wildcat2334 Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 Even though me and Mrs UM go to at least 10 T-Wolves games per season, I find the NBAs star system extremely hard to swallow. It's abundantly clear that there's one law for the Kobes and the Shaqs and another for the peasants. Until the rules are applied absolutely equally by every ref AND the NBA make a declaration about it, I stand by my observation that the thing is corrupt. 1447314[/snapback] I am a hoops and NBA junkie- and I concur- the NBA star bias is bothering me more and more. After watching LBJ travel twice on his game winning drive against Wash- grrr- it is a huge negative to an overall excellent product. I think basketball and the NBA caters to the superstar call b/c of a few reasons, notably: These guysare superstars, rockstars, they sell tickets, refs are human, the best players are the aggressors, thus get the benefit of the doubt. Plus- there are so many split second decisions made by the refs at unreal speeds, it is the hardest sport to officiate BY FAR. I think the refs do an ok job at trying to even things out though. That being said, NBA refs have been bad and getting worse, no question. At the same time, I do not think it is any more corrupt than the NFL- Those calls in the Ind/Pitt game and the SB are far worse than any calls made in the NBA, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefjay Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 Yes it does. I didn't mean to sound snippy, but I used to ref soccer and if the rules aren't applied equally, then it's just a glorified workout. It bugs the heck out of me that there's an admitted system in a major sports league that gives preferential treatment to a subset of the players. 1448802[/snapback] I believe it happens in all major sports with the exception of individual sports like, Tennis, Golf, and bowling (For Puddy and CHUCKB) Hockey might be the exception but I know I've seen stars get away with things and have penalties called on others that barely breathe on them so I guess Hockey is guilty also but not just as much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefjay Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 I am a hoops and NBA junkie- and I concur- the NBA star bias is bothering me more and more. After watching LBJ travel twice on his game winning drive against Wash- grrr- it is a huge negative to an overall excellent product. I think basketball and the NBA caters to the superstar call b/c of a few reasons, notably: These guysare superstars, rockstars, they sell tickets, refs are human, the best players are the aggressors, thus get the benefit of the doubt. Plus- there are so many split second decisions made by the refs at unreal speeds, it is the hardest sport to officiate BY FAR. I think the refs do an ok job at trying to even things out though. That being said, NBA refs have been bad and getting worse, no question. At the same time, I do not think it is any more corrupt than the NFL- Those calls in the Ind/Pitt game and the SB are far worse than any calls made in the NBA, IMO. 1448831[/snapback] Come on, he only took 6 steps getting from the 3 pt line to the hoop without dribbling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clubfoothead Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Wow, this is about the best I've seen the NBA since Worthy, Maxwell, Ainge, Bird, Kareem, Magic, Cooper, Parrish DJ and AC Green graced our television sets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godtomsatan Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Wow, this is about the best I've seen the NBA since Worthy, Maxwell, Ainge, Bird, Kareem, Magic, Cooper, Parrish DJ and AC Green graced our television sets. 1449519[/snapback] From a purely entertainment standpoint, these playoffs (as I tried to say earlier) are fun so far. Could easily get boring, mind you, but the Clippers, the Lakers/Suns games, Bulls/Heat games....NBA action? It's Faaantastic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clubfoothead Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 From a purely entertainment standpoint, these playoffs (as I tried to say earlier) are fun so far. Could easily get boring, mind you, but the Clippers, the Lakers/Suns games, Bulls/Heat games....NBA action? It's Faaantastic! 1449529[/snapback] Boring only to the extent nobody will be able to stop the Mavs. A Clippers/Lakers series should be very fun to watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyalboyd Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 The NBA is no fun to watch to me. The underdawg almost never wins. U can predict who will be in the championship yr in and yr out. VS Football. We guess and can be totally wrong and someone raises from the dead and be highly competitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I am a hoops and NBA junkie- and I concur- the NBA star bias is bothering me more and more. After watching LBJ travel twice on his game winning drive against Wash- grrr- it is a huge negative to an overall excellent product. I think basketball and the NBA caters to the superstar call b/c of a few reasons, notably: These guysare superstars, rockstars, they sell tickets, refs are human, the best players are the aggressors, thus get the benefit of the doubt. Plus- there are so many split second decisions made by the refs at unreal speeds, it is the hardest sport to officiate BY FAR. I think the refs do an ok job at trying to even things out though. That being said, NBA refs have been bad and getting worse, no question. At the same time, I do not think it is any more corrupt than the NFL- Those calls in the Ind/Pitt game and the SB are far worse than any calls made in the NBA, IMO. 1448831[/snapback] It's not that the refs in the NBA are corrupt, necessarily, though I've seen calls that flat out make you wonder, it's that they're intimidated by both the stars and the league. Everything you say above about selling tickets, etc is true, but Shaq, for example, was always permitted to do whatever he wanted whereas another player doing that would foul out in 10 minutes. Bryant was on five fouls very early two nights ago and never did get the sixth, despite fouling at least twice - no calls. What a shock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godtomsatan Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Boring only to the extent nobody will be able to stop the Mavs. A Clippers/Lakers series should be very fun to watch. 