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steelers fans/those who have watched alot of the steelers this year....Martavis


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alright guys...admittedly ive caught maybe about 5 minutes of the steelers this year...which is odd for me....

 

ive followed the gamecasts from time to time as I'm a martavis owner and have been a big believer in his talent for some time now....but just haven't seen much of whats going on....

 

now let me ask....are the steelers using martavis in the right way? are they treating him like a potential stud WR that he could potentially be? or are they limiting his potential with misusage?

 

what I mean is....with his size/speed combo and overall ability are they paying attention to him when hes running intermediate routes? ive heard/read on boards that hes missed 3-4 real deep balls that just missed and could have been big plays....always nice to see them taking shots deep....but a lot of times I also see them throwing quick hitter screens and stuff like that to him also...and of course sunday on the first series they give him a carry

 

I realize that with an animal like Antonio and a beast like bell there is a lot of demand for balls with those two guys......but is it possible that rather than being an option or a focal point...they are treating Bryant more like a gimmick type of guy? and maybe that is part of his frustration? just asking...cause I haven't seen really any steelers action this year

 

a guy like Bryant could be better with more diversity in his targets ...from short, intermediate to deep balls...but it seems like the opportunities are scarce and might be more gimmicky at quick glance

 

am I completely wrong here? or are they giving him opportunities in the intermediate range/routes and they just aren't connecting?

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The problem is not his talent, its his piss poor attitude. It all started at the draft when they took JuJu

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/look-martavis-bryant-tweets-that-steelers-draft-pick-is-sammie-coates-replacement/

 

He was suspended all of 2016 for drug violation

 

He even goes Josh Norman v Dez Bryant on him in instagram

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2017/10/23/Steelers-Martavis-Bryant-takes-to-Twitter-complain-rip-rookie-teammate-JuJu-Smith-Schuster/stories/201710230102

 

Read a few of the articles or see some of his tweets bellow, its toxic and Pittsburg needs to do something about it.

http://bleacherreport.com/pittsburgh-steelers

 

When I was younger an old timer at work "You may be the most talented employee in the room with the most potential, but those two trait aren't always what matters. Attitude, attendance, and effort will always be looked at first."

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18 minutes ago, jamesplante11 said:

The problem is not his talent, its his piss poor attitude. It all started at the draft when they took JuJu

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/look-martavis-bryant-tweets-that-steelers-draft-pick-is-sammie-coates-replacement/

 

He was suspended all of 2016 for drug violation

 

He even goes Josh Norman v Dez Bryant on him in instagram

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2017/10/23/Steelers-Martavis-Bryant-takes-to-Twitter-complain-rip-rookie-teammate-JuJu-Smith-Schuster/stories/201710230102

 

Read a few of the articles or see some of his tweets bellow, its toxic and Pittsburg needs to do something about it.

http://bleacherreport.com/pittsburgh-steelers

 

When I was younger an old timer at work "You may be the most talented employee in the room with the most potential, but those two trait aren't always what matters. Attitude, attendance, and effort will always be looked at first."

I'm aware he was suspended last year lol...thanks

 

by all accounts ive heard he has worked hard in practice and that hasn't been a problem.....read a bunch of stuff this offseason about him actually working out now and eating healthy

 

his attitude def stinks right now and is earning negative attention

 

but what I'm talking about is a usage problem...or a proper usage problem

 

to me pitt likes to throw him short quick hitters and hope he breaks a tackle...or they like to let him loose and take deep shots with low percentage throws

 

this is a guy, one former defensive lineman said, might actually be the most talented/gifted between him, brown and bell

 

this guy should be selling post routes and hitting deep comebacks....or selling a post route and breaking it off and working the middle of the field.......martavis can play..hes not a one trick pony...and from what I can gather that might be the problem....they are feeding brown and bell...and sort of pigeon holing martavis ...I think that might be the source of his frustration

 

but I'm not sure as I haven't watched a lot of pitt...hardly any......my feeling is that martavis is versatile enough in his skills/game that he can be a #1 if he were focused on and given that type of attention ....now I don't expect him to be a #1 in pitt...that's brown all day.....but it seems like pitt treats him like a "toy" rather than a receiver....I dunno...maybe I'm wrong

Edited by forever in debt to mo lewis
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In the first 2 weeks he was getting looks but big ben was always just an inch or 2 off. Since then hes been a distraction with his trade demands n criticism of his own teammates. Last 2 games martavis seemed to not even try. Plus his ball location skills seem to have evaporated. Talented yes, but wickedly under performs on the field and off, kind a seems like a Dill Josh Gordon.

