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rattsass

Let me be one of the first to point this out..........

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I think 7th or 8th round will be right for Kitna. I think he gets taken in the 5th and 6th in most redrafts though.

 

 

Just a case of "who blinks first."

 

I would hate to draft him too high, just because of the pummeling he will take. Hopefully others will think that way too.

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Has there ever been a QB like Jon Kitna in terms of good fantasy stats not translating to real world results???

 

As good of numbers as he will put him next year, he is as equally bad as a winning QB in the NFL. You can blame it on the Lions, but he isn't winning games for any club he plays for.

 

This dude had a nice fantasy season last year, and is looking for another strong year next year, yet he is not a good QB. I would have zero confidence going into a season with Kitna as my starter to win football games.

 

His ablility to force throws and throw timely INT's at the 5 yard line is uncanny.

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First, I'm well aware of the fact that leagues vary in size, scoring, and roster requirements which impact draft strategy. (note to self: Never ever include my league as an example)

Second, salary cap contract leagues are way over the head of about 25% of the managers in my main league, but I like the concept.

Third, thank you for your answer.

Fourth, I agree with your conclusion based on your redraft league.

 

 

Kum Bah Yah

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Has there ever been a QB like Jon Kitna in terms of good fantasy stats not translating to real world results???

 

 

 

 

Mike "Pit Bull" Vick?

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I looked at the teams Detroit faced last year, their average passing yds allowed and avg passing TDs allowed:

 

Team Yds TDs

Seattle 203.5 23

Chicago 194.8 18

Green Bay 206.8 25

St. Louis 189.7 21

Minnesota 238.6 15

Buffalo 188.7 18

New York (A) 201.4 19

Atlanta 229.2 20

San Francisco 223.2 25

Arizona 230.9 21

Miami 187.9 22

New England 200.2 10

Minnesota 238.6 15

Green Bay 206.8 25

Chicago 194.8 18

Dallas 219.1 25

 

Total --- 3354.2 yds ---- 320 TDs

 

And then I looked at the teams he will face in 2007. I used 2006 stats, however, so feel free to adjust if you think a team got better or worse at stopping the pass:

 

Team Yds TDs

Oakland 150.8 17

Minnesota 238.6 15

Philadelphia 191.7 17

Chicago 194.8 18

Washington 218.2 30

Tampa Bay 209.6 26

Chicago 194.8 18

Denver 213.1 13

Arizona 230.9 21

New York (N) 228.1 21

Green Bay 206.8 25

Minnesota 238.6 15

Dallas 219.1 25

San Diego 200.8 19

Kansas City 208.4 18

Green Bay 206.8 25

 

Totals ---- 3351.1 yds ----- 323 TDs

 

So it does not appear like he'll be facing a stiffer opposition than he faced last year. Time will tell...

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Detroit ditched the run last year. I know they got behind a lot of games and played catch up, but they passed exclusively even while in games. I would be very cautious even expecting the same #s from Kitna if Detroit can restore the balance somewhat.

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Has there ever been a QB like Jon Kitna in terms of good fantasy stats not translating to real world results???

 

As good of numbers as he will put him next year, he is as equally bad as a winning QB in the NFL. You can blame it on the Lions, but he isn't winning games for any club he plays for.

 

This dude had a nice fantasy season last year, and is looking for another strong year next year, yet he is not a good QB. I would have zero confidence going into a season with Kitna as my starter to win football games.

 

His ablility to force throws and throw timely INT's at the 5 yard line is uncanny.

 

 

Daunte Culpepper,Mike Vick, Steve Deberg come to mind. to many people blame the QB for a system flaw or horrible blocking. I think that is what is happening here in your judgement of Kitna. winning is NOT a way to judge QB's. wins is how you judge the team. remember this danielson.

 

Detroit ditched the run last year. I know they got behind a lot of games and played catch up, but they passed exclusively even while in games. I would be very cautious even expecting the same #s from Kitna if Detroit can restore the balance somewhat.

 

 

It is funny how some people say they ran Kevin Jones into the ground and others say they ditched the run.our defense was just completely horrible last year and put our offense in bad positions on the field. hopefully that won't happen this year...but we are talking about my Lions. :D

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Daunte Culpepper,Mike Vick, Steve Deberg come to mind. to many people blame the QB for a system flaw or horrible blocking. I think that is what is happening here in your judgement of Kitna. winning is NOT a way to judge QB's. wins is how you judge the team. remember this danielson.

 

 

 

 

Please. Kitna constantly self destructs and has proven over this career he does not win games, and is not a good QB .period. Whether he is in a good system surrounded by talent or in Det. He is a limited QB that is a journeyman in this league.

 

Now put him in Det in an always coming from behind situation- and he will put up decent numbers fantasy-wise. Football-wise any team rolling him out as their #1 guy for week 1 is automatically not looking to challenge for the playoffs, and will likely be drafting highly in the following draft.

 

TD - 129

INT - 126

76.1

 

have fun

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Now put him in Det in an always coming from behind situation- and he will put up decent numbers fantasy-wise.

 

 

 

Approx. 5TH best FF QB is much better than decent.

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Now put him in Det in an always coming from behind situation- and he will put up decent numbers fantasy-wise.

 

Detroit wasn't always coming from behind last year though. Detroit lost four games in which they had the lead going into the 4th quarter.

 

Kitna is a fine QB between the 20's in ordinary situations. He's terrible in the red zone. He's terrible in pressure situations. He is turnover and mistake prone.

 

Kitna is a good second tier QB FF-wise. He's not a winner on the field. Those who look at Detroit and say that QB is not a problem are wrong.

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Kitna is a fine QB between the 20's in ordinary situations. He's terrible in the red zone.

