michaelredd9 Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Which Cleveland running back is the better one to own? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesplante11 Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 If I had to chose, it would be Chubb. He is going to take a huge chunk of the 20 carries Hyde average. Duke Johnson should also return to last years PPR machine form, now that he can be played more as a change of pace back like he is used to. Before they were almost giving away their play call by putting Johnson in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Chubb, easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Reason being look at the volume Hyde was getting, coupled with the fact that Haley loves running his offense through a workhorse RB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League_Champion Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Make no mistake, this is Chubb's backfield now. They didn't draft him to watch Duke Johnson. Duke will still have a roll on the team but Chubb is definitely the guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League_Champion Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 4 hours ago, LordOpie said: well, Chubb better perform because he's the most expensive 2nd round RB ever at a cost of $21m Didn't cost me a dime 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loaf Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I'm guessing that Chubb slides into Hyde's role and Duke goes back to being a ppr machine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelredd9 Posted October 20, 2018 Author Share Posted October 20, 2018 10 hours ago, kdko said: Haley loves running his offense through a workhorse RB. Le'Veon Bell is big, can run, can catch, and can pass block. He is the most complete running back in the NFL. Every coach in the NFL would use him as a workhorse. Previous to Bell, Haley used a RBBC with the exception of his first year in Arizona: 2007 Arizona OC Edgerrin James 324 carries 2008 Arizona OC Tim Hightower 143 carries Edgerrin James 133 carries 2009 KC HC Jamaal Charles 190 carries Larry Johnson 132 carries 2010 KC HC Thomas Jones 245 carries Jamaal Charles 230 carries 2011 KC HC Thomas Jones 153 carries Jackie Battle 149 carries Dexter McCluster 114 carries 2012 Pitt OC Jonathan Dwyer 156 carries Isaac Redman 110 carries I think it'll be an even 50/50 split. During the draft process, there were concerns about Chubb's pass blocking and his abilities as a receiver. I doubt he'll ever see the field in passing situations. And I think they'll give Duke some early down work because of his experience. Duke will probably get more fantasy points because of his receptions and receiving yards. Chubb might have the higher ceiling because he might be able to win the feature back role if he does well. It wouldn't surprise me if they get the exact same amount of work in this first game to keep both running backs happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 1 minute ago, michaelredd9 said: Le'Veon Bell is big, can run, can catch, and can pass block. He is the most complete running back in the NFL. Every coach in the NFL would use him as a workhorse. Previous to Bell, Haley used a RBBC with the exception of his first year in Arizona: 2007 Arizona OC Edgerrin James 324 carries 2008 Arizona OC Tim Hightower 143 carries Edgerrin James 133 carries 2009 KC HC Jamaal Charles 190 carries Larry Johnson 132 carries 2010 KC HC Thomas Jones 245 carries Jamaal Charles 230 carries 2011 KC HC Thomas Jones 153 carries Jackie Battle 149 carries Dexter McCluster 114 carries 2012 Pitt OC Jonathan Dwyer 156 carries Isaac Redman 110 carries I think it'll be an even 50/50 split. During the draft process, there were concerns about Chubb's pass blocking and his abilities as a receiver. I doubt he'll ever see the field in passing situations. And I think they'll give Duke some early down work because of his experience. Duke will probably get more fantasy points because of his receptions and receiving yards. Chubb might have the higher ceiling because he might be able to win the feature back role if he does well. It wouldn't surprise me if they get the exact same amount of work in this first game to keep both running backs happy. I think 50/50 is overly optimistic for Johnson's outlook. Hyde has been dominating the carries all year, and they just dropped him for Chubb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelredd9 Posted October 20, 2018 Author Share Posted October 20, 2018 18 minutes ago, kdko said: I think 50/50 is overly optimistic for Johnson's outlook. Hyde has been dominating the carries all year, and they just dropped him for Chubb. Duke Johnson has played 42% of snaps on the year. He played 51% and 47% of snaps in the last 2 weeks. I doubt those percentages will go down with Hyde's departure. Chubb is a rookie who likely has holes in his game. 50% of snaps might be Chubb's ceiling. If he fails at pass protection, it could be a 70/30 split in Duke's favor. Duke has a PFF pass block grade of 77.3 and Chubb has a PFF pass block grade of 5.5 (Chubb's pass block grade is based on only 3 snaps). They don't want a rookie quarterback getting hit because of the inexperience of a rookie running back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 47 minutes ago, michaelredd9 said: 2010 KC HC Thomas Jones 245 carries Jamaal Charles 230 carries Good post. When I read that Haley likes to use one back, this year at KC immediately came to mind. He utilized Jones more than Charles to a detriment in 2010. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 6 hours ago, michaelredd9 said: Duke Johnson has played 42% of snaps on the year. He played 51% and 47% of snaps in the last 2 weeks. I doubt those percentages will go down with Hyde's departure. Chubb is a rookie who likely has holes in his game. 50% of snaps might be Chubb's ceiling. If he fails at pass protection, it could be a 70/30 split in Duke's favor. Duke has a PFF pass block grade of 77.3 and Chubb has a PFF pass block grade of 5.5 (Chubb's pass block grade is based on only 3 snaps). They don't want a rookie quarterback getting hit because of the inexperience of a rookie running back. 51% of the snaps =/= 50% split on touches, just to be clear. Hyde got 120 touches compared to Johnson's 33... Not even close to 50% of the workload no mater how you try to spin it with snap count. It's going to be 70/30 Chubb. And lemme guess, you whiffed on Chubb and got Duke? :P 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, kdko said: And lemme guess, you whiffed on Chubb and got Duke? :P Cmon man. Regardless of how the timeshare works out in Cleveland, Mr. Rodgers supported his position on factually accurate rationale. Assuming that Chubb immediately takes Hyde's role because Haley likes workhorse backs comes across as faulty conjecture. I'm getting Rashard Penny deja vu. Edited October 21, 2018 by Bobby Brown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelredd9 Posted October 21, 2018 Author Share Posted October 21, 2018 35 minutes ago, kdko said: 51% of the snaps =/= 50% split on touches, just to be clear. Hyde got 120 touches compared to Johnson's 33... Not even close to 50% of the workload no mater how you try to spin it with snap count. It's going to be 70/30 Chubb. And lemme guess, you whiffed on Chubb and got Duke? :P I think you are being overly optimistic on Chubb's role. He isn't going to 100% take over Hyde's role. He is a rookie. He is probably bad at both pass protection and as a receiver which makes him a complete liability on pass plays. They will be telegraphing that it is a run play if he is on the field. I think he'll start out getting 12-15 carries with 0-1 receptions. He will have to do well on pass plays to get more than that. If Duke starts getting 4-6 receptions which is likely, he will outproduce Chubb for fantasy purposes. Not all touches are created equal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesplante11 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, michaelredd9 said: I think you are being overly optimistic on Chubb's role. He isn't going to 100% take over Hyde's role. He is a rookie. He is probably bad at both pass protection and as a receiver which makes him a complete liability on pass plays. They will be telegraphing that it is a run play if he is on the field. I think he'll start out getting 12-15 carries with 0-1 receptions. He will have to do well on pass plays to get more than that. If Duke starts getting 4-6 receptions which is likely, he will outproduce Chubb for fantasy purposes. Not all touches are created equal. Yeah, Chubb isn’t the best pass blocker out there. That’s for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XFlash Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 10 hours ago, michaelredd9 said: I think you are being overly optimistic on Chubb's role. He isn't going to 100% take over Hyde's role. He is a rookie. He is probably bad at both pass protection and as a receiver which makes him a complete liability on pass plays. They will be telegraphing that it is a run play if he is on the field. I think he'll start out getting 12-15 carries with 0-1 receptions. He will have to do well on pass plays to get more than that. If Duke starts getting 4-6 receptions which is likely, he will outproduce Chubb for fantasy purposes. Not all touches are created equal. +1 Unless Chubb shows improvement in pass blocking and good catching ability, he will not exceed Hyde's touches. Chubb could surprise with production given the matchup this week or other weeks against poor defenses. I got lucky in one league in picking up Chubb. If owners missed on Chubb, Duke as the next pickup. In PPR Duke was picked up first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) Duke Johnson listed as the starter today. Edited October 21, 2018 by Bobby Brown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 59 minutes ago, Bobby Brown said: Duke Johnson listed as the starter today. Not surprising and he'll probably see more snaps and touches than Chubb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) It's not even close to 50% split. 14-4 at the moment. Oh, and Chubb for the TD baby! Time to admit without spinning snap counts that this is Chubb's backfield. Edited October 21, 2018 by kdko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelredd9 Posted October 21, 2018 Author Share Posted October 21, 2018 37 minutes ago, kdko said: It's not even close to 50% split. 14-4 at the moment. Oh, and Chubb for the TD baby! Time to admit without spinning snap counts that this is Chubb's backfield. They definitely are featuring Chubb in the run game. I knew as soon as I saw Chubb score the touchdown that you'd be here gloating. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XFlash Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 a good showing. Chubb should see a little improvement every week. I almost benched CMac for Chubb. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdko Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, michaelredd9 said: They definitely are featuring Chubb in the run game. I knew as soon as I saw Chubb score the touchdown that you'd be here gloating. That wasn't even close to gloating Merely facts in my post. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XFlash Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 26 minutes ago, LordOpie said: you should consider something other than FF it was only a thought. I did not do that insane action. I just considered it for a few moments. CMac stats to date are not great and do not look promising ROS. CMAC hopefully turns it around 2nd half of the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 (edited) If Chubb didn't get his TD, and I get he did, and you can't dismiss it; It would've been 8 points for Chubb relative to 5.9 for Duke. This was a prime rb matchup and with Haley getting thrown under the bus, the whole situation seems like a mess. I have both RBs on different FFPC teams and probably won't start either for awhile or else flex desperation. I see Chubb with a lot of 40 to 80 rushing yard games with a continued insistence in not getting Duke integrated into the passing game. Oh well that is what late round picks are for. Edited October 22, 2018 by Bobby Brown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 18 hours ago, michaelredd9 said: They definitely are featuring Chubb in the run game. I knew as soon as I saw Chubb score the touchdown that you'd be here gloating. Thing is they are still not using Duke enough, especially with the crappy WR talent available, he should be more involved and they should be using 2 TEs more often. According to info from Pro Football Reference - snap counts and touches Chubb=45(66%) - 18 carries, 2 targets 0 rec - 45 plays, involved in 20 Duke=35 (51%) - 1 carry, 4 targets 4 rec - that's bad, on the field for half the plays but only 5 touches (in 35 plays) 3rd RB Hilliard did not play on offense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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