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45 minutes ago, forever in debt to mo lewis said:

 

 

but what I'm talking about is a usage problem...or a proper usage problem

 

to me pitt likes to throw him short quick hitters and hope he breaks a tackle...or they like to let him loose and take deep shots with low percentage throws

 

this is a guy, one former defensive lineman said, might actually be the most talented/gifted between him, brown and bell

 

this guy should be selling post routes and hitting deep comebacks....or selling a post route and breaking it off and working the middle of the field.......martavis can play..hes not a one trick pony...and from what I can gather that might be the problem....they are feeding brown and bell...and sort of pigeon holing martavis ...I think that might be the source of his frustration

 

but I'm not sure as I haven't watched a lot of pitt...hardly any......my feeling is that martavis is versatile enough in his skills/game that he can be a #1 if he were focused on and given that type of attention ....now I don't expect him to be a #1 in pitt...that's brown all day.....but it seems like pitt treats him like a "toy" rather than a receiver....I dunno...maybe I'm wrong

 

That's the point Clarke was trying to make... his opportunity is directly correlated to his attitude, and he's not in Ben's or Tomlin's good graces right now.  Furthest thing from that right now.

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2 minutes ago, kdko said:

 

That's the point Clarke was trying to make... his opportunity is directly correlated to his attitude, and he's not in Ben's or Tomlin's good graces right now.  Furthest thing from that right now.

like i said...by the accounts ive heard he has been practicing hard.......now that would be an indication that his attitude stunk....dogging it in practice or batting down balls ala brandon marshall

 

I think what Bryant is saying is "guys I can be AJ green...why do u insist on using me like I'm percy harvin.....we kicked 5 fgs sunday...lets score some touchdowns"

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1 hour ago, jamesplante11 said:

The problem is not his talent, its his piss poor attitude. It all started at the draft when they took JuJu

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/look-martavis-bryant-tweets-that-steelers-draft-pick-is-sammie-coates-replacement/

 

Tomlin isn't going to play someone he can not trust, JuJu has taken the high road in all this and that seems to be why he's higher up on the pecking order. Team player not me me me

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8 minutes ago, jamesplante11 said:

 

Tomlin isn't going to play someone he can not trust, JuJu has taken the high road in all this and that seems to be why he's higher up on the pecking order. Team player not me me me

 

Yeah, he's gotten suspended twice and attacked his organization because they drafted another WR, as well as created drama within the locker room.  I'd say that's more damaging than fumbling once, which can get your ass benched.  I don't think it has anything to do with his it's his lack of talent, and i'm sure that part is more apparent to the coaching staff than any of us.  The coaching staff and Ben simply aren't game planning around him for a reason.

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4 minutes ago, kdko said:

 

Yeah, he's gotten suspended twice and attacked his organization because they drafted another WR, as well as created drama within the locker room.  I'd say that's more damaging than fumbling once, which can get your ass benched.  I don't think it has anything to do with his it's his lack of talent, and i'm sure that part is more apparent to the coaching staff than any of us.  The coaching staff and Ben simply aren't game planning around him for a reason.

this is a team whose coach tried tripping a player running back a punt for a TD...lets not act like they run the tightest ship over there

 

if you have a problem with him being suspended before and making comments about the drafting of juju then let it be known...cut bait with him..trade him or demote him to the bottom of the depth chart and tell him why......otherwise you are sabotaging his future ability to make money and not being upfront about it........you don't hold grudges when you are trying to win football games...you put the best talent out there and let them do what they do.....

