Bill Swerski Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Swerski , you gonna take that ? Um, I actually agree with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBoog Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 We have no illegals working for us, and to my knowledge, we've only had one work for us in that I know of, and when we found out his documentation was bogus, we fired him and notified INS. We need to build a freaking wall, and make it harder to get into this country illegally, and then we need to turn around and make it easier for Mexicans to get into the country legally so that they are paying taxes. In case you haven't noticed their is a real shortage of unskilled labor in this country, now that you can no longer fail people in high school, too many people are going to college. We could actually kill wellfarfe as we know it and force those already here, sucking on the taxpayer boobie, back to work or starve to death. BUt, survival of the fittest doesn't count anymore!?!? (I am referring to the able bodies and not those who need real help) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 I still don't get how you can claim welfare without presenting government issued ID. I don't get how people can demand in-state tuition rates or driving licenses for illegal immigrants and yet keep a straight face. It's flat out ludicrous that illegal immigration isn't treated as the crime it is and those aiding and abetting it aren't prosecuted too. What am I missing here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 (edited) sweet, a pragmatic bipartisan solution to a pressing problem gets shot down by extremists from both fringes, so that we can.....continue to do absolutely nothing about it and just bicker about who is to blame. what a great day for america! Edited June 29, 2007 by Azazello1313 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukon Cornelius Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 We could actually kill wellfarfe as we know it and force those already here, sucking on the taxpayer boobie, back to work or starve to death. BUt, survival of the fittest doesn't count anymore!?!? (I am referring to the able bodies and not those who need real help) what about big corps ... they need welfare 2 dos cerveza por favor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 I love Mexicans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 sweet, a pragmatic bipartisan solution to a pressing problem gets shot down by extremists from both fringes, so that we can.....continue to do absolutely nothing about it and just bicker about who is to blame. what a great day for america! Uh, have you actually paid attention to this bill at all, or are you just here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Wrong, we have both. Even if the employment laws were actually enforced, the drug cartels would continue to send their people here. Enforcing the employment laws would GREATLY decrease the demand for immigrants, leaving them the option of being poor and unemployed in Mexico or being poor and unemployABLE here. The former is a better option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 I still don't get how you can claim welfare without presenting government issued ID. I don't get how people can demand in-state tuition rates or driving licenses for illegal immigrants and yet keep a straight face. It's flat out ludicrous that illegal immigration isn't treated as the crime it is and those aiding and abetting it aren't prosecuted too. What am I missing here? Something we actually agree on that is political in nature. Amazing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Something we actually agree on that is political in nature. Amazing! I'm pretty sure there are far more things than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBoog Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 I still don't get how you can claim welfare without presenting government issued ID. I don't get how people can demand in-state tuition rates or driving licenses for illegal immigrants and yet keep a straight face. It's flat out ludicrous that illegal immigration isn't treated as the crime it is and those aiding and abetting it aren't prosecuted too. What am I missing here? As a response to the "something agree about" thing in the other post above. I have found Ursa to be one of the reasonable "radical lefties" I have ever known! I too am often surprised by how much common ground we share politically. 100% with you here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 (edited) Enforcing the employment laws would GREATLY decrease the demand for immigrants, leaving them the option of being poor and unemployed in Mexico or being poor and unemployABLE here. The former is a better option. Given that the Mexican police are being bought off by the cartels to provide assistance in moving their product into the states, it's obvious that not everybody from down there is coming here to work a legitimate job. They may be in the vast minority, but Mexican gang members are causing a ton of problems here. You have to go with the two-tiered approach. The governent doesn't have the infrastructure or money to enforce the employment laws efficiently. A LOT of illegals are going to slip through the cracks. Edited June 29, 2007 by Bill Swerski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 You have to go with the two-tiered approach. Even if legislation to enforce employment laws were passed, enforcing it successfully would be a completely different story. Why would we have to legislate enforcement of existing laws? The only change would be the repurcussions of the laws. I maintain that if business owners have to face REAL jail time for knowingly employing illegals, the demand for illegal labor goes WAY down. Of