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Trade loan collusion?


XRags2RichX
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So I have a ton of players on by week nine due to trades and waiver pickups I’ve made previously and just lost sight of managing my bye weeks. When planning ahead I came up with the brilliant idea of loaning one of my top players for a random week in return for a starter for week nine. I read a lot on it before to see if it was cheating and all the forums I came across called it collusion. In instances where I would need a rb and trade a wr for someone who needed a wr and traded a rb this week I understand since there is no loss. However in my situation their is a risk associated. For instance I have Andrew and wentz as my qbs who both have week nine byes. So this week (week 7) I traded joe mixon for James Connor (on by week 7) then we will trade back then in week nine I will trade a player I have on a bye for matt Ryan to help at qb. Then trade back. The risk in these trades is that I have to find a replacement rb this week and am obviously losing value and the same for them and Matt Ryan week 9. I also messaged my whole league offering the same deal so it’s not like I singled out a friend to pull this trade out. Is it still collusion if so why?

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My league has a specific 'once you trade a player away, he cannot be brought back onto your roster that season through any means' rule to prevent this from happening.  Because yes, it was attempted in the past and as commissioner I wouldn't stand for it (in those days we voted on trades, now we don't).

 

What you are describing is example 1A of collusion between owners because of the loan agreement.  Just because it may not be written in your league rules, it doesn't make it right or acceptable.  Pretty sure the last thing any league needs is a legal department to review and enforce every possible rule regarding transactions.  Some things are just common sense.

 

Also, if I went into this deal with you, and the player I 'loaned' you got hurt, fat chance you get your player back from me.

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When planning ahead I came up with the brilliant idea of loaning one of my top players for a random week in return for a starter for week nine. I read a lot on it before to see if it was cheating and all the forums I came across called it collusion.

 

Well that’s because everything you’re doing is collusion. 

 

I don’t even think this needs to be explained.

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9 minutes ago, NYpkBLUE22 said:

Wait now I’m actually laughing. You went to all these other forums and it was declared collusion. So are you just trying to find one who tells you it isn’t?

 

I do the same thing to justify trading for or adding a player I probably shouldn't

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1 hour ago, NYpkBLUE22 said:

Wait now I’m actually laughing. You went to all these other forums and it was declared collusion. So are you just trying to find one who tells you it isn’t?

No if you go do research there’s actually differing opinions on the topic and I can’t grasp if what I’m doing is different then the other examples. As long as it’s allowed I don’t see why I can’t do it like I said I let the league know in advance and Sent the offer to everyone’s guess if they don’t believe it’s collusion is all that matters. Guess I more just wanted to see what the overall opinion was on the subject.

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4 minutes ago, rr23724 said:

The only person who will tell him it is OK is the guy he is colluding with.

 

This is bush league crap.  Not allowed in any league Ive ever heard of.

Nah like I said there’s not one guy involved I sent it out to the league. If they’re against it I wouldn’t do it but if it’s fair game that’s fine.

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3 minutes ago, XRags2RichX said:

Nah like I said there’s not one guy involved I sent it out to the league. If they’re against it I wouldn’t do it but if it’s fair game that’s fine.

 

In that case, if the league is cool with it then go for it.  I just hope you're not in the same league as lone star or we are in for a long week of collusion posts

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7 minutes ago, XRags2RichX said:

No if you go do research there’s actually differing opinions on the topic and I can’t grasp if what I’m doing is different then the other examples. As long as it’s allowed I don’t see why I can’t do it like I said I let the league know in advance and Sent the offer to everyone’s guess if they don’t believe it’s collusion is all that matters. Guess I more just wanted to see what the overall opinion was on the subject.

 

Then why did your first post say all the forums you checked said it was collusion?   If all those forums said it is collusion that is the overall opinion. You really just want to find some people who tell you it is ok, so that you feel better or can justify when somebody calls you a cheater. 

 

If your league is cool with it you play with a bunch of tools who would cheat and collude, anything it takes to win. ZERO INTEGRITY.  I wouldn't doubt some of these expected trade backs don't happen. 

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You’re legitimately conspiring to benefit your certain teams over others during bye weeks for the sake of wins. A ‘boomerang trade’ is the essence of collusion itself. If two teams work together to gain wins with borrowing players — it’s clear collusion. Your league is just naive to it because it’s presented in a warm invitation of “Hey everyone i’d like to present an idea for you all”.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, LordOpie said:

It's not collusion.

It has the appearance of collusion, which triggers people.

But the key aspect to collusion is that it is done in secret. If the league knows, then it's not collusion. It's also not morally or ethically wrong, it's just a logistical transaction.

It's funny that you accidentally wound up with most of your team on a bye week. I actually try to do that on purpose so my team is at full strength the rest of the year.

 

Does not have to be done in secret to count as collusion.  Even if it were not collusion most people with a shred of integrity would say it is wrong. Not surprising Dopie would try to justify this. 

 

Sharing of teams is wrong, that is what is being done here. 

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3 minutes ago, stevegrab said:

 

Does not have to be done in secret to count as collusion.  Even if it were not collusion most people with a shred of integrity would say it is wrong. Not surprising Dopie would try to justify this. 

 

Sharing of teams is wrong, that is what is being done here. 

 

That's a good way to put it.  Could be a swinger league?  :thinking:

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4 minutes ago, LordOpie said:

i like how you consistently attack and insult me... strawman much?

I'll show you it's not "wrong"... almost everything is society has benefited from money, transactions, the stock markets... a key aspect in the stock markets is options and derivatives. These are the same sharing and manipulative concepts as player sharing. Many times all parties (and in some ways, society) benefits from these transactions. Sometimes it goes horribly wrong but overall, it's mostly a good thing.

I wouldn't player share, but the thing some of you are missing is that you have to remove yourself from the equation to properly evaluate it.

I look forward to your next childish insult because you didn't like what I posted.

 

You say a lot of dumb manure, it needs to be called out. 

 

IF I COULD IGNORE YOU LIKE ANY OTHER USER ON THIS BOARD I WOLD GLADLY DO THAT. but for some reason your are a protected citizen of The Huddle Forums. 

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secret or illegal cooperation or conspiracy, especially in order to cheat or deceive others

 

So it isn't secret

There is no rule against it hence no illegal cooperation (if owners don't like it then make a rule against it)

I don't think you're deceiving anyone, they 100% know why and how you're doing it

So is it cheating??

 

Probably a slippery slope but I don't exactly think it is cheating. I think you and another owner are manipulating the situation to gain an advantage but I think it helps both teams which is what a trade or trades should do.  I don't think it is collusion.

 

If you traded your two best players to another owner for scraps and then they paid you from their winnings without anyone knowing that's collusion.

 

I am in a league where this has happen numerous times over a 19 year period as there is a set waiver period that ends before games Thursday.  Then someone finds out their Kicker pulled a hammy and is out that week so they trade with an owner that has 2 kickers and trade back the next week.  Usually the other team gets a modest upgrade at RB or WR for the week.  It is a means to an end ie getting around a set waiver period  First time it happened maybe 2 owners called bs but they were silenced, now it is status quo

 

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