 

like I said...when you have two guys like brown and bell around its not easy to get the amount of balls you would like...those guys command it......but I suspect that they are not using Bryant in a manner that will breed success......50/50 deep balls and quick hit screens and reverses......seems like some pigeon holing....Bryant is talented enough to be a complete #1 receiver given the opportunity....

 

this team is even dumber than I think if they are holding some sort of silent grudge against Bryant.......this guy wants to display his full ability and potentially make some money in the future....

 

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To be fair he was on the field a lot this Sunday after having watched the game. He ran a variety of routes but mostly running the streaks that he's been known for in this offense. He was on the field enough, Big Ben just didn't look his way. Now it's hard to tell whether he was having trouble getting separation because it's not always easy to tell with the angles you get on TV. But he did look extremely lazy on the running plays, like he didn't even try and sell it in the slightest. Guess that's a little par for the course with some guys, but I wouldn't be too happy with that from my Receivers if I was the coach. He did have a decent pass thrown to him which would've been a 70 yard touchdown, but he literally lost it in the lights, not the best look for Bryant. Haven't watch any other steelers games other than the one where they got beat up on by the Jags where he looked decent all things considering.

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11 minutes ago, forever in debt to mo lewis said:

this is a team whose coach tried tripping a player running back a punt for a TD...lets not act like they run the tightest ship over there

 

if you have a problem with him being suspended before and making comments about the drafting of juju then let it be known...cut bait with him..trade him or demote him to the bottom of the depth chart and tell him why......otherwise you are sabotaging his future ability to make money and not being upfront about it........you don't hold grudges when you are trying to win football games...you put the best talent out there and let them do what they do.....

 

like I said...when you have two guys like brown and bell around its not easy to get the amount of balls you would like...those guys command it......but I suspect that they are not using Bryant in a manner that will breed success......50/50 deep balls and quick hit screens and reverses......seems like some pigeon holing....Bryant is talented enough to be a complete #1 receiver given the opportunity....

 

this team is even dumber than I think if they are holding some sort of silent grudge against Bryant.......this guy wants to display his full ability and potentially make some money in the future....

 

 

How high did you draft Bryant?

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1 minute ago, jamesplante11 said:

 

How high did you draft Bryant?

 

Exactly, sounds like the only feedback he wants is "yes you are right, Steelers are idiots and holding him back for no good reason, he'll be a stud just as soon as they stop being dicks or trade him".

 

Asked for opinions, got lots of feedback, but none of it agrees with his views gleened from not watching PIT games and listening to people saying he is practicing hard and eating right.

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1 minute ago, jamesplante11 said:

 

How high did you draft Bryant?

5th....which is really irrelevant...this isn't the first time ive drafted Bryant....ive always been big on his talent...even when he was at Clemson..i was hoping my pats were going to take a shot at him....I think you just think I'm a frustrated owner....and it would be hard for me to sell you on anything otherwise so I cant blame you....I think I'm just perplexed

 

like I said....I think hes super frustrated because he feels he can be a legit #1.....I think he believes he can be AJ Green....but I'm not sure the steelers are trying to utilize him that way.....not that I expect AJ type of production given that brown and bell are around

 

heres what it feels like to me.....I think Bryant is saying "guys I'm good...I can play..i can help us...we kicked 5fgs sunday...I want to convert those to first downs and touchdowns....sure its all well and good when were coasting against the bengals....but will it be enough when we play new England? what if we end up having to go to new England again in the playoffs and have to beat them there? will it be good enough......we need me AB and leveon firing on all cylinders"

 

now heres how it looks to football fans and potrayred by the media

 

"mid 20s black male pot smoker who has been suspended twice and is near lifetime ban is unhappy to make 600k a year"

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3 minutes ago, stevegrab said:

 

Exactly, sounds like the only feedback he wants is "yes you are right, Steelers are idiots and holding him back for no good reason, he'll be a stud just as soon as they stop being dicks or trade him".