1449530[/snapback] No, boring only in that the Spurs will keep moving on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godtomsatan Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 It's not that the refs in the NBA are corrupt, necessarily, though I've seen calls that flat out make you wonder, it's that they're intimidated by both the stars and the league. Everything you say above about selling tickets, etc is true, but Shaq, for example, was always permitted to do whatever he wanted whereas another player doing that would foul out in 10 minutes. Bryant was on five fouls very early two nights ago and never did get the sixth, despite fouling at least twice - no calls. What a shock. 1449698[/snapback] Shaq got ejected from a game vs. the Sonics three or four years ago fairly early in the game. Did people after the game call in the post-game show to talk about how awesome it was to beat the crap out of the Lakers? No, it was how ripped off they felt because the refs kicked him out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Boring only to the extent nobody will be able to stop the Mavs. 1449530[/snapback] No, boring only in that the Spurs will keep moving on. 1449708[/snapback] You are both obviously talking about success in the West and not overall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Men In Tights Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Boring only to the extent nobody will be able to stop the Mavs. A Clippers/Lakers series should be very fun to watch. 1449530[/snapback] As long as the Clippers win. I am sick and tired of the Lakers and that clown Kobe. What a great story for the Clippers if they could win that series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukon Cornelius Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 it was broke long ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montster Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 As long as the Clippers win. I am sick and tired of the Lakers and that clown Kobe. What a great story for the Clippers if they could win that series. 1450043[/snapback] +1 but hopefully the suns will win 2 more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 it was broke long ago 1450193[/snapback] Broke how exactly? NBA is ridiculously successsful on every level- It may not be as appealing to the older generation but the fact is basketball is global, growing and close to (if not already) passing soccer as the most played sport on the planet. NBA and David Stern are the model in which the NFL and MLB are trying to follow. The playoffs are awesome- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clubfoothead Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 You are both obviously talking about success in the West and not overall 1449971[/snapback] I was comparing the Spurs/Mavs round 2 seriers to the NFC Championship games of the mid 1990s. Under this scenario, the Pistons are the AFC Champs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 Broke how exactly? NBA is ridiculously successsful on every level- It may not be as appealing to the older generation but the fact is basketball is global, growing and close to (if not already) passing soccer as the most played sport on the planet. NBA and David Stern are the model in which the NFL and MLB are trying to follow. The playoffs are awesome- 1450880[/snapback] I can only imagine that this is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 Broke how exactly? NBA is ridiculously successsful on every level- It may not be as appealing to the older generation but the fact is basketball is global, growing and close to (if not already) passing soccer as the most played sport on the planet. NBA and David Stern are the model in which the NFL and MLB are trying to follow. The playoffs are awesome- 1450880[/snapback] I think this statement is pretty far off. The NFL is the league that everyone is trying to model after. The only good thing David Stern has done for the NBA is the age minimum and I could even see how that hurt the NBA and basketball as a whole. The NFL makes more money on TV deals than the NBA can imagine. The playoffs are so long; we are gonna be halfway into the summer when this thing is over with. The NFL markets its teams whereas the NBA is superstar crazy. I think the NBA has a lot of issues.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 I can only imagine that this is 1451642[/snapback] i don't fish...... NFL- excellent product all around, could use some tweaking. MLB- do not even get me started, an f ing joke all around baseball is my first love and I am done with these guys, I only pay attention due to fantasy purposes. I think the NBA is a leader as far as a few things...... Salary cap- MLB is trying like he11 to come around. Marketing-- Stars, the league on a national & global basis- both the NFL & MLB have followed suit on this. David Stern- you cannot tell me MLB & NFL did not use him as an example of how a commish should run a league- that guy is a genius, end of story. NFL tv revenues vs the NBA is apples & oranges, of course they dominate tv $$$, and NFL game & schedule is tailor made for tv- I prefer it to live anyway. I am a self admitted hoops fan, I just think they are the best athletes on the planet playing the best sport on the planet. I think there alot of things right with the NBA, and the league is as healthy as any, and will continue to grow like crazy...... Pretty damm cool when your hometown team makes a deep run into the NBA playoffs. As a Seattle fan with no titles since '79 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selly Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 I consider it broken when a college basketball fan like me (who's been watching college basketball for 25+ years) could hardly care less when those same players go to the NBA. The selective enforcement of rules and the general lack of a "team" game have driven me far, far away. The normal offense in the NBA is to clear out one side, let your "star" drive to the basket and he either get a dunk, layup or you hope he's a bigger star than the defender so he gets the blocking call. The first