xInconnu Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 So I am the commissioner of a 12 team fraternity league. Everyone is very personally connected and sees every member frequently. The league was created two years ago for a test run and then I took it over last year with a ton of changes (standard-> .5ppr, nfl->espn, free -> buy in, no reward -> trophy and jersey, no keepers -> keepers). This year we will be keeping most of the changes, however there was an issue with keepers that will lead into my main question. We never decided how keepers would be kept (huge oversite I know). We didn't think about it until the off season, and then the voting for how it would be done (2 round penalty VS. just keep 2 then draft the rest of your team) was controlled entirely by bias. Owner with Mccoy and T.Y. wants to keep them and then draft, the guys who drafted D Murray and Gordon in the 5th and 6th want round penalties, etc. So after much discussion we decided to not do keepers for this year and then vote on which system to use for keepers pre draft this year. Now during the season, when keepers were still going to happen, one member of the league was mathematically eliminated from playoffs before our trade deadline (thanksgiving) hit. He then sold off Dak Prescott to our Taco for a 4th round pick, and traded Doug Baldwin to me for a 4th round pick and Jarvis Landry. Both of those trades were made with intentions of keeping the teaded for players. I ended up going on to win the league, in no small part due to Baldwin putting up 30 points in the finale. The new Dak owner did not make the playoffs. The player who traded away the players for future picks got 12th (last) place. With that backstory, here is the issue. Since we are not doing keepers, and those trades were made specifically for keepers, there is a thought by myself and the new Dak owner (as well as some bystanders) that the picks should not be granted to the last place finisher. However the last place finisher is obviously strongly opposed to that, as he got last place (in his mind) because of these trades he made (the punishment for last place is the league votes on a Name change for the last place team). He does not want to pay league fees unless he is awarded his picks for the trades (as they went through the 24 hour vetoed process and passed). I am not sure what to do, and obviously I can not decided without some bias. I have considered not taking picks from anyone and giving the last place team a compensatory 4th round pick (where he picks an extra player at the end of the 4th in between the turn). Or just giving him my pick (as his player essentially won me the league) and giving the Dak owner their pick back. However, I am not sure what the best course of action is. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for reading TLDR: League was doing keepers, is no longer. During time when keepers were happening 2 teams traded 2017 4th round picks for players from the same team. One of those teams won the league. Since no longer doing keepers, teams want their picks back (wanted to keep players they traded for). Not sure what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
millworkguy Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 Trade has to stand. You won and got the carrot by selling off your future, the other owner only had 1/12 of the vote to eliminate the keepers, can't take back trades as the league voted to change the rules. Rule changes will happen every year, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xInconnu Posted July 6, 2017 Author Share Posted July 6, 2017 51 minutes ago, millworkguy said: can't take back trades as the league voted to change the rules. Rule changes will happen every yea This makes a lot of sense to me. Have to set the standard that whatever happens happens and cant be taken away when a rule changes that is related to the action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted July 15, 2017 Share Posted July 15, 2017 (edited) Just the opposite. The trades were made in good faith based on a sole desire to gather potential keepers. That was the plan and expectation. If there was a chance of abandoning the future keeper plan, the guy wouldn't have made the trades. He has to get his picks back. If you abandon a plan after GMs already acted on the promise of it, then the only fair thing is a complete do over for everyone. People make important draft pick decisions in year 1 of a new Keeper league. Since you decided to change the plan for 2017 after a GM made future draft pick decisions based on it, he either gets his picks back or you should let him have those keepers. Look, it seems that the league realized its own negligence in not working out keeper rules in advance and that led to a decision to start the keeper process over from scratch. That means a clean slate, including all picks. Either give him his picks back or let him keep the players he traded with the intention of keeping. You cant fk him over like that. He should quit if you do. Edited July 16, 2017 by Dcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Country Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 On 7/14/2017 at 9:40 PM, Dcat said: Just the opposite. The trades were made in good faith based on a sole desire to gather potential keepers. That was the plan and expectation. If there was a chance of abandoning the future keeper plan, the guy wouldn't have made the trades. He has to get his picks back. If you abandon a plan after GMs already acted on the promise of it, then the only fair thing is a complete do over for everyone. People make important draft pick decisions in year 1 of a new Keeper league. Since you decided to change the plan for 2017 after a GM made future draft pick decisions based on it, he either gets his picks back or you should let him have those keepers. Look, it seems that the league realized its own negligence in not working out keeper rules in advance and that led to a decision to start the keeper process over from scratch. That means a clean slate, including all picks. Either give him his picks back or let him keep the players he traded with the intention of keeping. You cant fk him over like that. He should quit if you do. This - you have essentially voted to reset the league by going with no keepers, which means the league should be reset. Draft fresh this year with a clean slate for everybody, with more robust rules in place to hopefully prevent this kind of situation from reoccurring. One general rule that I think is good is that most rules adopted in keeper leagues that have a major affect on player values (scoring and keeper rules in particular come to mind) are not enacted until the season following the year they are adopted. For example, if you were not a PPR league but voted to become one, that would not go into effect until after this current season as teams were built under the current rules, and usually votes for things like scoring and keeper rules and made along the lines that are most beneficial to an individual and not to the league as a whole. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8rattoon Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Agreed with Big Country. You have to re-draft. If you want to start with keepers going forward, set ALL the keeper details prior to the draft. Keepers affect the draft, but nobody knew the details regarding rds lost, etc., set BEFORE the draft, and thus nobody incorporated that into their drafting strategy. As a result, you have the issue with the McCoy-TY owner and the Gordon-Murray owner. If you went ahead with keepers this year, one of them would be screwed and could argue that they would have drafted differently had they known the keeper rules in advance. Help me out? http://forums.thehuddle.com/topic/485653-keeper-question-whir/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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