 

Asked for opinions, got lots of feedback, but none of it agrees with his views gleened from not watching PIT games and listening to people saying he is practicing hard and eating right.

I really don't care if they trade him .....

 

the only decent feedback ive seen so far is from Inziladun.....the rest just looks like people calling him an ingrate

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up until these past two games he was getting about 5-6 targets/game.  these past two= 2-3, but these are games where bell really turned it up (30+ carries 3 of their last 4 games).  are they really going to match his targets to brown's?  he is 3rd man on the totem pole, and pitt is justified in going to bell and brown first.  so he needs to make a choice about being the #1 vs #3

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8 minutes ago, Bier Meister said:

up until these past two games he was getting about 5-6 targets/game.  these past two= 2-3, but these are games where bell really turned it up (30+ carries 3 of their last 4 games).  are they really going to match his targets to brown's?  he is 3rd man on the totem pole, and pitt is justified in going to bell and brown first.  so he needs to make a choice about being the #1 vs #3

oh I'm very realistic about him playing 3rd fiddle...I don't blame pitt there....AB and bell are animals........he was always kind of a 5-6 target guy even when he was converting and making plays......I'm more curious as to what kind of targets these are...ive been hearing/reading a lot about all these just missed connections with ben on bombs

 

I also read that going into last weeks game some sit did some analysis and said that 43 percent of the balls hes seens this year were deemed "uncatchable"........so I'm wondering if maybe Pittsburgh views him like a toy and hed prefer to be viewed as a complete receiver that can do anything.......wondering if maybe those 5-6 targets  a game would be better served with higher percentage throws/routes where hes working to get open.....they seem to run him on go routes and quick hitter screens where they want to get him the ball at the line/behind it and have him make a guy miss or a break a tackle.....he can be/do more than just that stuff

 

and I think a part of his frustration is watching them score two TDs and kick a bunch of FGs sunday while not being involved.....as I mentioned...its all well and good when coasting against cincy....but is it going to be good enough against the patriots or in the playoffs?

 

I'm sure a lot of bryants frustration is rooted in wanting to shine so down the road he can make some money...but I think he genuinely likes being a steeler and playing with AB and bell too......as I said before having all 3 firing is going to be key to them trying to get by the patriots.....I think Bryant also sees more potential in this offense with him doing some damage

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Per Bleacher report, Mike Tomlin has vowed not to trade Bryant and his comments are out of bounds, he will be dealt with accordingly.

 

I have no idea what kind of analysis you are looking for. He practices hard, good for him so does the entire scout team. It doesn't change the fact that when the play is designed to go to the opposite side of the field he is very lazy running the routes. So you have a WR who is a clubhouse distraction, and when the play isn't designed for his side of the field he gives up.

 

Bryant has 16 career regular season TDs

11 of them are > 18 yards and 4 of them were 68, 80, 88, 94

3 of them are < 8 yards (Bell territory)

 

He is being utilized the same way he has been since 2014, a deep ball threat where you play jump ball or hit him in stride on bad coverage. Or a screen pass and hope he breaks one.  

 

 

Edited by jamesplante11
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5 hours ago, Bier Meister said:

up until these past two games he was getting about 5-6 targets/game.  these past two= 2-3, but these are games where bell really turned it up (30+ carries 3 of their last 4 games).  are they really going to match his targets to brown's?  he is 3rd man on the totem pole, and pitt is justified in going to bell and brown first.  so he needs to make a choice about being the #1 vs #3

 

I've watched every snap of every game this year (including being at the game sunday)  and the last 10 years for that matter.. Here is my perspective. 1st off its the AB and Bell show, on avg there is anywhere from 25 to 35 pass attempts for Ben, hes gonna target Brown 12-15 times, Bell around 5-10 and the rest is spread around... between Bryant and Juju the targets are pretty close, but Juju has made the most of them. JUJU is a legit talent also so he's not going away in that passing game. So the reality Bryant is and never was going to see more than 5-8 targets a game, not sure what his expectations were. 

