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CaP'N GRuNGe

Red McCombs signs...

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Winfield needs help in the secondary for sure. Brian Williams is a liability..... Russell & Chavous are too for that matter. Ty Law would be great signing.

 

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yeah thats why im thinking that maybe the Vikes will go after Antrell Rolle or Pac Man Jones at 7...and maybe look at Troy Williamson, Roddy White, or another receiver at 18...Thomas Davis is the only safety prospect that projects as a 1st rounder..but I heard hes bulking up to play linebacker...so it makes sense to go after a corner at 7..maybe a receiver at 18...or maybe defensive help with both and a receiver via free agency

 

but who knows..if they bring in Law..then they may go with a receiver at 7..but I think it would be wise to with a young corner at 7

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.... they may go with a receiver at 7..

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if mike williams is there.... they gotta take him. I'm afraid however that the titans will take him @ 6 having lost Mason & having Norm Chow as OC.

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if mike williams is there.... they gotta take him. I'm afraid however that the titans will take him @ 6 having lost Mason & having Norm Chow as OC.

 

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its possible...but there is still Drew Bennett...and i believe the Titans still believe in Tyrone Calico if hes healthy..guy goes 6-4, 220...needs to improve consistency and concentration on catching the ball...hes young and going into his 3rd year..most of all he just needs to stay healthy..the Titans have alot of needs though

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I'm sure there will be more piling on about Reds cheap ways. And again I am no fan of his by any means...but all the whining going on about how cheap he is, isn't entirely accurate either.

 

Vikes had the 8th highest payroll last year.

 

 

_____  2004 NFL Payrolls  _____Team Payroll(Millions) Redskins $117.9 Eagles* $105.1 Texans $97.5  Lions $94.6 Seahawks* $94.0  Dolphins $93.9  Jets* $93.9 Vikings* $92.4 Colts* $92.1  Panthers $87.8  Bears $87.8 Browns $87.7 Ravens  $86.5  Chiefs $84.6 Falcons* $82.6  Buccaneers $82.0  Giants $81.6 Packers* $80.4  Bills $80.2 Titans  $79.0 Cardinals $79.0  Raiders $78.4 Steelers* $78.1  Patriots* $77.0  Rams* $76.5  Chargers*  $76.2 Saints  $73.4 Broncos* $72.4 Jaguars $72.1  Bengals $68.8  Cowboys $65.4  49ers  $62.6 

 

 

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BB, I'm sorry but those numbers are meaningless as they are inflated by LTBE incentives which were never paid. I'm sure you are aware that the Vike's cap for this year is $20 higher because of LTBE incentives unpaid in 2004 (and these are ridiculous incentives that would never be reached). This means Red's actual spend last year was $20 million less than what they are credited with "paying" in your chart.

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BB, I'm sorry but those numbers are meaningless as they are inflated by LTBE incentives which were never paid. I'm sure you are aware that the Vike's cap for this year is $20 higher because of LTBE incentives unpaid in 2004 (and these are ridiculous incentives that would never be reached). This means Red's actual spend last year was $20 million less than what they are credited with "paying" in your chart.

 

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BINGO

 

Things like an O-Lineman catching 6 TDs, etc. :D

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BB, I'm sorry but those numbers are meaningless as they are inflated by LTBE incentives which were never paid. I'm sure you are aware that the Vike's cap for this year is $20 higher because of LTBE incentives unpaid in 2004 (and these are ridiculous incentives that would never be reached). This means Red's actual spend last year was $20 million less than what they are credited with "paying" in your chart.

 

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You are correct. Although I thought the LTBE numbers were 14 Mill. Depends on where you read the info probably. BUT... that is also the same reasoning we aren't really 30 million under the cap this year. Those same numbers are inflating this years "available" number to a cap number we can't possibly be expected to pay out. If we were to add that supposed 30 mill we have extra to our current payroll, we would be over 100 mill.

 

 

The way I understand it, we have about 18-19 mill that we will probably be spending on FA's and draft picks.