course, then costs in certain sectors of the economy would go way up, but I find it hard to have much sympathy for someone who would essentially be whining "I need to engage in illegal acts for my business to be profitable and competitive." Different matter entirely from illegals doing illegal things - put them in prison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 (edited) Why would we have to legislate enforcement of existing laws? The only change would be the repurcussions of the laws. My mistake. Corrected above. I maintain that if business owners have to face REAL jail time for knowingly employing illegals, the demand for illegal labor goes WAY down. Sure it does, but enforcing those laws is going to be incredibly difficult. How long to you suppose the government will take to look at the hiring records of every single business in the country? How easy is it going to be to prove that an illegal works for a company when no paperwork is done and the person is paid in cash? And, again, how is this going to keep the drug smugglers out of the country? Enforcement of the hiring laws is necessary. But people need to be physically stopped from coming across the border as well. They need many more border patrol agents for starters. Different matter entirely from illegals doing illegal things - put them in prison. Judges tend not to put illegals in prison. Look at all of the stories of illegals who finally get thrown in prison after their third DUI. Plus, our prisons don't have room for another 12 million people. Edited June 29, 2007 by Bill Swerski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 how is this going to keep the drug smugglers out of the country? Enforcement of the hiring laws is necessary. But people need to be physically stopped from coming across the border as well. They need many more border patrol agents for starters. Judges tend not to put illegals in prison. Look at all of the stories of illegals who finally get thrown in prison after their third DUI. Plus, our prisons don't have room for another 12 million people. Legalize drugs. Another problem solved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
untateve Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 My mistake. Corrected above. Sure it does, but enforcing those laws is going to be incredibly difficult. How long to you suppose the government will take to look at the hiring records of every single business in the country? How easy is it going to be to prove that an illegal works for a company when no paperwork is done and the person is paid in cash? And, again, how is this going to keep the drug smugglers out of the country? Enforcement of the hiring laws is necessary. But people need to be physically stopped from coming across the border as well. They need many more border patrol agents for starters. Judges tend not to put illegals in prison. Look at all of the stories of illegals who finally get thrown in prison after their third DUI. Plus, our prisons don't have room for another 12 million people. FYI - it's extremely rare that anyone does jail time for a first DUI. it's still rare for anyone to do significant time for a second DUI. In Florida, a DUI does not become a felony until the third DUI. It is only then that someone can be sentenced to prison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 FYI - it's extremely rare that anyone does jail time for a first DUI. it's still rare for anyone to do significant time for a second DUI. In Florida, a DUI does not become a felony until the third DUI. It is only then that someone can be sentenced to prison. Illegals who are arrested here for DUI have broken a federal law before even putting the key in the ignition. If deportation is out of the question, I don't see why it should take three DUIs for them to see jail time. Legalize drugs. Another problem solved. I'm not going to touch that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
untateve Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Illegals who are arrested here for DUI have broken a federal law before even putting the key in the ignition. If deportation is out of the question, I don't see why it should take three DUIs for them to see jail time. In Florida, the first two DUIs are only misdemeanors. This means that the absolute longest amount of time that a defendant could be sentenced to is one year in jail. A judge could not sentence anyone to a longer term than this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Like Soup Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Close. Ronald Reagan. He did give amnesty back in the 80's. I blame it on Polk (D) back in 1848 when we gave Mexico back after we beat up on them in the Mexican-American war. I'm sure there are way more illegals in your neck of the woods than here in Arizona. Surely we beat them! In Florida, the first two DUIs are only misdemeanors. This means that the absolute longest amount of time that a defendant could be sentenced to is one year in jail. A judge could not sentence anyone to a longer term than this. Here in Arizona, it is a mandatory 10 day jail sentence on your first DUI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clubfoothead Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 sweet, a pragmatic bipartisan solution to a pressing problem gets shot down by extremists from both fringes, so that we can.....continue to do absolutely nothing about it and just bicker about who is to blame. what a great day for america! Sounded like bloated, inefficient, expensive big government that, based on past amnesty programs, wouldn't have worked anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 We should pull our troops out of Iraq and protect our own borders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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