LordOpie

Is Tom Brady the GOAT of all sports?

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20 hours ago, LordOpie said:

you're right, of course.

 

but doesn't being the GOAT in a sport put you in the conversation of GOATOAS?

He should be in the conversation. My point was to respond  "to forever in debt to mo lewis" claim that the professionals in the sport have more knowledge than the fantasy fans. In short, they weren't asked the same question, so we can't compare their responses to the ones on the board. 

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Some guy on FS1 cant remember his name (Rob Parker maybe) made an argument that Montanna has jumped back in front of Brady as the GOAT QB because montanna is 4-0 with no picks and only 2 of 4 close games with 2 blowouts won at a time when there was much fewer penalties for PI and roughing the passer. Saying Brady has played in way too many close games that could have gone either way and came down to kickers and coaching errors being the difference.  If he were the true GOAT some of these games would and should have been much more decisive. His belief is that if you're gonna blame The def and kicker for this loss vs Philly then you damm well better credit the defence and kicker for the wins vs Carolina ( Kasay included for that kickoff out of bounds) and St Louis and better credit Carroll Bevell and Butler for the win vs Seattle, so while he has 1 more SB victory, Brady got a lot more help than Montanna did in terms of defense and Special teams. I never saw Joe play and haven't watched any of those 4 bowls so no clue on this guys arguments. Just thought Id share cause I love the debate 

Edited by Gourdeau
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9 minutes ago, Gourdeau said:

Some guy on FS1 cant remember his name (Rob Parker maybe) made an argument that Montanna has jumped back in front of Brady as the GOAT QB because montanna is 4-0 with no picks and only 2 of 4 close games with 2 blowouts won at a time when there was much fewer penalties for PI and roughing the passer. Saying Brady has played in way too many close games that could have gone either way and came down to kickers and coaching errors being the difference.  If he were the true GOAT some of these games would and should have been much more decisive. His belief is that if you're gonna blame The def and kicker for this loss vs Philly then you damm well better credit the defence and kicker for the wins vs Carolina ( Kasay included for that kickoff out of bounds) and St Louis and better credit Carroll Bevell and Butler for the win vs Seattle, so while he has 1 more SB victory, Brady got a lot more help than Montanna did in terms of defense and Special teams. I never saw Joe play and haven't watched any of those 4 bowls so no clue on this guys arguments. Just thought Id share cause I love the debate 

cool....lol

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so lemme get this straight....montana hasn't played a down of football since like 94 or 95? was surpassed....yet somehow has now leapfrogged back in front of a guy that just threw for 505 yards 3 tds and no picks? seems logical.....either that or the guy is trying to stir a pot

Edited by forever in debt to mo lewis
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The fact that Brady has done all of this in the salary cap era weighs big with me . Both the Niners and The Pats play in ridiculously weak divisions so neither Joe nor Tom ever really had to get their uniforms dirty until the playoffs . I always said Joe was the best . I hated him as a Cowboys fan , but I respected his game big time. I gotta give the nod to Tom Brady though . 8 appearances, 5 wins . All in the salary cap era. I just think he is the best ever

 

Edit to add:  Not to mention Joe had arguable the best wr in the history of the sport at his disposal. Aside from when he had Moss, Bradys wr have been a ragtag over achieving bunch , excluding Gronk

Edited by whomper
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Rice was only there for 1 SB though wasn't he?

 

Edit: googled , see now it was 2

Edited by Gourdeau

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15 minutes ago, whomper said:

The fact that Brady has done all of this in the salary cap era weighs big with me . Both the Niners and The Pats play in ridiculously weak divisions so neither Joe nor Tom ever really had to get their uniforms dirty until the playoffs . I always said Joe was the best . I hated him as a Cowboys fan , but I respected his game big time. I gotta give the nod to Tom Brady though . 8 appearances, 5 wins . All in the salary cap era. I just think he is the best ever

 

Edit to add:  Not to mention Joe had arguable the best wr in the history of the sport at his disposal. Aside from when he had Moss, Bradys wr have been a ragtag over achieving bunch , excluding Gronk

 

I still think Montana is better than Brady, but this point cannot be ignored. Montana had a much better group on offense for many of his years, Rice, Taylor, Craig, Clark.  Only top offensive player for most of Brady's career is Gronk.

 

Salary cap era is big too, but I think some of that is canceled out by the increased offense and protection of QBs in Brady's era. Also the AFC was much weaker during much of Brady's time than the NFC was for Joe, how many epic NFC title games were there between them and the Cowboys or some other 2 teams.

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1 hour ago, stevegrab said:

 

I still think Montana is better than Brady, but this point cannot be ignored. Montana had a much better group on offense for many of his years, Rice, Taylor, Craig, Clark.  Only top offensive player for most of Brady's career is Gronk.