thing the NBA needs to do is to take a page from hockey and tell the officals to call all the infractions on everyone, no matter what. If Shaq fouls out in the 1st quarter (with the refs calling it by the book) then maybe he's not that good of a player, if AI gets 10 palming calls in a game, maybe he should learn how to dribble the ball. Every year I watch a few playoff games, just to see if they've changed, and every year I see pathetic calls like the end of the Heat-Lakers game 4, where the bigger media market, with the bigger so-called stars, gets the benefit of biased officiating. Until that stops, I continue to be done with the NBA and their product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 I consider it broken when a college basketball fan like me (who's been watching college basketball for 25+ years) could hardly care less when those same players go to the NBA. The selective enforcement of rules and the general lack of a "team" game have driven me far, far away. The normal offense in the NBA is to clear out one side, let your "star" drive to the basket and he either get a dunk, layup or you hope he's a bigger star than the defender so he gets the blocking call. The first thing the NBA needs to do is to take a page from hockey and tell the officals to call all the infractions on everyone, no matter what. If Shaq fouls out in the 1st quarter (with the refs calling it by the book) then maybe he's not that good of a player, if AI gets 10 palming calls in a game, maybe he should learn how to dribble the ball. Every year I watch a few playoff games, just to see if they've changed, and every year I see pathetic calls like the end of the Heat-Lakers game 4, where the bigger media market, with the bigger so-called stars, gets the benefit of biased officiating. Until that stops, I continue to be done with the NBA and their product. 1451812[/snapback] Well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 I consider it broken when a college basketball fan like me (who's been watching college basketball for 25+ years) could hardly care less when those same players go to the NBA. The selective enforcement of rules and the general lack of a "team" game have driven me far, far away. The normal offense in the NBA is to clear out one side, let your "star" drive to the basket and he either get a dunk, layup or you hope he's a bigger star than the defender so he gets the blocking call. The first thing the NBA needs to do is to take a page from hockey and tell the officals to call all the infractions on everyone, no matter what. If Shaq fouls out in the 1st quarter (with the refs calling it by the book) then maybe he's not that good of a player, if AI gets 10 palming calls in a game, maybe he should learn how to dribble the ball. Every year I watch a few playoff games, just to see if they've changed, and every year I see pathetic calls like the end of the Heat-Lakers game 4, where the bigger media market, with the bigger so-called stars, gets the benefit of biased officiating. Until that stops, I continue to be done with the NBA and their product. 1451812[/snapback] Selly- You are a Dinosaur! I love college ball also- while, NCAA ball is good, it is getting almost too diluted. How can you not enjoy the team ball being played by Dallas,Chicago, Phoenix, even Kobe, LBJ have been sharing the ball. I htink the NBA is heading into another golden era ala Bird/Magic, Jordan days. So many excellent young ballers, LBJ, Wade, Dirk, KObe- goes on and on- these playoffs have been FANTASTIC so far. Superstar bias has been around forever, and it unfortunately is part of the game- and I have news for ya- it happens in EVERY SPORT to a strong degree. MLB- you kidding me? Superstar bias goes on all the time. Clemes/Maddux/Pedro strike zones? same goes for Bonds, other tophitters who's zone mysteriously shrinks. NHL- care NFL- Geez I dunnno- could be the heading to be the worst of them all. Superstar calls happen all the time- it is just not as noticeable. Irvin/Rice, NEVER getting an offensive PI called- vice versa for top DB's. Top O lineman get a huge benefit of the doubt on holding calls- goes on and on. The Indy/Pitt game was an ABSOULTE FARCE- the refs tried handing the game to INDY!! I will NEVER understand the Poly int being reversed. The SB? Unreal- you tellin gme there was no bias in thata game?? gimme a break- the refs were influenced by Bettis, all the Pitt BS, and the game was affected by it. That is one beatuiful thing the NBA gets right....... There may be a some bias- BUT THE BEST TEAM WINS THE TITLE- they earn it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goopster24 Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 There may be a some bias- BUT THE BEST TEAM WINS THE TITLE- they earn it. 1453829[/snapback] There's no point to root for an underdog in the NBA. Within a seven game series, the best team will literally always win. March Madness is so amazing for that very reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 Selly- You are a Dinosaur! I love college ball also- while, NCAA ball is good, it is getting almost too diluted. How can you not enjoy the team ball being played by Detroit, San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, Phoenix, even Kobe, LBJ have been sharing the ball. I htink the NBA is heading into another golden era ala Bird/Magic, Jordan days. So many excellent young ballers, Chauncey, Parker, LBJ, Wade, Dirk, KObe- goes on and on- these playoffs have been FANTASTIC so far. Superstar bias has been around forever, and it unfortunately is part of the game- and I have news for ya- it happens in EVERY SPORT to a strong degree. 1453829[/snapback] Fixed to add teams that are the ultimate in playing the game properly. Other than that, I agree... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted May 5, 2006 Share Posted May 5, 2006 Rajah should have kicked Kobe in the balls as well as hauled him down by the neck. Lo and behold, the following game, Kobe elbows his opponent in the face AGAIN. Lo and behold, no call. What a f'n shock. If I'd been the Phoenix manager, I'd have gone to Phil Jackson and told him he had one chance to rein Kobe in or my #12 guy was going to cripple him for the rest of the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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