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BINGO

 

Things like an O-Lineman catching 6 TDs, etc.  :D

 

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Now you just made that up. :D

 

Lol....they do have one though for Culpepper. He'll receive a $900,000 bonus if he makes the Pro Bowl on special teams :D

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Now you just made that up. :D

 

 

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Sadly, the $6 mil "receiving TDs" LTBE incentive for a Viking OL is no joke. They do not detail the specific LTBE in this link but they do explain that while Everett Lindsay's actual salary for 2004 was $600,000, USA Today correctly listed him as counting $6.6 million toward the 2004 cap due to his LTBE incentive, which if I recall was later described in a different source or Brzezinski phone interview on KFAN as being 6 receiving TDs. Similar shenanigans were involved in Fred Robbins' $4 mil cap impact.

 

It is fairly transparent that the Vikings use LTBE as window dressing to disguise Red's true cheapness, because we all know they are not utilizing cap rollover in any strategic way when they left themselves $15-$25 mil under their inflated cap during 2004. In a nutshell, they are creating it but not using it to better the team.

Edited by BigJim

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I've been trying to do some research on the cap numbers the last few weeks and it is hard to do, seeing as how you can get different numbers and different explanations depending on the source.

 

I will say you probably know more then me about it...so I do have one question of you...is it correct to assume that our publicized 30+ mill under the cap is not the true number? That that number has also been inflated due to these LTBE's being carried over?

 

Also...LTBE is supposed to stand for Likely To Be Earned correct? They don't seem very likely to me...

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You are correct. Although I thought the LTBE numbers were 14 Mill. Depends on where you read the info probably. BUT... that is also the same reasoning we aren't really 30 million under the cap this year. Those same numbers are inflating this years "available" number to a cap number we can't possibly be expected to pay out. If we were to add that supposed 30 mill we have extra to our current payroll, we would be over 100 mill.

The way I understand it, we have about 18-19 mill that we will probably be spending on FA's and draft picks.

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In theory, it does matter that the Vikes are $30 million under the cap as it is possible to realize full availability of the expanded cap using roster bonuses or other mechanics which count this year only and don't impact next year. Obviously you are right in implying the danger of using that full amount through, for example, prorated bonuses up to the cap, because you would not have the same room to count that same prorata bonus amount next year unless you maintain that type of LTBE cushion. I believe the Eagles are a team which has successfully used this concept rather than using it as window dressing as the Vikes do. One last comment that I'm sure you are probably aware of: that inflated cap number you provided recognized the entire $11 million bonus paid to Winfield. Had they counted it in a pro-rata manner as they clearly have the flexibility to do when they are as far away from the ceiling as they are, then the impact would be a $8 million reduction of the 2004 cap. Add that to the $14 mil LTBE and that is $22 million the Vikes cap should reasonably be adjusted to show Red's actual cap spend. Unless I'm mistaken, the reason Winfield's bonus was counted as a roster bonus was because this team knew full well that after the LTBE incentives were reversed, they needed that full $11 mil bonus to clear the cap minimum. If removal of LTBE's brought you under the minimum cap, it would be blatant circumvention of the cap minimum if your only argument is you believed Lindsay would catch 6 TDs.

Edited by BigJim

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Name in snow along with a big F U to all the Minnesota fans. Thanks for the "aggressively patient" approach to pocketing all your profits again Red. Now get the hell out of Minnesota already. 

:D

 

If this nightmare of an offseason keeps up, i'm about ready to say I'm a Vikings fan NO MAS!  :D

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Well you'll always be welcome in Buffalo :D

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Also...LTBE is supposed to stand for Likely To Be Earned correct? They don't seem very likely to me...

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Yes, LTBE is acronym for "Likely To Be Earned" and clearly there is no parameter around the word "likely" given how this concept is abused.

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I think that the Vikes have a higher payroll this year because they front loaded every signing bonus that they could. Like Winfield was one of the highest paid DBs this year (and increasing the top five average) because his signing bonus wasn't deferred.

 

Moss is gone. I agree that the story is over on that. But Red is getting off once again by not deferring Randy's signing bonus any further. That $36 million cap space is getting reduced without Red spending a nickel of his own.

 

So long Red! Sorry to see you leave so soon! :hoppingmad: :D:D

Edited by MikesVikes

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Winfield needs help in the secondary for sure. Brian Williams is a liability..... Russell & Chavous are too for that matter. Ty Law would be great signing.