 

6 hours ago, Inziladun said:

To be fair he was on the field a lot this Sunday after having watched the game. He ran a variety of routes but mostly running the streaks that he's been known for in this offense. He was on the field enough, Big Ben just didn't look his way. Now it's hard to tell whether he was having trouble getting separation because it's not always easy to tell with the angles you get on TV. But he did look extremely lazy on the running plays, like he didn't even try and sell it in the slightest. Guess that's a little par for the course with some guys, but I wouldn't be too happy with that from my Receivers if I was the coach. He did have a decent pass thrown to him which would've been a 70 yard touchdown, but he literally lost it in the lights, not the best look for Bryant. Haven't watch any other steelers games other than the one where they got beat up on by the Jags where he looked decent all things considering.

 

I was there live and had a specific goal in mind to watch him on and off the field to see how he engaged especially off the field... he was on the field for 36 of 69 snaps, and most of those were running plays. He was actually off the field for around 70% of the 3 WR sets and was off the field for most red zone opportunities also. The return of Eli Rogers to the slot had a lot to do with it which means Juju returns to the outside and I believe ultimately Bryant's attitude vs Juju's is why Bryant was basically the 4th wr and I think it's going to continue.. Bryant was completely disengaged on the sideline and I don't see them trading him. He's a great depth piece to have on the cheap. 

 

Now having said all this, my personal opinion and wish is that they would be more creative with how they use him but the reality is Ben is locked into AB. 4 of his 5 picks vs Jax were AB targets and AB had 19 targets overall that game. Ben forces it there no matter how bad hes covered. So far anything to Bryant has been a deep go route, ( Ben has never been an accurate deep baller) and its been a quick throw latterally.and hope he breaks the tackle. I hate Haley as an OC, Bryant should be used a lot more in slants and comeback routes but it's not happening. He's their biggest WR and yet he has 4 red zone targets.. So there is coaching issues also, don't think it's any secret that Haley isn't the most decorated or respected OC.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Gourdeau said:

 

I've watched every snap of every game this year (including being at the game sunday)  and the last 10 years for that matter.. Here is my perspective. 1st off its the AB and Bell show, on avg there is anywhere from 25 to 35 pass attempts for Ben, hes gonna target Brown 12-15 times, Bell around 5-10 and the rest is spread around... between Bryant and Juju the targets are pretty close, but Juju has made the most of them. JUJU is a legit talent also so he's not going away in that passing game. So the reality Bryant is and never was going to see more than 5-8 targets a game, not sure what his expectations were. 

 

 

I was there live and had a specific goal in mind to watch him on and off the field to see how he engaged especially off the field... he was on the field for 36 of 69 snaps, and most of those were running plays. He was actually off the field for around 70% of the 3 WR sets and was off the field for most red zone opportunities also. The return of Eli Rogers to the slot had a lot to do with it which means Juju returns to the outside and I believe ultimately Bryant's attitude vs Juju's is why Bryant was basically the 4th wr and I think it's going to continue.. Bryant was completely disengaged on the sideline and I don't see them trading him. He's a great depth piece to have on the cheap. 

 

Now having said all this, my personal opinion and wish is that they would be more creative with how they use him but the reality is Ben is locked into AB. 4 of his 5 picks vs Jax were AB targets and AB had 19 targets overall that game. Ben forces it there no matter how bad hes covered. So far anything to Bryant has been a deep go route, ( Ben has never been an accurate deep baller) and its been a quick throw latterally.and hope he breaks the tackle. I hate Haley as an OC, Bryant should be used a lot more in slants and comeback routes but it's not happening. He's their biggest WR and yet he has 4 red zone targets.. So there is coaching issues also, don't think it's any secret that Haley isn't the most decorated or respected OC.

 

 

 

Every once in a while, Gourdeau comes in here and lays some smack down Homer perspective that is pretty much iron clad. 

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I had some time.. we are just driving back home in a 15 pass van with 9 dudes, we drove 20 hours to Pittsburgh Friday. Spent the weekend there then went to philly for the monday night game ( insane fans btw). Celebrated our 10 year Local league anniversary in style. Bucket list trip

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