 

Salary cap era is big too, but I think some of that is canceled out by the increased offense and protection of QBs in Brady's era. Also the AFC was much weaker during much of Brady's time than the NFC was for Joe, how many epic NFC title games were there between them and the Cowboys or some other 2 teams.

every time you can point out some advantage brady has that montana didn't have I can easily play tit for tat and do the same.....it makes no difference.....they cancel each out IMO

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1 hour ago, forever in debt to mo lewis said:

every time you can point out some advantage brady has that montana didn't have I can easily play tit for tat and do the same.....it makes no difference.....they cancel each out IMO

 

So you're saying its a tie?

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6 minutes ago, stevegrab said:

 

So you're saying its a tie?

So you're saying there's a chance!

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36 minutes ago, stevegrab said:

 

So you're saying its a tie?

nah...i think everyone is entitled to their opinion

 

but if you are going to go tit for tat on advantages...i think it can be done both ways....so those things really cancel each other out imo

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3 hours ago, whomper said:

The fact that Brady has done all of this in the salary cap era weighs big with me . Both the Niners and The Pats play in ridiculously weak divisions so neither Joe nor Tom ever really had to get their uniforms dirty until the playoffs . I always said Joe was the best . I hated him as a Cowboys fan , but I respected his game big time. I gotta give the nod to Tom Brady though . 8 appearances, 5 wins . All in the salary cap era. I just think he is the best ever

 

Edit to add:  Not to mention Joe had arguable the best wr in the history of the sport at his disposal. Aside from when he had Moss, Bradys wr have been a ragtag over achieving bunch , excluding Gronk

 

I think having the greatest coach ever, makes a far bigger impact than having the best skill player ever at his position.  Look at what Phil Jackson did with the Bulls, and Lakers.  In the same vein as Belichick with the Patriots.

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Hopefully real soon we will find out just how much Bill means to Brady's success

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27 minutes ago, kdko said:

 

I think having the greatest coach ever, makes a far bigger impact than having the best skill player ever at his position.  Look at what Phil Jackson did with the Bulls, and Lakers.  In the same vein as Belichick with the Patriots.

Bill Walsh wasnt exactly small potatoes . I think Montana faired pretty well in the coaching dept

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4 hours ago, stevegrab said:

 

I still think Montana is better than Brady, but this point cannot be ignored. Montana had a much better group on offense for many of his years, Rice, Taylor, Craig, Clark.  Only top offensive player for most of Brady's career is Gronk.

 

Salary cap era is big too, but I think some of that is canceled out by the increased offense and protection of QBs in Brady's era. Also the AFC was much weaker during much of Brady's time than the NFC was for Joe, how many epic NFC title games were there between them and the Cowboys or some other 2 teams.

For a while there it was practically a given that the Cowboys and niners were going to slug it out at the end to represent the NFC. The NFC was pretty fierce though back then. The Giants with LT, the Skins etc. It was some slugfest

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14 hours ago, whomper said:

For a while there it was practically a given that the Cowboys and niners were going to slug it out at the end to represent the NFC. The NFC was pretty fierce though back then. The Giants with LT, the Skins etc. It was some slugfest

49ers/cowboys was the steve young era though was it not? it wasn't montana and the cowboys slugging it out was it?

 

speaking of steve young...didn't that guy win a SB and make the HOF? how come that isn't some proof of a "system" and held against montana? but somehow jimmy g winning a couple of game is ...and cassel winning some games, with a team brady was within a play of going 19-0 with, is?

 

did montana ever have to worry about his starting TE or receiver going out in the 1st half of an NFC title game or superbowl after taking a hit to the helmet?

 

I'm not knocking joe at all...just showing if you want to make arguments about eras, or whatever, you can really go tit for tat

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4 hours ago, forever in debt to mo lewis said:

49ers/cowboys was the steve young era though was it not? it wasn't montana and the cowboys slugging it out was it?

 

speaking of steve young...didn't that guy win a SB and make the HOF? how come that isn't some proof of a "system" and held against montana? but somehow jimmy g winning a couple of game is ...and cassel winning some games, with a team brady was within a play of going 19-0 with, is?

 

did montana ever have to worry about his starting TE or receiver going out in the 1st half of an NFC title game or superbowl after taking a hit to the helmet?

 

I'm not knocking joe at all...just showing if you want to make arguments about eras, or whatever, you can really go tit for tat

The rivalry spanned Montana and Young . "The Catch" was made by a ball thrown by Joe Montana

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8 minutes ago, whomper said:

The rivalry spanned Montana and Young . "The Catch" was made by a ball thrown by Joe Montana

i always seem to forget the cowboys were pretty good in the early 80s and late 70s.....a little before my time...but ya ur right

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Now Garoppolo is the GOATOAS ;)

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