 

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Ty Law would indeed be a terrific signing for the Vikes.

 

Me we soon be seeing the day when the Viking secondary (and defense in general) is a force to be reckoned with again?  You know, the pre Richard Solomon days.

 

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Please please please please please Tay Law. [crossingfingers]

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This is what suprises me the most about the Moss move.  People think that the offense will continue to move the football and just rack up points next year and that the only thing they need is defense.  After watching games last year without Moss, I will tell you that they have an entirely different offense without him, and Burleson scares no one.  They better put together a tough D, because that offense will not produce like it did last year.

 

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If the Defense can only get to "respectable" status, the offense will not HAVE to perform as it has. They put up over 500 points the past few years and missed the playoffs in 2003.

 

The offense may have been different, but it was certaintly more balanced and you can't argue with an average close to 30 points in Moss's absence.

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Keep that chin up Queens fans, I read where former #10 overall selection Travis 'stone hands' Taylor was in town for a visit. At least he's cheap.

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......Unsubtantiated rumor alert..........

 

From what I heard about Travis Taylor though, they would be expecting him to be our #3 receiver, and he is also well aware of that fact.

 

.......End unsubtantiated rumor alert........

 

And Plaxico's agent thinks he'd be a good fit for the Vikes as well. I'm not entirely enthralled with that idea though.

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......Unsubtantiated rumor alert..........

 

From what I heard about Travis Taylor though, they would be expecting him to be our #3 receiver, and he is also well aware of that fact.

 

.......End unsubtantiated rumor alert........

 

And Plaxico's agent thinks he'd be a good fit for the Vikes as well.  I'm not entirely enthralled with that idea though.

 

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According to KFAN, Tice and company are currently do personality checks to see if the Vikings think he will be a good fit for the Vikings. As of late I am not sure if they know what they are doing however.

Edited by Rebellab

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According to KFAN, Tice and company are currently do personality checks to see if the Vikings think he will be a good fit for the Vikings. 

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you mean seeing if his rap sheet is long enough ? :D

 

If they sign Taylor for more than $3.75 per hour it will be a waste of money.

 

Plaxico is a different story, I wouldn't mind seeing him in purple.

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According to KFAN, Tice and company are currently do personality checks to see if the Vikings think he will be a good fit for the Vikings.  As of late I am not sure if they know what they are doing however.

 

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My understanding of it was when Tice was asked about Taylor, he responded, he's here...but right now we're doing some character checks with some people around league on another player first. I took that to mean Burress.

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Taylor asked the Vikings if they wanted to take a look at him. Don't call us, we

'll call you. Tice did say that he thought Taylor was a good receiver stuck in a run oriented offense. But I don't know what else you could expect Tice to say in the papers.

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Update: After making the big splash with Fat Pat, the Vikings have done NOTHING.

 

They've lost out on a good LB in Pierce because Red didn't want to part with any money until late Summer.

 

They've lost their kicker in Feely.

 

They've looked at the WR market and will probably land the bust known as Travis Taylor only because he says he's willing to sign for less than market.

 

Wiggins is most likely gone because they're too *** cheap to resign him. Freddie Jones is being brought in for a look and will be signed if he comes cheaply.

 

No signs of needed players such as Surtain, Smoot, Law, Darius, etc.

 

Great Job Red! :D

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Not to play devil's advocate here or anything, but isn't Kleinsasser expected back from injury this season? He's a better blocker than Wiggins, and has shown the ability to be a pretty good receiver as well. Maybe I'm wrong about this, but if Jimmy is coming back at 100% this season, then what does Wiggins bring to the table that Kleinsasser doesn't?

 

Just wondering.

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Not to play devil's advocate here or anything, but isn't Kleinsasser expected back from injury this season?  He's a better blocker than Wiggins, and has shown the ability to be a pretty good receiver as well.  Maybe I'm wrong about this, but if Jimmy is coming back at 100% this season, then what does Wiggins bring to the table that Kleinsasser doesn't?

 

Just wondering.

 

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K-Sauce is the blocking TE. Wiggins is the receiving TE.

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