That abuse has/will continue to damage the victims in every facet of their lives, and will potentially affect their kids and their kids' kids.

 

Funny, I just heard Mike Ditka's comments from a local radio show last night - he thinks everyone should get off Paterno's case because he "did what he was supposed to" and "he's not a babysitter".

 

What kind of human beings really think this way? I can't imagine thinking this if I were a 20 year-old PSU fan, or an 80 year-old man who knew nothing of Joe Paterno.

[Ursa Majoris]

"Saved" is so much the correct word here. That abuse has/will continue to damage the victims in every facet of their lives, and will potentially affect their kids and their kids' kids.

 

Funny, I just heard Mike Ditka's comments from a local radio show last night - he thinks everyone should get off Paterno's case because he "did what he was supposed to" and "he's not a babysitter".

 

What kind of human beings really think this way? I can't imagine thinking this if I were a 20 year-old PSU fan, or an 80 year-old man who knew nothing of Joe Paterno.

I should have included professional sports in my post above. Ditka is displaying the same symptoms - the institution is everything.

[otis29]

I should have included professional sports in my post above. Ditka is displaying the same symptoms - the institution is everything.

Just heard Ditka's clip again. He'd disappointed in what the media's doing to poor Joe.

[millerx]

If, and I mean IF, Penn State fails to do the the right thing yet again, and allows JoePa to coach this weekend instead of firing him... What should be the reaction from the fans?

 

Personally, I'd like to see a grassroots boycott of all games until he's fired. Nobody show up to the game and wind up with a stadium of only a thousand or so "head in the ground" types.

 

Other options I could see... a large round of boo's and some toilet paper throwing when JoePa's name is announced over the speaker system or have everyone turn their backs.

 

I think someone asked why JoePa is allowed to coach... Well, it's because he is still the BMOC... Still!! I can't believe they are even affording him the ability to announce he will finish out the season. He lost that privilege along with his respect and shouldn't be allowed to make that call or announcement. This call should be made by his nuttless "boss" and that announcement should be that his services are no longer needed.

 

Why would he want to "coach" anyway? I mean, he really doesn't coach, he just sits up in the press box. I heard he doesn't even go to the locker room at half time anymore ( to make halftime adjusts, speeches, etc). What's the point? He has about as much of effect sitting on his couch at home as he does from the press box.

 

He said its because he cares about the players and the University. Ummm... No! This game is Senior Day for the players. It's their day! It's suppose to be about them. Him showing up cancels all that and it becomes about JoePa. If he truly cared about the players, he would stay away and let them have as little distraction as possible.

 

I think maybe he has unwittingly bought into his own importance, failing to realize he just doesn't matter at this point.

Edited November 10, 2011 by millerx

[bigrocks]

If I were a PSU fan, how could I in good conscience stand in that stadium and applaud Joe Paterno in his last home game knowing what we now know, or worse, not knowing what we don’t know?? Talk about conflict… that would tear me up. What should be the final celebration of arguably the greatest coach in college football history takes on a completely different perspective. Scandal… criminal inaction… a far-reaching deficiency in leadership. If he does take the field Saturday, you can count on the media circus being absurd.

 

Part of the issue here; Pennsylvania State University is a very powerful entity and exists in its own little bubble in the middle of nowhere… and it controls everything within those confines. JoePa became the figure head of all things related to Penn State, and is surrounded by people whose sole purpose is to make things simple and comfortable for him. Think drones and queen bee. Let’s face it, his decades long success on the football field became an industry and PSU profited from that stability in dollars and prestige. Outside of Happy Valley, PA the world spins a bit differently, so it’s not surprising the speed and gravity of this situation eclipsed what the powers at PSU were able or willing to cope with.

 

So, now they are faced with the very situation they tried so hard to avoid: Do we pull everyone into the castle walls and try to wait out a siege, or do we submit to outside pressure, sacrifice our monarch and risk alienating the local masses who have come to adore him and depend on his presence?

[Trojanmojo]

If, and I mean IF, Penn State fails to do the the right thing yet again, and allows JoePa to coach this weekend instead of firing him... What should be the reaction from the fans?

 

Personally, I'd like to see a grassroots boycott of all games until he's fired. Nobody show up to the game and wind up with a stadium of only a thousand or so "head in the ground" types.

 

Other options I could see... a large round of boo's and some toilet paper throwing when JoePa's name is announced over the speaker system or have everyone turn their backs.

 

I think someone asked why JoePa is allowed to coach... Well, it's because he is still the BMOC... Still!! I can't believe they are even affording him the ability to announce he will finish out the season. He lost that privilege along with his respect and shouldn't be allowed to make that call or announcement. This call should be made by his nuttless "boss" and that announcement should be that his services are no longer needed.

 

Why would he want to "coach" anyway? I mean, he really doesn't coach, he just sits up in the press box. I heard he doesn't even go to the locker room at half time anymore ( to make halftime adjusts, speeches, etc). What's the point? He has about as much of effect sitting on his couch at home as he does from the press box.

 

He said its because he cares about the players and the University. Ummm... No! This game is Senior Day for the players. It's their day! It's suppose to be about them. Him showing up cancels all that and it becomes about JoePa. If he truly cared about the players, he would stay away and let them have as little distraction as possible.

 

I think maybe he has unwittingly bought into his own importance, failing to realize he just doesn't matter at this point.

 

You nailed it. To me, him insisting on continuing to coach is the ultimate F U to the country and narcissistic in the highest. Joe Pa needs to go right now. If it was about his players, he'd leave now and take the dark cloud away from the players and keep it over his head. It's not his players fault he didn't have the moral compass to tell the police about what went on. What, he didn't notice Sandusky was still coming around almost a decade after the 2002 charges were levied? Really? Take off Joe!