 

Think that might change a bit with ROY on one side and CJ on the other? :D

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Please. Kitna constantly self destructs and has proven over this career he does not win games, and is not a good QB .period. Whether he is in a good system surrounded by talent or in Det. He is a limited QB that is a journeyman in this league.

 

 

 

 

Has Kitna ever been in a situation where there wasn't undue burdon placed on him, due to the limitations of teams he is playing for?

 

I'm not saying the guy is a great quarterback. He isn't. But win or lose, the guy is a gamer. And you give me a "gamer" with Martz callin in the plays, and I will take my numbers to the bank.

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I'm not saying the guy is a great quarterback. He isn't. But win or lose, the guy is a gamer. And you give me a "gamer" with Martz callin in the plays, and I will take my numbers to the bank.

 

 

 

What's a "gamer?"

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What's a "gamer?"

 

 

He leaves it all on the field. It is the opposite of Randy Moss.

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He leaves it all on the field.

 

Well, all to frequently he leaves the ball on the field to be picked up by others.

 

Or he throws the ball, leaving it in the hands of a defensive player.

 

Effort has its worth for sure, but it doesn't replace talent, particularly at QB.

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Well, all to frequently he leaves the ball on the field to be picked up by others.

 

Or he throws the ball, leaving it in the hands of a defensive player.

 

Effort has its worth for sure, but it doesn't replace talent, particularly at QB.

 

 

I understand your bitterness as a Lions fan. But lets face it. Kitna is the best you have had in a while. Interceptions will be thrown in the Mike Martz offense. There is no debate about that. Lets see if the Lions can hold a few opponents under 40 this season, and maybe that offense can win them some games.

 

Ahhh who am I kidding............

Edited by rattsass

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I understand your bitterness as a Lions fan.

 

Bitterness? It's not bitterness.

 

It's despair.

 

In any event, it has nothing to do with Kitna being a mediocre quarterback.

 

 

 

 

 

:D

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Please. Kitna constantly self destructs and has proven over this career he does not win games, and is not a good QB .period. Whether he is in a good system surrounded by talent or in Det. He is a limited QB that is a journeyman in this league.

 

Now put him in Det in an always coming from behind situation- and he will put up decent numbers fantasy-wise. Football-wise any team rolling him out as their #1 guy for week 1 is automatically not looking to challenge for the playoffs, and will likely be drafting highly in the following draft.

 

TD - 129

INT - 126

76.1

 

have fun

 

 

The average ranking of his teams defenses the years he was a starter was 23rd in the league. you win in this league with defense. I know you may never understand this..but it is fact.

 

I mean I know Kitna is not the leagues best. but he is a decent QB. and QB is not even close to being 1 of our biggest problems.

 

 

Detroit wasn't always coming from behind last year though. Detroit lost four games in which they had the lead going into the 4th quarter.

 

Kitna is a fine QB between the 20's in ordinary situations. He's terrible in the red zone. He's terrible in pressure situations. He is turnover and mistake prone.

 

Kitna is a good second tier QB FF-wise. He's not a winner on the field. Those who look at Detroit and say that QB is not a problem are wrong.

 

 

No ,the people who are wrong are the 1's who think a QB can make up for a bad line and no defense.

 

Has Kitna ever been in a situation where there wasn't undue burdon placed on him, due to the limitations of teams he is playing for?

 

I'm not saying the guy is a great quarterback. He isn't. But win or lose, the guy is a gamer. And you give me a "gamer" with Martz callin in the plays, and I will take my numbers to the bank.

 

He has always been in tough situations..in Seattle it was amazing he did not leave every game hurt as bad as that line was.

 

Well, all to frequently he leaves the ball on the field to be picked up by others.

 

Or he throws the ball, leaving it in the hands of a defensive player.

 

Effort has its worth for sure, but it doesn't replace talent, particularly at QB.

 

Talent..you mean like Harrinton had?...or Chuck Long..Andre Ware? what is this talent that you speak of? Michael Vick is the most talented QB in the league....how well has that done for him?

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The average ranking of his teams defenses the years he was a starter was 23rd in the league. you win in this league with defense. I know you may never understand this..but it is fact.

 

 

 

 

whatever. I watched him enough in Seattle and Cin, thanks. Fantasy numbers aside- how many teams would roll him out as their #1 next year besides Martz & Det- not many. He should be thankful he is in Det

 

He is a good #2 and spot starter

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whatever. I watched him enough in Seattle and Cin, thanks. Fantasy numbers aside- how many teams would roll him out as their #1 next year besides Martz & Det- not many. He should be thankful he is in Det

 

He is a good #2 and spot starter

 

 

:D OK. that is good enough for me. :D

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Talent..you mean like Harrinton had?...or Chuck Long..Andre Ware? what is this talent that you speak of? Michael Vick is the most talented QB in the league....how well has that done for him?

 

 

 

Vick is the most athletic QB in the league. He is far from the most talented.

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Vick is the most athletic QB in the league. He is far from the most talented.

 

 

 

What can anyone else do physically that he cannot?

 

Definition:Natural endowment or ability of a superior quality.

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What can anyone else do physically that he cannot?

 

Definition:Natural endowment or ability of a superior quality.

 

 

You're caught up on the physical ability part. Vick has problems with the routine:

 

throw and complete a forward pass; read a defense; make good decisions; lead a team to a come from behind win; manage a game.

 

A baseball outfielder who can't catch a fly ball isn't talented no matter how fast he can run or how strong his arm is.

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You're caught up on the physical ability part. Vick has problems with the routine:

 

throw and complete a forward pass; read a defense; make good decisions; lead a team to a come from behind win; manage a game.

 

A baseball outfielder who can't catch a fly ball isn't talented no matter how fast he can run or how strong his arm is.

 

 

 

OK

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